Everyone who lives near me and can afford it seems to be sending their kids to private schools…

[sanssucre]

That's it really, I guess I've just been really surprised that none of them has even considered the local primary schools. DD will start school next year and I'd just always assumed she would go to one of the decent primary schools nearby (there are several and I'm confident we'll get into one).

Thing is, we could actually afford to go private (it would mean some sacrifices but it's do-able), we've just always wanted her to have local friends, go to a nearby school, mix with a wide variety of people etc so I haven't explored the independent option at all. However, in all honesty, the fact that so many people in a similar financial situation to ours haven't even bothered to look round the state primaries is making me wonder if I'm being hopelessly optimistic. But seriously, is it really worth spending thousands of pounds a term to teach a 4/5/6-year-old? I'm not being sarcastic or judgy, it's a genuine question, I just honestly want to know what can be so terrible about a reasonable state primary school that so many people wouldn't even give it a second look.

I appreciate that my post might raise a few heckles. I know we're very fortunate to be able to afford private education if that is the way we choose to go. I also understand that this is a very contentious/emotive issue but I'd be really grateful for some honest opinions.

MammyT if they didn't spend so much on private education they would be able afford a nice place in France to get away to :)

Eek, I had no idea about CPs being like that - learn so much on MN

SpottyFrocks, absolutely. Hence a passionate bunch of PTA parents fundraising for said extra resources. Also totally get your earlier post about avoiding an exam-factory state school in favour of relaxed indie: would have done the same in your shoes. We had the luxury of un-pressured state and indie on our doorstep, but the state was less bland in this case.

Not always true you can choose an independent school with ethos/curriculum to suit, btw - so far have hunted around for that kind of secondary within reach and failed miserably

I think you have to:

1. explore the complete options. I know state schools that are run like independents, have cohorts coming from a small exclusive catchment, high exclusion rates and as such run the school like a high achieving academic independent with similar results. I know state schools which aim to work on the whole child and promote social inclusion. Conversely I also know independents that run their schools as academic achivement schools and others that go for the social family developmental approach.

2 kids are individuals. Some kids will thrive in an environment of high academic pressure others will go off the rails due to being at the bottom of the pile and being unable to develop a sense of self worth in the light of academia being the rewarded holy frail. Others will go off the rails if theyre given the social approach and widening horizons due to cruising and not being pushed academically.

At the end of the day you totally have to know where you think your child will fit. I have come across children that have thrived in both systems and failed in both systems. Its about matching your child to the best fit system. If you can afford it and its right for your kid do it. If not then look for a school that will match your ethos your childs ethos and go with it.

My child is gifted in many areas but she personally is not switched onto academia. She's a creative bunny at heart. I gave her the option of going for the 11+ exam (we have some state run grammar schools here) and she point blank refused stating she'd deliberately flunk the exams as she had her eyes set of the secondary (which is not too bad a school).

Talk to your childs teachers with an open mind and dont follow the herd either way do what youfeel is right.

At the end of the day you know your kid best and know if they will thrive best in a high, medium or low pressure environment

cobbsie Serious question: there are always discussions on here about choosing a school to match the child, the individualism of children, choosing a school that has an ethos that will enable your child to flourish etc.

However, this is a peculiarly British obsession isn't it? In most countries, there is no school choice, you simply go to the local school. Most of these countries seem to do pretty well at the primary and secondary level too - better than the UK at any rate (which isn't hard.)

How would you square this? That we live in a country with seemingly endless choice at the primary and secondary level, and yet we have poorer levels of attainment than countries where there is none.

Sanssucre, here it goes, our DS 16 year old now now going trough GCSC in our local grammar school, exclusively state educated, he went trough six years of inner city London very mediocre primary school, did him no harm, first module of his of GCSC(four A* and two A) hopping for the same for second module. We had all faith in state educational system and it paid of. Worth saying he is a very bright and hard working young man, lot of it has got to do with a child himself, natural ability and will to preform. our second Dd five in August she will be is at a private very good local school, she would have gone the same route as our eldest, but she is different child all together, just as bright, but not as confident and we felt would be better off in smaller class( on of eight). Different people have different reasons for sending there children to private school, all need to be respected, it is up to parents to make this difficult decision and to make sure it is the right one for there child. We are very much so very working class family who trough sheer hard work can afford to educate our youngest privately and send our eldest to one of top preforming colleges in the country. Private or state, children need all the help and support they can get from there family, sending them to private school alone and thinking that will be enough to produce well rounded and intellectual young person is not the case. Lastly visit all schools in the area get the feel and follow trough one which seems right for you child.

Cortina in those circumstances you'd ship out to dame alice or bedford modern...

Hail, cobbsie, on the continent child start primary education at age of 7, had a chance to play and enjoy proper childhood, has not been chewed up by school work and rules at the age of four, such a child is much more likely to flourish and attain higher. Fully agree with you on this only British obsession about private vs state education for " four year old",I think parents on the continent they themselves got the life that they are living to the full unlike us.

Hope everyone understood my post re CP was observational only. It is not something we do every half term in addition to beach and skiing. We are off to Norfolk on hols this year!

zlaya If it had been your eldest who was sensitive and needed a private school with small classes...would you have put the younger one through too even if they didn't need it?

Reason I ask is bcause my DDs are like your DC in that one...(the elder)....would not have thrived in the state school at all but my younger would be fine...however...as my elder is in a lovely private school I cant very well say to the younger one "Ok..you're tougher...state for you!"

Can I? I think its all for one and one for all.

I think its important to observe child individually properly, no need paying against the odds if a child would do just as well in state school, for our eldest would have been wast of money, he got what he needed in the school that he was. State school it was and it still is the right choice we made for him, our youngest would have probably be fine in the state school around here, but our circumstances changed in the past few years( both of us have to work full time) and school where she is provides us with early and late stays. Answer to your question is no, I would not put both of them trough private schooling, unless it was really needed and yes "you are tougher state school is for you". "you can go that extra mile and surface on top" that is exactly what I always told my eldest one and he thrived.

As far as I can see, lots of people who send their children to private schools have personal and perfectly valid reasons for doing so. Which is fine. But which need not be a reason why the OP, who has no such personal reasons, should feel peer pressured into choosing a private school just because her friends have done so.

Both my dcs attend state school. Their schools are not dull as ditch water (especially not dd's secondary), they do not smell of poo and they do provide a stimulating learning experience. But I am very happy that dd is learning that you don't need a lot of money to have an intellectually exciting time; she and her friends seem to manage it despite being from families of modest incomes.

Yes I agree Cory - there are lots of possibly valid reasons for going private, but as you say OP was referring to people who don't even visit or consider local state options. Which I think is weird and dubious. I wouldn't criticise anyone if they've got good reasons, but not to even visit does suggest prejudice. My neighbour said it wasn't worth visiting our local because it's an 'inner city primary school'. In the end she only visited the chosen private school (hellhole in my opinion but I'm obsessive about having some outside space) and no others because it was nearest her office and she didn't have time to see any others. Even on a purely financial level it's odd to make an investment of quarter of a million pounds (two kids) on such a basis. Esp for an economist.

I think state education is variable (as is private) which is why you can have two schools within walking distance of each other getting very different results. On the continent malinois perhaps there aren't such big variations between schools. And the entry requirements are much higher to become a teacher and teachers aren't bound by government legislation. Just a few of the reasons education is so much better than ours...

Where on earth does anyone get the idea that on the continent teachers aren't bound by government legislation and schools aren't variable in quality??!!! My family's experience of French education certainly isn't that all schools are equally good, and in France, the government are proud to know exactly what all French children are doing at a particular time of the day. And there are a lot of bored, switched off French schoolchildren, too... I seriously doubt any other European country is a paragon of virtue on the education front - all countries have their issues.

Yes, Magdalene I agree on the continent majority schools preform on par(well), unlike in UK it is apparent a lot of it is to do with where you live, postcode is crucial.

I'd be interested to see the evidence that the majority of schools on the continent perform well... or is this just an assumption?

I've heard an awful lot of German people complain about their education system, too.

Both the local town schools have wraparound & holiday care options on site. However, wraparound almost unheard of among village schools in surrounding area.

I have DC at private & state primaries, the state primary is bigger & therefore has resources to do more interesting things (imho).

OP: I suggest that you look around state options and if any of them appeal then go for it. Like you said, why pay if you'd be satisfied with free? I'm sure you could switch later, if you want.

Rbbitstew, no not just an assumption, my 16 year old went to Germany last year on high school student exchange and was totally bowled over by standards of education German youngsters of the same age have. All of them spoke excellent English, grammatically correct, my boy could just about string of few words in German to be understood, as for Germans complaints about there education system, you have to understand this is the nation which strives perfection.

And what sort of school did he go to, zlaya? Or are you saying he attended all types of German secondary school in many areas?

He went and stayed with family in Cologne, I think local secondary school was equivalent to grammar school, it was a state school, he came into contact with lot of young people who attended that school.

But zlaya, what German children are like at a Gymnasium is no indication of what they are like in other secondary schools and no indication of what German schools are like throughout the country, in different socio-economic areas.

I agree with you on that one and I am not claiming that all of German children are on the same level, but going by what my son told me surely sounds impressive, our boy is at local grammar school and his knowledge of German is nowhere near as good as there knowledge of English, as for different socio-economic areas of Germany all I know Germans unlike us brits do not have such a prominent class society and majority of german children are state educate it.

There is an exceptionally good reason for intelligent German people to learn English to a very high standard. There is far less of an argument for English people to learn German.

That just makes all of us lazy, cos we seem to have very bad attitude towards learning foreign languages. Personally I would love for my two children to have a better command of several foreign languages in the world they are growing up to live, Europe will be a very different place where knowing how to speak your own language it is not going to be enough.