my dd didnt get into any of preffered schools and was offered place in very crapy school,please help,what to do?

[helenbicari]

Hi, I just received letter from school addmission and my dd not only didnt get into first choice school, she didnt get into any preffered schools and was offered placel in the worst school in our borough,Im soo upset, crying all day as i made all the effort,even moved closer to the school and missed the place by 0.018 mil. the school she got place offered is over a mile from my house and i have a sick husband, who has a back problem, one year old baby and cant drive,so i really dont know how would i manage to take her there every day,cos my husband cant help either with walking her there or looking after the baby. im going to appeal for the school, but can anyone give me some tips, how to build a strong case, cos i dont know if what i just has described will be enough. also im thinking to contact MP and if nothing helps, im gonna home school her until she gets place in a good school. do you think thats a good idea? i just dont want her to go to that school, the ofsted is 3 and i just really hate that school

No one has been harsh really, op has had lots of good advice but is very vague about her situation quite frankly.

everyone is not harsh to the OP, just trying to point out that if she is going to panel, she will need a better take than just "my dd deserves a better school than other children because I care!" there is simply no way a panel is going to accept that having a determined parent makes a child more deserving- why should they?

so, OP, you need to concentrate on what is special about your dd- why would she (rather than all the other children on the waiting list) benefit particularly from this particular school; don't knock the other school, don't talk in general terms about it being a better school, but seize on anything about the school that would be particularly beneficial to your dd because of her particular weaknesses or abilities.

Good luck!

@ballstoit: "Saracen, The op would be choosing to HE because her DD didn't get into the school she wanted her to go to. Her concerns for her DD were that she would not do as well academically and that she would be at risk of bullying at the 'crappy' school. In light of these concerns, my comments about a choice to HE were valid.

Educating a child at home when you are caring for another adult and a younger child would be a tough choice, particularly if you think it would be an effort to walk a couple of miles a day for the sake of your child's education."

I'm afraid I still don't agree with any of your concerns. If home education were a difficult thing to do, if it required bucketloads of time and commitment, then your worries would be valid.

But this is not true. If you haven't tried it, it is difficult to appreciate just how easy it can be. It need not take much time and can fit in seamlessly around other commitments because it can be done at whatever times suit the family. They can choose not to do any formal learning at all, which makes it even easier.

Many families say it takes much less time and effort to home educate than to send a child to school.

That makes it an excellent short-term solution to a crisis.

I haven't managed to read all the posts, but I just wanted to add some possible reassurance.

Our dd1 went to the local Ofsted Outstanding primary school for nursery and reception. People pay a premium to live in the catchment area, and queue from 4am the morning nursery registration opens [shocked]. Our dd had an ok time there, buy made no progress with her reading. I went in and spoke to her teacher on a number of occassions, but she wouldn't acknowledge there was a problem. Added to that, they refused to offer hot lunches or after school care (despite having 400+ pupils) as they said they had no need. They had no interest in what parents thought, as it was an Outstanding school, and there are plenty of people who would love their children to go there .

In the end, I moved her to a village school. The ofsted wasn't as good, but within a couple of weeks, her learning difficulties had been identified and she was receiving 5 weekly interventions. The head teacher is interested in what parents think, and I am happier as a working parent as they offer hot meals and after school care.

What I'm saying is, please give the other school a chance. Ofsted ratings are not everything!

I agree with 'cupofteaplease' (great name for a sunday morning). We have just moved house into an area that has 6 primary schools- four of which were 'outstanding' - one 'good' and one had been given 'notice to improve' by Ofsted at its last inspection. Of course we could not get two places (yr 5 and yr3) for my children in any of the schools other than the last one.

we went and had a look around and was very impressed- the head had been brought in specifically to 'improve'- it was our only option so we put the boys in- albeit a bit worried that they would not make much progression.

We were very wrong to assume this, it has been the best choice we have ever made for our kids, both have progressed massively, with DS1 going to the local secondary school one day a week to do literacy. Wonderful opportunities and they are both enjoying learning.

OP, how far is your preferred school away from you? Is it literally just around the corner? If so I would spend all my time In the local playground finding out who got in and where they live! however, if it is a faith school then I guess they will have additional conditions for entry which does not have distance as the highest factor.

Sorry I Haven't read every thread!

"I would spend all my time In the local playground finding out who got in and where they live"

Er.... why???

ScarlettWalking Vague! How has OP been vague! She has even said what area it is! And probably doesn't want to give even more detailed info because it would make her identifiable on here to anyone who knows her. We already know her husband is sick and the ages of her 2 children. That combined with the area and that fact that she didn't get into any of her 4 choices makes her easy to identify if someone on here is a friend of hers. We are all entitled to privacy on here whilst still getting help.

Yes, Plop, its all been utterly clear to me too... I've had the feeling some posters were sizing up for a bun fight with helenbicari because they disagree with what she is doing....and chasing more ammo to do it with.

Hmm. I have to say I was a bit puzzled by someone being prepared to give all that detail about themslves but not being prepared to say what she didn't like about the school she had been allocated.

If being allocated a "satisfactory' school that wasn't the one she wanted made her cry all day she must have had strong reasone - why wouldn't she share them with the people she was asking to help her frame an appeal?

Seeker I thought I said why I don't wont to put my daughter to that school, you have to read all the posts. And I don't think I gave all the details about myself and not about why I don't like the school. And about the school: until recently it was actually satisfactory too. The new Ofsted report came out and everybody wants to put their children there, but I have already decided to put her there long time ago,cos my friends son goes there and she is very happy with the school, also as I said previously, I did my research, asked other people whose children go there, talked to teachers and all that made me choose the school even without outstanding Ofsted. Then new Ofsted "outstanding" came out,which was a bonus. However the other school is satisfactory and people I talked to would described as satisfactory. When we are choosing a school for our kids, we do rely on Ofsted, hearsay and our own feelings about the school,that's what I did and feel that home schooling my daughter would be better option for me. And yes, the school is literally round the corner, 0.244 mil, she missed the place by 29 meters :-(

About the home educating.My husband is sick to walk,but not to sit and help with the educating,my baby is young but doesn't need 24 hours to be cared for,there is plenty of time for me to educate my daughter.On our own time,when she feels like it. If it was for me,I would home educate her and not send her to school at all,but I think she would miss being around children,as she is quite sociable. And how hard can it be to teach 4 year old? What do you think they do in reception? Sit all day behind the desk and learn? The play and learn and play,just what my daughter would do home

In terms of 'bad' schools, I am a primary teacher and can say for sure a huge amount of how successful a child is is based on attitudes at home. If they are brought up with parents who are positive, encourage and support their learning and put an emphasis on working hard and recognising the child's achievements then the child will do well and enjoy school.
I have worked in both a 'failing' school and an outstanding one which people fight to get into. The main differences were in the parents attitudes to the school- not what the school was acutally doing. The problems in the 'failing' school were the downwards spiral of negativity towards the school- that the school was bad, so parents expected their child to make little progress, they didn't do much to support their child or show them any encouragement or positivity towards education and so the spiral goes on. Of course there were other 'issues' in the school and it took a lot to turn it around including 'rebranding' the school, but when compared with the 'outstanding' school there was not much difference except people's attitude.
If your daughter ends up having to go to the 'bad' school as long as you from day 1 show your support and do your bit helping with her education at home, then she will do just as well as at the 'outstanding' school. There is so so little difference in the actual school set-up and teaching between Ofsted 'satisfactory' schools and ofsted 'outstanding' and as I've said, most of this difference is based on differences in people's attitudes.

Your DD would probably be better going to the 'crappy' school to start her education even if its just until you can move her- as at that stage education is based hugely on gaining social skills and these cannot be gained easily through home education and leaves her long-term always 'behind'.

Good luck with your appeal, as others have said it is more than likely if you live so near you will not be low on the waiting list and will get a place. I can understand your disappointment when you have moved house and done all you can to get her in.

londoner Interesting post. My dsd is primary teacher and had mentioned in passing that the most influence a child has on it's education is the home background. Maybe this is obvious, if so, why spend a small fortune on private schools or tearing your hair out getting into catchment for 'outstanding' primary? Sorry if this is hijacking a bit but do you know of any research/figures to back this up?

I would also agree that it is a key indicator here, for instance.

Which is why Op has to choose a school where she will be supportive..and your follow on questions are interesting ones to consider!

To put it bluntly, and try and be PC!... and also going completely off orinional topic as this isnt relevant to the OP, she was clearly very dedicated to her DDs education.
I did some research when at uni on this!
'Bad' schools generally are 'bad' because of the areas they are in, often areas with council housing where due to socio-economic factors parents don't have the time, or education themselves to know how or be able to support their child's education. Children who do best are often the children who's parents invest a lot of time in education at home wether it be sitting down to help with homework, reading or encouraging a positive attitude to education through everyday activites such as calculating the cost of items in the supermarket or going to science museum etc. Teachers have to work to deal with the emotional issues many of the children are dealing with, as well as instilling confidence and optimism for learnign before any kind of learnign will take place. Parents put pressure and are looking out for the negatives as it has been labelled a 'bad' school. Progress has to be twice as much as in an 'outstanding' school for it to be noticed, children pick up on this attitude and hence also start lacking confidence.
In the areas of 'bad' schools children loose motivation becuase they cannot see their socio-economic situation improving and lack ambition as what is achieveable is not reality for them. As children get older they turn their attention away from education as they don't see it as valuable- it didn't get their parents far. This atmosphere begins to dominate the classroom and the teachers job to keep the children on track is made ten times harder as its no longer 'cool' to be intelligent or desirable to make academic progress. By then parents influence goes out of the window and an atmosphere of work does not exist mcuh in the school.
Areas of 'good' schools become favourable for new house buyers in the area, so house prices rise, only more affluent families can afford to live in these areas, feeding their children into the 'good' schools. These families often have the time, motivation and education to know how best to support their child's education and the child has good aspirations driven by their parents positive attitude to education.
And so it goes on...
There are ltos of research on this to back it all up. Of course, I'm not saying ALL parents of children at schools with bad ofsted reports are demotivated, badly educated or bad parents. I know many who put their children in schools with bad reputations and their children are extremely successful and motivated. This is a just a model.

Sorry forgot to put in the point of that post! oops!
curtaincall- i agree, why spend so much on private education, maybe because you are doing all you can at home, and want the atmosphere of work ethic instilled for that age when it no longer becomes 'cool' to be working hard. Some do private ed for the opputunities, facilities and better teaching. i suppose if you arent able to, with work commitment etc, spend the time with your child, most private schools are such that there is an atmosphere of work and huge ambition. Putting your child into that environment inspires them to have ambition and optimism about education. But not always, just generally.
I can see the for and against arguments for private ed...i guess it depends on your child and situation wether it would be any better than any other school.

londoner I couldn't agree more with your post. I can't afford private education,so that's why I want to put her in a good school. As you said not ALL parents of the 'bad' schools don't care,but I don't wanna take any chances.

but you need more tha gossip and hearsay to judge a school on.

I think there is no point discuss it wit you seeker cos you don't read everything I write or maybe it's not clear enough for you. I stated many times before on what grounds I judged the school. And if you don't take into account what others say + your own judgement and experience,then what else?

This may have been covered further up the thread, but what about the other schools you put down? Are there some that you would prefer to others? You'll be able to find out where you are on the waiting lists (and check you're on them) in a couple of weeks and go from there.

Fair enough helen.

i just get angry when people say that OFSTED satisfactory schools are crap. Satisfactory means just that -satisfactory. It is hard to get - a lot of hoops have to be jumped through to get this rating. And it is particularly hard for a school with less than supportive parents.

i have read everything you posted, and it seems to me still that you are jusdging the school on having used the children's centre and on hearsay and gossip. And on the fact that there are children there with behavioural problems and who come from less than perfect families. And because you think that your dd will be bullied - an assumption either based on nothing - or on some information you haven't given us. Or on prejudice about some types of parents and children. You don't say you have visited the Foundation state, or talked to the Head or actually found out first hand anything about the school.

But i wish you luck.

And if you don't take into account what others say + your own judgement and experience,then what else?

I agree. I think it is good to have an open mind but if you look around the school and still feel the same then what are you supposed to do!

My DC goes to a Satisfactory School but it's rapidly improving. I wasn't sure about it because of the OFSTED but all the people I spoke to whose children already went there were very positive about it. As were teachers in the area who had worked there. The other plus is that they take children with a particular special need (which I'm not going to name because of identifiability, word?) and it's lovely to watch all the children mixing. The one's who don't have special needs understand the one's who do and are so accepting of it. It's really quiet beautiful to watch and I feel that ALL the pupils benefit from that. I have a friend who just based her opinion on the OFSTED and wouldn't send her child there and personally I think she made a mistake but we all have to make out own decisions based on what we feel, know and research.

how many waiting lists are you on OP? is it just the one for the school you wanted or have you put down others?

Iam sure you will get a place at a school you will like through the waitinh list system, when my dd1 started school so many other children i knew didnt get in to preferred schools and they all went on waiting lists and got suitable places, there seems to be a lot of movement on harrow waiting lists so try not to worry (easier said than done i know!)

you seem very close to the school you wanted anyway which is in your favour and i really hope it works out for you and your dd