Please or to access all these features

Add post

Watch this thread

Save thread

Start a new thread

Flip thread

Hide thread

My feed

Active Unanswered threads

Getting started FAQ's

Unanswered threads Acronyms Talk guidelines

Hide shortcut buttons

Talk

Primary education

Join our Primary Education forum to discuss starting school and helping your child get the most out of it.

Flip

1 2 3 4

Original poster

DS (4) being sent home for pooing or being called in the change him - normal?

91 replies

ASecretLemonadeDrinker · 02/02/2011 14:07

DS just keeps pooing himself. Tried GP, rewards the lot but he keeps doing it. He started reception in Sept & I told them about this, but often he comes home caked own his legs etc) and red raw (then tells me he did it after lunch ie hours ago) , or they half heartidly change him and he has clean trousers but huge dried on amounts down his legs, or they call and ask me to take him home & then he isn't allowed back for 48 hours (no bug, he always has loose poo). DH has just been called to change him which is fine because he is off work, but he's back soon. He is starting to miss somuch school - what can I do? :(

OP posts:

Are your children’s vaccines up to date?

Set a reminder

goingmadinthecountry · 03/02/2011 21:20

While I have every sympathy for your poor ds's situation, as a supply teacher - and occasionally without a TA in a mixed infant class - I certainly wouldn't feel equipped to deal with this in a class I don't know. Luckily the couple of times it's happened, an absolutely fab TA has dealt with it! I may also feel as though I needed to check with school office before acting.

Sounds bad, but on one hand I don't think a teacher/TA should be taken away from the class regularly to deal with this. On the other hand I'm a mum and would feel so sad for the little child involved. BUT it has to be dealt with medically. It's not OK to expect schools to just deal on a regular basis without some medical report. Most children are doubly continent by 2 years.

goingmadinthecountry · 03/02/2011 21:22

That sounds horrible - really sorry, didn't mean it to - just mean that for his sake it really needs fully investigating. Ds had a friend who did this at a slightly older age and some of the others were vile to him.

lovingmy2 · 03/02/2011 21:38

Have you tried social stories. They are stories specific to your child and adapted to anything. we used them fora child who urinated for attention. We read her the story 3 times a day for a couple of weeks...had sticker charts for when she went to the toilet and it worked for her. She enjoyed sharing the story about her with a TA and her behaviour changed within a couple of weeks.

Ask the school SENco about them or ask her to ask the Educational Psychologist.

SDeuchars · 03/02/2011 21:48

I was talking to a health visitor about this today and she said that Lactulose is to be avoided if at all possible (its tooth-rotting stuff).

I am at all the people who think this is normal. It may be common, but if it happens to many young children in nursery/reception, perhaps we (as a society) ought to rethink whether these large group situations are suitable for such young children.

I do realise that once a child and family are in this situation then they have to deal with it, so this is no criticism of the OP or others who have struggled with the issue. It may not be a maturity thing, but does a 4yo really need to be in a formal setting with a low adult:child for 30 hours per week?

RiojaLover75 · 03/02/2011 21:50

going mad I don't know a single child who is/ has been reliably continent by 2 years..... where are you getting that idea from??

jade80 · 03/02/2011 21:53

Haven't read whole thread so maybe has been suggested- but have you considered trying a dairy free diet to help with the loose poo? It may work...

goingmadinthecountry · 03/02/2011 23:13

My 4 all were Rioja. By 2.5, the first 3 were at preschool in the days when you had to be toilet trained. Dd1 and 2 were dry day and night by 18m.

That's not the point though. If children mess themselves at the stage when they start school - 4 - there is an underlying reason that needs to be addressed pretty quickly. It's not nice for the child, parent, teacher or other children and certainly not what would normally be expected.

nappyaddict · 03/02/2011 23:26

falsemessageoflethargy and ASecretLemonadeDrinker According to the DDA they cannot leave a child in a soiled nappy whilst they ring you and wait for you to come and change it. It is seen as a form of abuse/neglect so they have to change them. Any establishment telling parents this is breeching the DDA and if this is the case at your school you should have a meeting with the headteacher and SENCO about it.

When DS was in mainstream school he was changed by either the TA or the teacher in the disabled toilet. As far as I am aware all schools should have a disabled toilet?

Goblinchild · 03/02/2011 23:32

If you have a child that regularly soils themselves in class, you need 1:1 for that child. What are the other 25+ children supposed to do whilst you leave the class for up to 15 minutes to wash down and change one?
Why not have him in pull-ups OP?

goingmadinthecountry · 03/02/2011 23:40

Exactly Goblin.

I know that there is probably a medical reason for OP's son's probs so I am not speaking about that, but year on year children are less ready for school at the age of 4 - less able to change quickly for PE, put on coats, write own name, put on socks, tie shoelaces (yes mine could, even the dyslexic one). We're turning into a nation of mollycoddlers. OK now shoot me down.

Goblinchild · 03/02/2011 23:51

I just think that it's a horrible situation for everyone, the child being neglected and sore, the other children, the staff who have to manage all the needs of all the children.
If he's soiling, he may well be dropping lumps around the class if he's not dealt with immediately, and being smelly and dirty may have a negative impact on making friends too.
If the GP doesn't know what to do next, ask for a referral to hospital specialist.

madwomanintheattic · 04/02/2011 04:02

goblin - quite.

there are days when my ds comes out of class stinking. i can tell from a mile away that he has had an accident, but apparently no-one at school has noticed. to be sure i'm fairly adept at spotting it from his body language alone, but the smell sort of gives it away really.

he went on an overnight trip and apparently all his peers on the bus on the way back were going 'errrrr, someone's s&*t themself, it stinks' (i only know this because dd1 was also on the trip, ds1 wouldn't have told me) and yet still no member of the leadership team intervened or even noticed.

he has been under various paeds for 4 years now (he is 9). the last time we went to see the paed (dh took him) the paed said it was fine. normal. nothing to worry about, just take him to the toilets when you are out.

ds is totally being let down at the moment, but i have no idea where to turn next. very sad for him. horrible. he is maintaining his air of indifference however, and claims not to care whether he soils/ wets. ho hum.

littlebylittle · 04/02/2011 07:54

There is an issue that needs sorting out here like any other additional need a child has. I am a teacher and I would expect for the child's sake that they were changed, if a long term problem then a ta would need to be assigned. However, I'm very clear that my role is not to deal with bottom wiping, sick mopping, nappy changing etc. Not because I'm too proud, I am a mother and that is very much in my job description, but because I have an absolutely full time doing everything else. If it slips into a teacher's role then you get too squeezed for everything else that 30 children demand. So to call in mum every time is def unreasonable, but a proper plan needs to be in place. Out of date to say non potty trained children can effectively be excluded.

Notbyalongchalk · 04/02/2011 09:01

I feel for you OP, my DS2 did this until he was 5.5/6 and the school played merry hell about it even though he has a diagnosed condition and letters from the Paed. The same happened to us with reception (bad teacher) who wasn't prepared for herself or the TA to do it and he was frankly too small to do it himself!
WE went to the LA and they insisted that as he has additional needs () that the school should provide assistance to deal with it.....lots of tooing and frooing and we eventually got it sorted.
He now is able to change/wipe/deal with himself if it happens now which is very infrequently.
Our Paed put DS1 on medication to help with relaxing the bladder and bowel and progress wasn't immediate but did work in the end.
I would insist on a Consultant seeing him and a scan (as sometimes they are able to see what is happening in the bowel and know how to treat it). Even if it is behavioural the school nurse should be involved as it helps the school understand and put things in place to help, they can also refer you to a consultant (or they did with us)
Our DS1 has a vibrating alarm that he wears on his wrist to remind him to go to the toilet so this also helped and he now manages well.
I do agree with the teachers who have posted, that it is not their job, it isn't, but the school have to have something in place to deal with this!
Good luck

madwomanintheattic · 04/02/2011 14:41

notby, is that the malem one?

JustcallmeMummyPig · 05/02/2011 11:57

Although I do feel very sorry for your ds i do not think it should be a teacher or a TA's job to change your child.

He obv needs to have his needs addressed by doctors as i'm sorry but it's not a "normal" situation.

I don't believe that any 4yr old school aged child would have regular (if any) accidents that weren't due to medical reasons.

wetting themselves yes maybe but not poo. It's certanly not fair on him or his teacher/class either. Am surprised the school are not being more supportive.

Personally I would go see GP as your first call, and request to see paed. Then arrange a meeting with head to discuss plan going forwards.

Flip

1 2 3 4