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Preschool education

Get advice from other Mumsnetters to find the best nursery for your child on our Preschool forum.

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Original poster

Help! DS excluded from story time!

41 replies

christmasChocs · 15/01/2013 21:22

My DF collected DS from preschool this afternoon and as be was helping with his coat etc he was asked to collect him at 3.15 tomorrow as DS wouldn't sit down and listen to story and was running around! We usually collect him at 3.30. He was only 3 in November and started a few days later so has only been there a few weeks. Also this has never been mentioned before, I took and collected him on Friday and took him Monday! Always speak to staff and nothing was said!
AIBU to expect the staff to have at least mentioned this to us? DS isn't naughty, but doesn't always listen very well or sit well in groups of children. He will sit down and do jigsaws, play with trains, he loves numbers letters etc and reading stories! Does anyone else think this is odd? I will be speaking to staff tomorrow
Thanks

OP posts:

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threesocksmorgan · 15/01/2013 21:25

wow they expect a lot of a tiny person.

Original poster

christmasChocs · 15/01/2013 21:34

Thanks for replying threesocks! Never posted on here before, just was really disappointed with nursery. It's a good one, attached to a primary school. Staff have been there a long time (one there when my DB attended 25 years ago!) surely they must have seen much worse. He's not a naughty boy, no problem at home, just surprised nothing mentioned before. DS didn't even seem to know why we were saying he had been naughty at nursery, not sure they even spoke to him about it!

OP posts:

sausagesandwich34 · 15/01/2013 21:36

I can't beleive that a nursery can't cope with a 3 year old not wanting to sit down

that's ridiculous

Original poster

christmasChocs · 15/01/2013 21:39

I agree sausage sandwich, if we collect him early each day he will never learn to sit nicely in a group

OP posts:

Rosa · 15/01/2013 21:42

It takes time but surely he is not the first boy not to sit ? i know at my dds preschool they took turns as being the 'page turner' or the bear holder so the bear listened as well but you had to sit still. I would yes have a chat !

HoneyDragon · 15/01/2013 21:43

Yes, how do they intend for him to learn

Dd has started this week and solemnly informed me yesterday she was told off for not sitting down at story time.

By told off - asked to sit nicely with everyone else

Preschool didn't mention it to me, she did, surely it's par for the course until they get the hang of it?

sittinginthesun · 15/01/2013 21:43

That doesn't sound right. I think you need a proper chat with his key worker - how long are they suggesting you do early pick ups for?

At home, maybe play story time with his toys. Explain how the teddies have to sit nicely and listen to the story, and cuddles and stickers for those who sit well.

Original poster

christmasChocs · 15/01/2013 21:48

Thanks everyone, he was upset tonight and thought he couldn't go back to nursery tomorrow, which he loves, but he didn't seem to know why! He also had been playing outside in the snow today, wearing wellies. He had got really wet and even when I collected him from DP at 5pm his trousers could still be rung out Nd wellies soaking. Nursery had changed his trousers but left him in soaking wet socks and just put his shoes on. He now has wet shoes too, and was no doubt really uncomfortable for the rest of the afternoon. I would have rather they took his socks off and just put his shoes back on, at least his feet would have been dry!

OP posts:

Snazzynewyear · 15/01/2013 21:50

That seems really odd. As a child who's fairly new to nursery they should expect that he won't do everything they might expect of him yet, and not being quiet and attentive during story time is hardly the crime of the century or unusual.

I don't see how they can realistically expect you to pick him up early indefinitely or indeed every time this happens. Do they ring parents whose children misbehave in the middle of the day and ask them to take the child away? It sounds like they are just thinking it will make their jobs easier. Definitely have a word. Ask if they will be reducing your fees accordingly if you are expected to collect him early every day!

Original poster

christmasChocs · 15/01/2013 21:50

I don't know how long we have to collect him early, DF didn't think to ask?!? We did sit down tonight and I read him a story while he sat crossed legged on the carpet. He sat fine, he loves stories. We read 2 before bed and one in the bath!

OP posts:

Snazzynewyear · 15/01/2013 21:52

Having read your second post I would watch the nursery carefully and be prepared to move him if needsbe. They don't sound great. The wet socks would never have happened at my DS's nursery.

5madthings · 15/01/2013 21:55

That sounds utterly bizarre!

I agree the leaving him in wet clothes is not good and wouldn't have happened in any pre-school it nursery mine have attended.

Original poster

christmasChocs · 15/01/2013 21:55

He seems wet most days, although days he doesn't play in the water. His jumper sleeves are soaking frequently, just before Christmas they were so wet up to the shoulders that when the staff had taken it off him and hung it on his peg it made a huge puddle on the floor by the time I picked him up. They didn't seem to be able to tell me how it got that bad!

OP posts:

Original poster

christmasChocs · 15/01/2013 21:56

I suppose they had removed it that day though!

OP posts:

Level3at6months · 15/01/2013 22:41

It sounds to me like your DS just isn't ready for a group storytime yet, and the staff have decided that it isn't in his interests for him to stay for storytime, which he clearly finds difficult. Perhaps they think he's tired by the end of the session and the full 3 hours is too much for him? I agree that they should have discussed it with you first, as it's obviously a surprise to you, but I doubt the decision has been made just to make their lives easier. It might just be that they find it is stressful for DS and he just isn't benefitting from that last 15 mins. I would try not to think of it as exclusion - that is a rather dramatic word to use in the circumstances. I would ask to speak to his Key Worker and see how they intend to help him settle so that storytimes can be enjoyable for him.

Original poster

christmasChocs · 15/01/2013 22:49

Thanks level3 hadn't thought of it that way. We were just surprised as it came out of nowhere, I would have expected them to have mentioned the fact that he was being disruptive and given us the chance to talk to him about it. I will talk to them tomorrow

OP posts:

Goldmandra · 16/01/2013 00:07

It is not appropriate to exclude (that is the correct term) a child because he does not want to sit and listen to a story.

There are many and varied strategies this setting should be using to either help him to sit and engage or give him an alternative activity if he seriously can't do it.

I have recently been a part of a conversation amongst Early Years practitioners prompted by one saying she has a couple of children who are refusing to sit nicely and listen to story time. The majority were shocked that this was seen as the child's problem. The view was that at this age the routine should fit the children, not the other way round.

Many children this age simply cannot sit for long, especially in a group. Staff can support the children by offering fiddle toys and cushions and sitting with them. They can also reduce the length of the story for a while, use more interactive resources, sings songs or use nursery rhymes instead or make it an optional activity. Some just read stories when children bring books or are showing an interest in them, inviting others around them to join in if they wish.

This nursery should be reflecting on the format of their story time instead of ditching any child who can't engage in it.

Rosa · 16/01/2013 06:18

When chatting bring up the being wet. They should be checking for wet socks /clothes and changing ...thats not on.

HSMM · 16/01/2013 06:25

Ask to see a copy of their inclusion policy.

Level3at6months · 16/01/2013 07:03

Goldmandra, as a Nursery Teacher with 22 years experience I agree with what you're saying, but I don't think it's something to get worked up about before speaking to the staff about it properly. I would be annoyed about it being sprung on me, but that could have been a misunderstanding by an inexperienced member of staff. Remember that OP's child is in a state Nursery (unless I've read that wrong?) which will have very tight ratios. There are days when we would not have a spare member of staff to sit and support one child unless we put the others into a very large group for storytime. I'm not making excuses, just suggesting some communication.

Do speak to the staff about the wetness, though, OP. Occasional wet clothes can be missed, but if it sounds like more that that and isn't good enough.

PenguinBear · 16/01/2013 07:10

I would ask them tomorrow when you drop him off and then tell them you would like to discuss the matter with the head... That should stop them in their tracks, it's utterly ridiculous. I work in a school and we've never done this, not even with the most disruptive children!

Goldmandra · 16/01/2013 09:43

level I wasn't egging the OP on. I just wanted to highlight what is accepted good practice. Very few Early Years settings have lots of spare staff but the if the children are all sitting in a group listening to a story it is not unreasonable to have one member of staff reading/leading while another sits amongst the children modelling appropriate behaviour, monitoring and redirecting. If a child still cannot sit for long enough that member of staff would then be able to offer a more appropriate activity away from the story session. If others choose to engage in the alternative activity too, there is even more reason to reflect on the format of the story-telling.

Changing the format of story time to respond to the needs of the children takes thought, not extra staff.

The OP has already said she will be speaking to the staff today so I'll be interested to hear how the situation was clarified. Hopefully the responses on her will help her to express that her DS's needs should be met in a positive way during the whole session rather than sending him home when they are offering an activity in an inappropriate format.

hazeyjane · 16/01/2013 10:33

I hope you managed to sort something out op. I would be pretty upset by this, ds will need help to access all areas of preschool (he has sn,and will hopefully have 1-1), but I would have expected the preschool to work a way around any disruption with my nt children, and discuss the situation with me. The wet clothes is not on at all, either.

Original poster

christmasChocs · 16/01/2013 20:47

Hi all, when I dropped DS off at nursery today I asked to speak to the staff, but only 2 non regular staff there, all others in a meeting! I was working today and came out in dinner hour to take DS so couldn't wait around. Am off tomorrow so will be asking then. I did find out that the sitting down at the end of nursery lasts for around 40 mins! Apparently this does include several different activities such as phonics as well as a story. Not sure how many 3 year olds are good at sitting for that long, but it did sound like DS was the only afternoony to have this problem!!!

OP posts:

MrsTomHardy · 16/01/2013 21:09

40 mins!!!!
I run a preschool and I would never ask a parent to pick up a child early because they wouldn't sit still...
It's still early days for your DS, he will learn the routine I'm sure...
He should have a key worker so if he finds it hard to sit still for a story then they should be helping him/encouraging him...do you know who hits key worker is??

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