To think that some NHS midwives are taking advantage of covid 19

[NinaNeedsToGo]

I actually replied with my rant below to another OP but I decided to start a new topic with my post here.

Sorry ladies but I think what we're going through regarding our antenatal care is a disgrace to put it mildly. More and more post are recently appearing on MN where women are rightly concerned that they are not seen by MWs during second trimester at all. It might be just a BP and dipstick appointment that they are missing but most of us would agree that these seemingly minor test are vital for mother and baby's health. They detect quite common problems such as pre-eclampsia or GD and are a bare minimum we receive through NHS.

I have 3 friends working in NHS hospitals (London and Midlands). From what I can hear from them, and we speak weekly, after an initial surge in covid cases at the end of March up until mid April, it's all gone pretty quiet. All planned treatments or OPs have been postponed or cancelled to create more capacity. It's gone to the point where HCW friends seem to be actually bored on their wards. For example, 24 bed capacity on my friend's ward and just 5 patients, and they have not been even nearing a full capacity at any point of this pandemic. All three of my friends work on virtual wards which basically means that they can be assigned to any ward during their shifts. And they were. Surprisingly, or rather shockingly, one of them had actually worked for a week with covid infected patients and a week later on maternity ward (sic!).

With high staffing levels (surprise surprise high for a number of patients they currently have), bank staff hours were actually ceased because of lack of demand.

I am actually pretty angry with how NHS is handling this crisis because due to the pandemic craze (not that I minimise its severity) we seem to have large swathes of population left to their own fate without vital cancer/ maternity/ diabetic etc treatments/care.

Our maternity care shouldn't be affected because midwives are not really involved in covid cases. What's more, many trusts cancelled some vital services such as GTT at 28 weeks ( I was informed that they would test me for GD from blood only), home births, 16 weeks app,and I heard of 24week apps also being cancelled. Postnatal wards are doing whatever in their power to discharge women asap so that midwives and HCW don't have to run between beds while partners are kept away. So at least in theory, midwives should have it easier or at least the same as pre covid.

It took my midwife an extra minute spent on disinfecting my chair and the desk for me when I had my booking appointment. She barely answered my questions and her responses were short and vague. I actually found that a box in my maternity notes was ticked where she didn't actually mention healthy eating to me at all during the app.

What it is then that leads to such an appalling state of care? Aren't we actually quietly allowing this state of affairs to continue by sitting quiet because in our minds all NHS staff is bravely combating covid19 which I know first hand is not true?

Rant over. Waiting for your points of view

Not the same but when I found out I was pregnant and rang the midwife (following the instructions online for my area) the person who answered the phone said “okay fine are you keeping it or getting rid?” Which I found a little bit insensitive! that is not insensitive @zhivagodr. You would have been asked the same in person. Imagine if you needed a termination and it were assumed you were keeping it, surely that would be more insensitive?

Yeah because front line NHS staff make these decisions. Take a look at your thread title, wind your neck in and try again

@LouLouP7 sorry, didn't have time to reply to your post fully. I don't take offence when teachers are accused of having it all so good with 13 weeks of paid holiday (the actual no of hols is no different than in other roles btw and the rest are our non-teaching duties). We are often called lazy. Being lazy is not my point. I provocatively wrote MWs take advantage of covid 19 because in my opinion they most likely do. If the guidelines say: when cancelling app, follow with telephone appointment, there's really no excuse. Work overtime if you have to but don't leave your patients, especially FTMs on their own. if I don't do all my work, I'll sit well into midnight to be ready the next day. That's what children/parents expect, don't they? Is my post offensive? Perhaps it is although my post intended to provoke a genuine discussion.

We have far too many posts here on Mumsnet these days showing a real worry of many expectant mothers left for months without antenatal care. Many replies said to complain, to pester MWs but not to give up on the minimum of care that is required. And I agree. But don't you feel that complaints should be justified when written and submitted? And I justify it like that, you don't see me for months, don't call, don't inform me about my test results when you should then I am neglected. Should I go any further? Negligence is classed as one of many forms of abuse from those who have a duty of care. It's simply missing on vital safeguarding obligations. The guidelines exist to provide a minimum of care, and new pandemic guidelines are very specific and must be followed. But in reality, we don't complain. We accept as it is hoping for the best outcome. And we keep waiting for our next appointment to be allowed to happen.

For someone supposedly educated you seem to have very little common sense. Telling midwives to work overtime! Don’t you think we’re already doing that! Every single area of medicine right now is being FORCED to cancel elective surgeries etc. in the meantime women are still getting pregnant and babies are still being born, we can’t just cancel or delay that can we? Our workload has not reduced in the same way other areas of medicine and yet we are still having to cope with the pressure of short staffing and Covid patients. It’s impossible to maintain a full service!

The reduction in appointments is not just because the service is stretched either (which it is - we are having to rotate into the hospital from community to support our colleagues). The risk of contracting covid when you leave your home to go to a hospital/gp surgery/childrens centre has been considered too.

This thread is actually disgusting and I’m stepping away from it now. In 13 days time I’ll be in work, delivering babies, helping new mothers on what should have been my wedding day, because all annual leave has been cancelled. I’ll care for you and your baby whether or not you’re CoVid positive and I’ll do my very best to make the experience as positive as I can in the most horrific of times.

My own trust lost 17% of its midwifery staffing overnight due to the shielding guidance. That’s before you add in those who are self- isolating, have a positive test or are off sick with other unrelated illness. Yet we won’t be cancelling ‘elective’ surgeries like cancer wards etc. are. We won’t be saying no you can’t have your scan like MRI units are. We provide as much of our essential care as physically possible.

Yet I’m also being accused of taking advantage of the CoVid situation and told to work even more overtime as someone has had a single, not medically required, appointment cancelled in order to prioritise those women with life threatening conditions etc. I’m not saying the situation is acceptable or fair but there isn’t any other choice right now and the decisions are being made far far higher up than us mere midwives that are being held accountable for this.

@Madwife123 it is disgusting. But do read the responses. The OP has garnered basically no support to her thread. Even the posters who have highlighted "failings" in their antenatal care have not supported her arrogant, insulting and frankly uninformed assertion that midwives are lazy, lacking or to blame.

Personally I cannot begin to thank the MWs and medical staff that have looked after us from start to my waters breaking to the care I'll get when I'm induced in 6 weeks.

I'm truly sorry about your wedding day as well

We appreciate you @Madwife123

@Madwife123, sorry you had to read that, it is certainly not my opinion, I really appreciate everything you and your colleagues are doing for me. Thank you.

so sorry you've had to read this @Madwife123 I agree the thread is awful and I hope you're able to rearrange your wedding in the not too distant future

I agree with your post. I’m not pregnant but what you quoted about the wards been quiet at the moment is absolutely true. I’m not sure why appointments are been delayed which with lead to a massive delay and pile up for everyone suddenly need to be seen. Even with staff isolation in most cases it would only be for a couple of weeks. It’s like the world has ended and everything has come to a halt.

@Madwife123 you’re more appreciated than you know, thank you so much for all you do.

@Savingshoes Tried that! Other Trusts won't take on because I'm out of their area. It just feels wrong that I have been denied a home birth simply because of the Trust area I live in.

The only two options I had to keep with my plans of a homebirth were either to freebirth (didn't feel comfortable with that) or use a considerable proportion of my savings to hire an Independent Midwife. I opted for the IM.

Just out of interest those who had their booking appointment over the phone, I guess you don't get notes so it's done electronically?

@Raaaa I had my booking appointment over the phone and will pick up my notes after my 12 week scan when I get bloods taken.

OP - In regards to this thread topic, you cannot base all midwives on the opinions of a few women on a forum. Whilst I agree some women may not be getting the care they require / feel they need, the huge majority of pregnant women are likely happy with their care but not posting about it on a forum. In the same way forums can make miscarriages look more likely because you are more likely to see a post about them, than those with a healthy pregnancy.

It's unfair to brand all midwives as "taking advantage" of a deadly pandemic when they are in fact working harder and putting their lives and their family's lives at risk to do so. If you personally have an issue, why not speak to your own trust / midwifery unit to see why you're not getting the minimum care you think you're entitled to.

A lot of the changes will be to protect you as much as the midwives, and each trust may be taking the general advice and reviewing their own local covid-19 numbers to go above and beyond to protect pregnant patients and their families as well as their own staff - and I can guarantee it won't be the midwives making this decision. In fact it probably goes against everything midwives have worked towards for their whole career.

The purpose of vastly reducing face to face contact isn't because the midwives are very busy, necessarily, it's to combat the spread of the virus. The more often people come in, the more likely the midwives are to be exposed to covid, and the more likely it is that a midwife would spread it to the next patient, and so on.

That doesn't excuse the of the cases of neglect we've read about on this thread (incorrect info taken down, poor advice offered), but I suspect that sadly these sorts of cases happen in normal times too.

Sorry that should have been "The purpose of vastly reducing face to face contact isn't JUST because the midwives are very busy", of course they are busy.

@CoalCraft do you think incorrect information being taken down/poor advice being offered constitutes neglect though?

I'm absolutely not suggesting it's good medical practice or something that should be tolerated but saying that constitutes neglect on the part of midwives just seems so harsh!

On Monday when I was in for my usual twice weekly CTG monitoring the midwife was supposed to give me my GTT but mistakenly just gave me a regular fasting blood test. An error absolutely but not neglect..

When I first rang my triage unit when my waters started leaking the MW told me it was just urine or discharge leaking and not to come in. The next day I was admitted for 72 hours obs because of PROM. Was I upset? Absolutely, that was not a
minor error but I just accepted that like with every single job on this planet people make mistakes. The only difference is we hold HCPs to a (correctly) higher standard and account and when they make mistakes the results can be life threatening...

@MrsRose2018 Sorry if my language sounded harsher than I intended, I'm not condemning anyone or saying these things are unforgivable, just that poor practice like this does happen and probably isn't specifically because of the virus

@CoalCraft you're sadly right! I work for a medical regulator and have done for years and years now and mistakes are made pandemic or no

I defiantly wouldn't ever be able to do their job...

Definitely*

OP, As a Midwife I’m astounded and horrified by your ignorance. I’m going to say very little about what you‘ve written because quite frankly, it’s absolutely disgusting.

Thankyou so SO much. To the majority of incredibly compassionate, mature, amazing women who have posted on this thread. Who have done their very best to understand what we’re trying to deal with and show kindness despite this being a very difficult and scary time for you. Seeing all your lovely comments and knowing we are at least appreciated by some, makes it so much easier to leave our families and go to work. Xxx