Wife wants to have baby in home country, 9 hour flight from UK. Any experiences, views?

[manwithquestion]

Hello,

I'm not a mum, but potential dad. We are very early in our first pregnancy. She wants to have baby in her home country, which is 9 hour flight away, because she wants support of her mum and doesn't want to worry about language issues when giving birth. Her English is fine, but since first baby etc... I think she wants to minimise any stress on the day or the build up to giving birth.

I understand that, absolutely I do, I can support that. But I guess I'm worried about missing the birth and not being around for the first few months of DC's life.

Just to explain, I think I can get three weeks off work. The plan would be to fly out a few days before DD, which I guess carries the risk of missing the birth because DC might be early?

On the other hand, if I fly out a few days before DD, and the DC is a week late, then I will only get a few days to bond before I have to fly back to UK for work.

And even if DC arrive exactly on DD, I'll only get a couple of weeks with the baby before I go back to UK. And then I won't see DC for a couple of months until DW and DC and fly back.

What will I miss in these first few months? Will I regret not seeing DC grow in these initial stages? Or will the years and years I'll have with DC after mean these few months won't matter?

I would love to hear experiences and views please. Due date is April 2014.

Thank you very much.

NHS staff here in the UK are very used to looking after people who don't speak any English, from all cultures and back grounds.(Diversity training is compulsory for all NHS staff). I don't think it would be an issue, particularly if you were around to help.

I don't know what part of the UK you are in, but I think the idea of looking around at your local hospitals is a good one.

All that travelling and you missing out on the birth and those early days and weeks with your DC sounds a bad idea.

I could understand if you were somewhere in the world with no health care/electricity/running water etc, but that isn't the case.

Just a random thought - could you do some research and see if you could find an independent midwife or doula who is native to your wife's country but lives and works in the uk and could be at the birth with you both?
Must be very hard for both of you.

i also live abroad and am pregnant with my first. at first its a bit scary, when its all different to your home country, and language difficulties but i wouldnt dream of going back to the UK and my DH missing out. its a special time for him too.
but with his unwavering support i am feeling more comfortable. so i think you need to play a big part in support for staying in UK OP. and it can make a big difference.
if she really wants her mum then it seems to make more sense to fly her in than your wife be in another country for potentially half a year

Is there any way you could take an unpaid sabbatical from work for six months, rent out the house for that time and all three go to herhome country for the birth a first few months?

I gave birth abroad twice as I wanted dh with me as it was his child I was giving birth to as much as I wanted to be in the Uk.
To be honest I found it all great. My mother came over to help and stayed for 3 weeks . We lived in a 2 bed flat. Her knoledge of the local language is minimal but after 3 weeks she was doing great. Plus if I needed something specific I wrote it down.
When I had dd2 we were still in a small flat . We all coped fine and I was so grateful she came and helped.....
It was very important to me that dh was there. He then took some leave after my mother went which was great and he was very hands on. Dd1 is very attached to dh I wonder if it was the miles he walked when she had colic in our small corridor.

Hi man - I haven't questioned them extensively on it but I think it came down to the toss up between better healthcare in the uk and missing a few months vs more chance of something going wrong, not great after care for mother and baby but being there throughout. I think head won over heart for most. Plus it is the 'done thing' amongst the expat population and when they sign up to this life it is sort of part of the deal. In the end, once mother and baby are back here for a few months it ends up not mattering in the scheme of things, BUT both mums and dads have said how incredibly hard it is, even if the mums are with family. It just isn't the same as having your partner there...

I'm not sure how I would feel about it (my dd was born when we were in the uk and dot looking likely we are not able to have another so not had to face this!) I don't think I would have coped without my Dh in the first couple if months after giving birth...

Your situation is different because the standard of healthcare is not the issue - it's about yours and your wife's feelings and what you are both comfortable with/happy about.

How early on in her pregnancy is she? Could she be feeling a bit scared and hormonal and thinking about this very early? I know I was terrified when I was a few weeks pregnant even though dd was planned and wanted, I suddenly realised I had to give birth! I felt calmer nearer the time and more prepared.

I'm actually really shocked by this. Your wife may be living in another country and her English may not be perfect, but you are the father of her child - does she really set more store by her mother being there than she does by being with you and letting you share in the birth of your first DC? I think she's being really unreasonable here (and I've lived overseas myself - both in a country where I spoke the language fluently and two where I didn't).

My suggestions to you would be:

1. Fly her mother over for a few weeks (my own mother stayed 10 days after the birth of DS1 and that was fine, so I wouldn't go overboard and fly her over for three months - more like one);
2. Find her a bilingual doula or midwife who speaks English + her language. You have plenty of time to look into this;
3. Reassure her that YOU will be really hands on, helpful and supportive when the time comes. She married YOU, this is YOUR child too and you shouldn't have to face missing out on this vital bonding time with your new baby.

I had all three of my children when living abroad. I came back to the UK for the births of the first two and stayed away for the third. There were up and down sides to all three births but my advice to you havving experienced it would be let your wife go with her gut instinct. It is so important to feel comfortable and confident even by baby no. 3.

About the cost, are you sure that the government will subsidise this? She hasn't been in the country for 3 years. Countries have cut off when their citizens decide to move to other countries. It might work out a lot more expensive than you are currently thinking.

Then are you going to buying everything twice or paying excess.

You mentioned that mil doesn't speak the language which wouldn't be a problem here. That space is a problem, there are lots of ways round this. But what really stuck out was but we might have to end up looking after her too. What happens if mil is ill when your wife is over there? She will be alone looking after a newborn and her elderly mum.

I would much rather have my DP with me than my DM, I would be concerned about him missing the first few months and that he would never get back. I agree with others that it seems to make much more sense to fly her DM over nearer the time and also the NHS are very experienced in dealing with mothers from a different country/background. Plus the child's nationality, it would be classed as being a national of country of birth which could have implications ie. not being able to have a UK passport etc

Thing is too that wherever your dw has the baby, chances are that she will spend lots of time inside initially or going out for gentle walks - it's not a time for loads of socialising. If she is staying with her mum then she will be chatting with her obviously, but will she really be chatting with lots of others? And would her mum really be going out lots to bingo/social club/socialising/whatever it is she wants to do, if your dd was there with a brand new baby - wouldn't life there go on a bit of a hold for the first few weeks anyway?

And if you had been living in your wife's country and your mil came to help her after the baby was born then it's not like she would be talking to her own friends every day, she would be there talking to her dd and helping take the dgc out for a walk and helping keep the place tidy and do a bit of cooking and so on. All of which would be exactly the same in this country.

Could you look into getting some tv channels on sky or freeview that are from your MIl's home country if she'd like it, so she could watch some of her own tv and so not get bored if she'd usually watch tv at home? And or set up skype so she could keep in contact easily and cheaply with friends at home? there must be lots of other little things she could do like this that would overcome lots of the problems with being in England that she is anticipating?

There's always going to be a bit of upheaval and adjustment when a new baby comes along, especially the first. And then by the time that things have settled down - well that's when MIL would be going home or your dw and baby would be coming home anyway!

Sorry I'm not saying this very clearly but hopefully you get what I'm trying to say.

Man - I currently live in germany, my DH is german. I have learnt German since coming here (had zero before). My german is by no means fluent now, but I get by, and went to the pre natal classes in german on my own as my DH work away mon to thurs - for me it has been a case of learn the language, immerse yourself and make friends with people. I am glad I did this TBH - I feel very independent here, and have found the german health care system second to none. I realise the germany is part of the EU, but we don't know how things will work out in the future, so we will get our child dual nationality (UK allows this until 18 with an EU country). It is worth figuring out nationality and citizenship arrangements upfront as a by the by. It honestly never occurred to me to go back to the UK to have our baby - yes I am a bit daunted about being in a german hospital, but actually, as you don't know how pregnancy goes, I thought i was miscarrying our baby at 6 weeks, but was thankfully a false alarm - and was in hospital, and again at 34 weeks thought she would come too early, as I had started to go into early labour, which stopped and had to be admitted for a few days. Now I could not have predicted that, i am a healthy person with a healthy BMI etc - I really hope you have a smooth pregnancy, but you honestly cant know how it will turn out.

If you want my honest opinion, it is better to be fully familiar with how the UK system works, and your wife to be properly up to date with it, in case anything happens where she may need an early admittance. This is true with the cost side too. The next thing is thinking about how you could be her birthing partner - my DH is very up to speed with each stage of labour, what to expect, what my wishes are etc. If i am honest discovering all this together has really bonded us even further, which has been wonderful for both of us. It would be a shame for you to miss that, and I think as a father to be you should be able to express this to your wife. I agree with Juneau that you should be able to find a doula that can speak her mother tongue and if she really wants her mum there then fly her over. Actually - I have put my parents off coming until we had had a bit of time to bond together as a family - I want my DH and me to get to know her first before my very able mum comes over, and make our mistakes together. I would not want my mum (as much as I think she is fab) getting involved in that - but that is just me!

I haven't read the whole post but what passport will your new baby have,and if you want them to have a uk one is this possible, and you you need to sign any application due to being dad. Could having a non uk birth cert cause problems??

I have many well-travelled friends who have given birth in countries not their own and I really deeply believe that if a first time mother wants to go to her home country to give birth and spend some time being cosseted by her own family, then this is in everyone's best interest.

Difficult situation.

As others have pointed out baby might not be entitled to British (EU) citizenship which could have major consequences in future re study, work, if you were to split up etc.

I totally understand that your DW would like her DM to be around, also understand that she would prefer to give birth in a familiar environment. How is the healthcare in her country?

Given that you are both living in the UK, I would think that it would be in the family's interest (you, DW, baby) to become as much part of UK society as possible. If baby gets ill, needs ongoing treatment for something she would need NHS , so may as well get used to it. Could you afford private birth in NHS hospital (so there is access to A&E in the unlikely event that this is necessary)? This may give her more personalised care and you may even be able to find a consultant/midwife whoch speaks DW's language.

I was in the same boat and being a non native English speaker, I was really scared of giving birth in the US, so I flew back home to have DS. But in my case it was probably easier since DH does not have a "9 to 5 job" and could stay with me from week 32 to when DS was 3 mo.

For DD I considered going to Quebec as DH had previous work engagements but got my head around giving birth here because I found a French speaking midwife.

Perhaps you should try to look for medical personnel who can speak your DW's native language? Her consulate/embassy should be able to help with that.

And then fly MIL over if she is still needed?

I had my first overseas, due my second in jan and will be staying here again. We have no entitlement to uk healthcare anymore and the (private) healthcare where we are is great. There was just no question that I would EVER have left my husband and given birth without him. No way. You couldn't pay me enough. Those first few weeks with the first were incredible, emotional, painful, exhausting - we were building our family. Together. I just wouldn't have managed without his help and support, and I felt it very important that our DD bond with him in the early days as well as me.

Citizenship is an issue. The country we are in doesn't do citizenship by birth, so DD is British by descent. As somebody else mentioned, she will have to have her children in the uk if she wants uk citizenship for them.

I flew to the uk when DD was 5 weeks old, and organized her passport etc in London by appointment. I was perfectly well two weeks post birth, DD had no health issues, so if your wife did go, perhaps she could come back to you sooner rather than later after the birth??

I'd see if you can avoid making any decisions either way for now - she might change her mind if/when you both start attending antenatal classes, meeting other expectant parents, having tours of local maternity units etc.

I think your wife is being selfish. Sorry but i'm just being honest.
I'm a foreigner myself and came to live in UK a few years ago and don't realy have any family or close friends here (except for my DP who's not from UK either), so I should understand your wife - but I DON'T!

She hasn't have a valid reason to take a chance to experience your child's birth and his first days of live away from you.

I understand women who live in countries with poor health service. Child's wellbeing is the most important.

What about you and a bonding time with your child? What about your child? How can she take a child away from his father and a chance for him/her to get to know his father?

If she was enough mature to get pregnent now she needs to be enough mature to deal with the situation without her mummy. Tell her to face her fear (she is not the only one terrified of becoming a mother) and deal with it!

From what i've heared she has a right to request a translator for her hospital appointment, but as someone already mention most midwifes are used to dealing with people not speaking english very well.

Thera are MANY new mums who live away from their families and their partners can't even take a few days off from work. They manage so your wife will manage too!

You sound like reasonable person and I'm sure she will receive a lot of help and support from you.

Don't let her go! You will regret that!

Hi all,

Wow, thanks for all the replies and honest opinions. I really appreciate them all and they've been very helpful.

Where she's from has a world class healthcare, and I have no worries about that at all. She also used to work in the medical sector, so knows the system very well.

I guess the key is to take the stress and anxiety out of having our first child. I should be part of that de-stress strategy. I guess I have to make the case that having me around outweighs the language difficulty, unfamiliarity with the NHS, etc.

She knows I'm not too happy about her going back to her home country, for the reasons I explained in my original post. And to reiterate, we haven't decided what to do yet. I think there's still a lot of learning to go for both of us.

A lot of this is probably new expectant-parent nerves too! Thank god for mumsnet, I'd be totally lost otherwise.

I can see this must be really hard for you, but instinctively I think I would want to do the same as her and go home for the birth.

You've had some good suggestions for alternative plans that you should discuss with your wife, but if she really wants to go home for those 4 months I think you should support her.

I actually disagree with many of the posts saying your wife is being unfair and that she should stay. Giving birth for the first time can be terrifying! And you want to be somewhere you feel totally safe and comfortable. I hope there is a way that she can have all of that in te UK if her mother can visit, but if its not the best option then I think she should go home. Is there any way you can take extended leave/ bank up some holiday/ unpaid leave? Eg my DH can buy and sell holiday and carry over in these kinds of circumstances.

I think lots of people forget that in many, many cultures the mother ( and/or mother in law) of the birthing woman is the main source of support to the the new mother and child. If she feels strongly that she needs the women of her family around her then I don't think you can deny her that.

Yes, it would be very sad for you and I completely understand how you must feel, but I know when my DH went back to work after a week I felt so alone and I would have chosen to be far away with my mother than on my own from 7am -9pm each day.

Also I remember reading once that the support offered but the mothers family (particularly the women on the family) plays a huge role in preventing PND in countries where this is the norm. Not sure where I read it but to me it makes sense.

Sorry for typos and generally sloppy post. Am on phone and shattered.

I have been on planes coming back to the UK with elderly non Brits who can't speak English yet they make here to visit their extended family. The trick is to get her mum to give herself enough checking in time or time between connecting flights so she can seek help if needed. there's no way she would get lost at the airport if that's your worry.
Her mum coming here would be the best option.