Help me - I want to keep this baby. Please be honest.

[Boltless]

I am going through a divorce, having been unhappily married for 7 years. I have 2 children with my (former) husband (both under 7). He and I were initially in agreement that the marriage should end, but he is finding the process very difficult and is currently very bitter and hostile.

I have started (resumed?) a relationship with someone I have known for years. It is still early days, but we have always been good friends (despite deliberately staying out of each other's lives when we got married to other people) and it's lovely to have this very easygoing, mutually supportive relationship in the background, even though my primary focus is managing the end of my marriage properly, for the sake of my children. We live a long way apart (and both have a lot to sort out in our personal lives), so only see each other once every 10 days or so.

I have fallen pregnant. The child is my friend's.

I have 2 young children and I worry desperately for the impact upon them. The practical difficulties, the potential for gossip, the financial worries. My husband would be incredibly hurt, angry and bitter about it and, i suspect, not be too averse to seeking to undermine my relationship with my children. He is rather prone to bleating on about perceived unfairness in front of the children (which is awful - and no amount of pleading will make him stop).

My friend is going through a very difficult divorce as well. He has a young child.

My husband has always harboured hostility for my friend. Rightly, I suppose. We have never had a relationship before, but there has always been an edge to our friendship. My friend's wife has also always disliked me, for similar reasons.

I have a reasonable job (not exactly high-flying, but comfortable and with a decent range of perks).

It would be so difficult.

I can't bear the thought of terminating the pregnancy. I can't bear the thought of making my children's lives more difficult than they already will be.

Help me. Please be honest.

Grumpla

This:

"If you feel that you do have the resources (both practical and emotional) to do this, then go for it. If you feel you could only parent this child if your friend steps up, I'd think twice."

That sums it all up, for me.

You are about to be a single parent whether you have this baby or not. You are divorcing your children's father and they will be parented by two single parents from now on.

Yes it will be hard coping with a newborn as well, but you cannot allow yourself to be pressured into aborting a pregnancy it sounds like you want, just because of your ex. Even thd baby's fathers feelings must be secondary to yours. That is the only way it can be fair.

It sounds as though he isn't exactly 'there' for you when you need him but that could change once there is a real live baby...OTOH it may not.

I understand completely the thought of not being able to cope unless he steps up to it. I also understand completely the 'genuinely don't have a clue what to decide' because that's exactly how I felt, even after hours and hours of trying to talk it over with counsellors, my mother, my friends.

I had no idea, in short I didn't want the decision and I didn't feel equipped to make it. (i almost believe no one should have this decision, but that takes away choice, which is probably wrong).

So I defaulted to what my BODY was doing, already, keyed up hormonally and physically and emotionally for a child it was bearing. I felt distraught at the idea my body was doing what it should, naturally, and I was thinking of sticking a spanner in the works and saying 'stop making this baby viable, stop preparing for it, you can#t have it' and so I kept the baby. It was the only right thing to do for me - by setting up almost a devils advocate situation I was then able to say NO I am not going to do this, whatever anyone else wants, t's too late, I'm pregnant, I'm not going to stand in the way of this or turn off the supply or whatever analogy you might choose.

That wasn't something I could bear to do. So, here we are with a lovely, lovely child that I'd never have known if I'd gone against my body and stopped what was happening. Three would be difficult! I only had one, before. Now I have two. So I'm not quite in your shoes.

But that's what I did and I'm not telling you to do the same. Thinking of you though.
Just one more thing - it IS much much easier once the baby is born,. Honestly - you've done it all twice already, it's pips. [ The emotional bit and the pregnancy was hardest for me, but once the father had fecked off I was FINE and it was a beautiful, slow, easy time once he was born. No problems at all. So that bit will be easy peasy.

I really, genuinely don't know what to do. Termination makes it all go away, but it is a devastating prospect. I could be 'free' of this dilemma by this time next week. It's so awful to feel relief, alongside the grief.

But you don't know that it will make it go away. You can't be sure you'll feel relief alongside the grief, or any guilt that you may then burden yourself with :(

How many weeks are you? Is it possible for you to get some counselling from somewhere in order to help you make the decision that's right for you, not what's best for the friend, or your STBXH?

The other thing you need to do is call your friend. It's no good thinking you don't want to bombard him with messages - this is something on which you need to be absolutely clear about his position. Suspecting he will feel X or supposing he really thinks Y doesn't help you. Don't give him the opportunity to be shit or to disappear. If he tells you that he really doesn't want the baby then you will know FOR SURE that if you do this, you'll be doing this alone. On the other hand, lots of men (and women) who have planned to have children in established, steady relationships often panic and use avoidance tactics when a pregnancy is first discovered.

You need to talk to him.

I also think that once the decision is made he will be fine with it.

That's the trouble with having the option of termination.

It's a sad thing but it almost seems that immediately a less-than-excited man hears the words 'I'm pregnant' he is thinking 'Oh God. But she doesn't HAVE to keep it, there's always abortion, we're in a trap but there is a way out!' and that means he feels he has to 'win' the game, find his way out of the cage you're stuck in, and reach freedom and control once again. it's a psychological thing. I've seen it an awful lot.
However if the pregnancy is seen as a fait accompli, he will often feel far happier about it and rise to the challenge.

I hope this doesn't sound odd. But I found the same thing - having the option made it SO, so hard for me not to feel I was responsible for what I did with the baby, and I didn't want that responsibility, once I'd got pregnant, that was an accident in itself though we were not trying NOT to have a baby. It just happened. And from that point I wished the decision had been taken from me but suddenly folk were saying ;you could choose not to have it' which was imo really unfair though inevitable. They were putting pressure on me not to have it, because I could stll let them off the hook...shouldering that 'blame' is a terrifying prospect.
Yet he may not blame you. He probably doesn't want the pressure of the decision either, so if you make it for him, he might be fine with that, and relieved in himself, as there's nothing he can do, or should do - perhaps he feels he should pressure you to terminate. If you say what you want he might go along with that happily as per his gut reaction, which was good.

He probably just doesn't want to be blamed for 'letting you' keep it? iyswim. (by his ex wife)

I know I felt far better once the cut off date had passed but up until then it was horrid being in that position.

sorry, I do hope that makes sense.

I've just been out on the bike and my hands are freezing and I can't type!

I just mean, his initial reaction was of joy. He is a good person. He is probably terrified of the future, of being put under pressure like you, and doesn't want to A) say the wrong thing to you or B) have to make this decision in the first place.
I would advise making the decision for him (for you) and asking him to support you, as he's already said he will.

I also agree about not phoning him necessarily, yet - you're right, you don't want to feel like you're hassling him. It will not make things clearer I don't think. Believe me if he really wanted you to get rid, he would make it very, very clear, somehow.

Also: try to imagine how you would feel, if someone was telling you you had no choice - if they said 'you have to have a termination' what would your instinctive response be? Or if they said 'I'm sorry but you cannot have a termination'. How would that make you feel?

You really have to make this decision as if you were going to be on your own either way. Neither having a termination nor keeping the baby will guarantee that it works out with him - especially given he could have been with you 7 years ago but chose his girlfriend (now stbx). As Chubb said - you are going to be a single parent very soon - the only difference if whether you do that with just your older children or if you have the baby as well. What do you want. Ignore what stbxh & 'friend' want/think/will say. What do you want - do you want this baby??

A termination does not mean this will all go away, the only thing that goes away is your choice. You can't 'undo' having been pregnant. I haven't had one myself, but I know that a lot women that have been unsure & have just 'wanted it all over' have really really struggled with ever coming to terms with what they did and it had a devastating affect on their lives :( Others who knew it was definitely what they wanted have (mostly) coped much better - though the majority still with huge regrets. Very few women do this with little or no regret.

I don't think you do need to talk to him actually - I think that you need to make this decision based on doing this on your own, nothing else is a certainty, no matter what he says right now, either way. Your relationship isn't certain with or without this baby & lots of people 'panic' when they or their partner find out they are pregnant (even when it's planned!), so how he feels now (either way) may not be how he feels in a few weeks or months.

You need to make this decision for you.

I would second that.

It sounds as though you have friends who will support you emotionally whatever you do, and that is the main thing you will need - emotional support, permission, if you like, to have the baby and not be condemned for it.

My family all told me I shouldn't keep it which was devastating to me. But they have come round to it and are very nice to my babies (both of them!) and I think they have almost forgiven me (well some of them). Even his father is reasonably pleasant now when we meet by accident, though he doesn't help with anything (and I asked him not to as he was a PITA)

At the end of it, a baby is always a wonderful, lovely thing, and there is no happiness to an abortion. That was my thinking. And yes I am rooting for you to say you're keeping it, because that's always my instinct and makes me vicariously happy but I will still hold your hand if you say you're not.

Ok? take care xx

Ultimately if you want the baby in your heart of hearts, and you consider yourself a competent mother, then this child will end up being very loved, I am sure, and it will probably be a very enjoyable experience for everyone concerned.

I think it's a question of deciding to get on with it, and being determined to make the most of the baby's arrival regardless of what other people feel like. If you can manage to do this, it will surely all work out in the end, and you will be really surprised how much help friends and strangers give, and who steps in to be supportive. A woman is never alone in such situations unless she wants to be. The child is always welcome, as they say.

Interestingly I had a friend in a similar situation 18 months ago, and after an initial period of crapping herself, she is having an absolutely brilliant time, and absolutely adores her son. I know she's completely in love and preoccupied as she has been more or less happily ignoring me all year . A good sign.

Oh god, you ladies are wonderful.

I am in floods.

We've had more contact today and he's still weighing it up ... blah blah on that side, blah blah on this ... I've just basically told him to shut up and fucking well have the courage to say if he doesn't want the child, because that is the only thing stopping me.

Ok, another message (bleep-bleep as I'm typing).

"I do want this child".

I think we're doing it, ladies.

And Jennifer: elation. Absolute elation.

Boltless - be very clear here, no matter what he says right now, you are doing this. Of course it would be nice to have his support, his enthusiasm, his joy - but be very clear, this can be whipped away very quickly, leaving you doing this on your own. Are you prepared for that? If he had said 'I don't want it' what would you have done? Please don't get swept along with what he is saying he wants. You need to think about your life and whether you could cope on your own if he changes his mind next week, if you want to cope if he changes his mind.

I'm sorry, I don't want to burst your bubble - but please, think about this and if you are prepared to do it on your own.

Hope to see you posting on Baby Names soon. Good luck Bolt and Happy New year.

I just want you to know in your own mind that the decision has been made and you are 100% happy with it, no matter whether he's on board or not. I fear him changing his mind in a week or two and you having to re-think it again if you haven't made this decision based on what you want and what you could cope with if he wasn't on board with this decision. Whereas if you have made this decison for you, irrespective of him, if he does change his mind down the track - you will be OK, because you will still be doing what you want to do.

I'm sorry, I can't say it anymore clearly and I'm still not sure I've explained myself very well.

Hi,

I am not in a disimilar situation I too am going through a divorce and started a relationship six months ago falling pregnant in 8 weeks. There are no other children.

I think the best thing to do see the new baby as your new fresh start with a man that loves you. Your children will love having a little one around and as for the ex if he can not be civil then more fool him .
xx

Good on you. All a baby needs in life is love and security and you sound as though you can give this in spades.

Your partner will come around once the shock wears off. xx

Oh I am so pleased

How wonderful that he said that!

I know Chipping is absolutely right, that he could change his mind, well, so could you, but that's kind of not the point, I think. I think the point is, he's given you the go-ahead. He's given you permission - not that you require it from him, but you want it from him, and he's given that to you.

I am so happy for you

We are still here no matter what happens later on...I got through all of it (and am still here five years later) with the help of MN, tbh, and have not looked back. So stick around if you weren't here already, and if you were, then stick around anyway!

Lots of love x

Jennifer - I think it is the point! In fact, it's exactly my point! What if next week he takes away that 'permission' again? The OP will be left going through this dilemma again if she doesn't make this decison for herself and by herself. But, it's only my opinion.

Jennifer and Chipping

I know what both of you are saying.

Chipping: I really appreciate you taking this stance; it's the tougher side of things that keeps me awake at night, so I am certainly not adverse to looking at it full on.

The thing is: I just needed to know he wants the child. The practical side of things are overwhelming him, but I am prepared to go forward as a single parent (in practical terms), as long as he can love the child. He just had to say yes to that. Unplanned but not unwanted.

He is, by the way, bombarding me with texts saying how happy and excited he is.

Bloody men are stupid fuckers, aren't they?

Hi, my situation not totally dis-similar to yours, I have been seperated nearly 4 years we are still very good friends..neither of us in that time have had a serious relationship that lasted longer than 6 months...(guess thats why no divorce yet!) We have a dd aged 9 & a dd who passed away just after we seperated..(she was life limited so not a huge shock) .. At the beginning of last year I began a brief casual relationship with a neighbour.. 2 lonely people with a mutual attraction I suppose is the best way to describe.. as a result I got pregnant whilest using contraception.

So there I was age 37 .. pregnant by someone who I knew would not be at all happy about it, worried what people would think, worried how hurt my ex-husband would be a) because of the circumstances of conception & b) because of dd2. I was terrified I would'nt cope financially & about the effect on my dd1.....But over & above all those obstacles/worries/doubts I knew I wanted this baby!!! But most of all it came down to could I terminate & what would do that do to my head afterwards??!! .. I knew even if I could terminate it would have had a terrible effect on my mental health for the rest of my life!! Thus probably damaging my dd1 more!!

Fast forward 7 & half months... all is well with the pregnancy, my family & friends have been all the support I need, the babies dad has stuck to his guns & wants nothing to do with the baby...(we have spoken 3 times since I told him) but thats fine it's his loss. My ex-h has been ok about it..does'nt really say too much but his mum says she will class it as another grandchild which is lovely. My dd1 is the most excited big sister to be in the world & so happy about it. I have scrimped & scraped & scoured ebay for bargains & now have everything I need for the baby.. So just countdown time now!!

Wanted to tell you my story, don't know if it will help & I know there will be hard times ahead for me financially, emotionally & I will be tired & worn out but if I had terminated to please other people or save gossip then right now, or around due date & the years that follow I honestly think I would be utterly miserable, regretful & angry....well basically a headcase!!! I think you know that you would cope & your children would welcome this baby with gusto & in my eyes thay are the only ones feelings that count.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do. x

No, I know what you mean and it does make sense. Of course it does. It's just that in her position, well I am projecting here as I don't know how she feels (apart from happy!) but in MY position, I only needed that permission one time. That was enough. And if the person then changed their mind, that wasn't my problem any more...it was their having other reasons. I went with their first reaction iyswim because anything else could be overcome.

And he's said it twice now, that he wants the baby so that is a good sign. No disrespect as I have huge respect for you and your posts on this and other threads, so I hope that is clear, but I think the fact he has said it (more than) once is really significant.

If my child's father had said he wanted the baby even once, I'd have been ecstatic too - but he didn't. Not one time. He was totally against it.

And though eventually he did try and get his head around it and offered to get back with me (I was about 3/4 months) by that time I actually said no thanks, because I didn't need him.

I think men make it very clear if they do not want a child.

Keep the baby. !

Sorry, that was to Chipping

Boltless

He sounds great! Good for you for telling him to stop messing around.

I know it's going to be a really difficult endeavour, for both of you, emotionally, but with the right will and attitude anything is possible.

Good luck xx

Oh Good!

Boltless - I do understand what you are saying and I will stop banging on about it because I don't want to upset you, however, I am still concerned though that he might have felt pushed into saying that to stop you going on about it/give him some time to think/not rush into a termination, yet after another nights sleep or a week or a fortnight - he might think more 'practically' and change his mind, it's really quite common, then where will you be if you have made this decison because today he has said he wants the child?? Whereas if you have made this decision based on what you want irrespective of his feelings about it, him changing his mind wont have such a huge impact on you. Of course it would still be upsetting, but it wouldn't be cause to re-think the whole thing.

Don't get me wrong, I am all for you keeping this baby, I just don't want you going through hell in a fortnight when he changes his mind. It is much easier to think now about what you want and base it on that, not on him.