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Pregnancy

Talk about every stage of pregnancy, from early symptoms to preparing for birth.

Light drinking in pregnancy 'does not harm baby'

118 replies

Miffster · 06/10/2010 07:01

A good summary from CBC News: Light drinking no risk to babies: study

'The children of mothers who drank small amounts of alcohol during their pregnancy are not at an increased risk for behavioral or intellectual developmental problems, a new British study suggests.

In fact, the study, which appears in the Journal of Epidemiology and Community Health, found that children born to light drinkers were 30 per cent less likely to have behavioural problems than children whose mothers did not drink during pregnancy.

As well, the study found that children of parents who were light drinkers achieved higher cognitive scores than those whose mothers had abstained from alcohol while pregnant.

The researchers used data from a study that tracked the health of more than 11,000 children in the U.K. born between September 2000 and January 2002. Mothers were asked questions about their children's behavioural and intellectual development at age three. They were subsequently assessed at the age of 5.

But the research found that the children of mothers who were heavy drinkers were more likely to be hyperactive, compared with children of mothers who did not drink.

The researchers interviewed the mothers about their drinking patterns during their pregnancy, along with other social and economic factors.

Mothers who consumed one or two drinks a week were considered light drinkers. Heavy drinkers were those who consumed seven or more drinks a week or six at one sitting'

Daily Fail: 'Glass of wine in pregnancy 'does not harm your baby'

BBC: 'Light drinking no risk to baby'

However...despite this study, the official advice remains the same, and in an update to the story, the Press association report

'Press Association: 'Pregnant women warned over alcohol'

'Women were advised that official guidance to avoid alcohol in pregnancy remained in place after experts said drinking one or two units a week does not harm a child's development.
Mothers-to-be can safely drink a 175ml glass of wine, a 50ml glass of spirits or just under a pint of beer each week without affecting intellectual or behavioural development, according to a new study.
But children born to mothers who drink heavily or binge drink (seven or more units a week or six at one sitting) are at higher risk of behavioural and emotional problems.
The finding adds to previous research which found light drinking has no negative effect on toddler development, and the issue of how much is safe to drink during pregnancy has caused controversy in recent years.
In 2007, the Department of Health published guidance saying pregnant women should avoid drinking alcohol altogether, as should those trying to conceive. This replaced previous guidance which said it was safe for pregnant women to drink one to two units of alcohol per week.
The Government said its update was not based on new research, but was to provide consistent advice to all women.
Following the latest study, in which experts examined the risk of drinking on children up to the age of five, a spokeswoman for the Department of Health said: "After assessing the available evidence, we cannot say with confidence that drinking during pregnancy is safe and will not harm your baby.
"Therefore, as a precautionary measure, our advice to pregnant women and women trying to conceive is to avoid alcohol."
Janet Fyle, professional policy advisor at the Royal College of Midwives, said she was concerned women may take the findings as a message that it is "ok" to drink alcohol.
"There is no firm evidence that small amounts of cumulative alcohol consumption does not have an effect on the developing foetus," she said. "Because of this our advice to women remains the same; if you are planning to become pregnant, or if you are pregnant, it is best to avoid drinking alcohol."'

OP posts:
thebody · 07/10/2010 20:16

omg... here we go.. another bloody useless peice of crap to beat pregnant women around the head...

the odd glass of wine is fine
the odd fag is fine
gentle excersise is fine

BUT

washing up harms your foetus!

as does ironing, cooking, being told you are too overweight and not having regular massages, facials and generally being spoilt...

hope that clears it all up

and I am a scientist of course..

oh hang on no just a mum who can actually reason this out for herself and doesnt need any bloody doctor telling me what to do... so why dont they just piss off and research why middle age men have more hair in their nostrils and ears than on their heads..

Booboobedoo · 07/10/2010 20:16

My pram is all set up in the front hall too.

I'm doomed.

1Catherine1 · 07/10/2010 20:18

ProfessorLaytonIsMyLoveSlave - I think that comment is a little harsh to be honest. Woman are still advised not to drink so it isn't just superstitious nonsense as you seem to be suggesting. If people choose to do this "just to be on the safe side" who are you to say you are right and they are wrong. There is a reason this advice changes every now and again, and that is simply because they don't know for sure.

A spokesman for the Department of Health said: ?After assessing the available evidence, we cannot say with confidence that drinking during pregnancy is safe and will not harm your baby. Our advice is clear so as not to confuse women.?

You do as you please but don't criticise those of us that don't drink and label us as irrational. If you choose to reply directly to this post please note that I have not criticised any pregnant women who choose to have the occasional drink, only stated that I won't be doing for my own personal preferences, fortunately for me I don't like a drink anyway. I am undecided on whether it is safe or not.

thebody · 07/10/2010 20:25

'the children of mothers who drink moderatly in pregnancy are far more socialised than the children of tetotallers'

obviously this study doesnt include the behaviour of first time mums who read, belive and worry about all aspects of their condition.. just mums who all ready have children so understand the value/necessity of alcohol..

my research shows that mums who are fun have kids who are fun loving..

please see my paper in this months Lancet......

thebody · 07/10/2010 20:39

catherine. to be serious for a minute.. good for you..

I just object so much to all the crap thrown at pregnant women.. I had my first child in 1989 an my last(definatly) in 2004..

during that time advice on pregnancy,child birth weening, feeding and all aspects of child care have changed.... funny that because my babies needs, and mine,, were exactly the same

I think its advisable to do what seems right for you and ignore the rest,, as you are doing..

good luck..

edam · 07/10/2010 20:45

"our advice is clear so as not to confuse women"

So now they are calling us stupid as well as irresponsible? Way to go Department of Health...

(I am a journalist, I know the average reading age is not great, I understand that public health campaigns need to have very clear messages. But this one is based on a big fat lie with nasty overtones of sexism.)

pinkgrasshopper · 07/10/2010 20:46

I think the last statement of the DoH statement says it all. How patronising.

I have just finished an MSc in psychology specialising in development disorders and the Professor who taught most of my modules, and is both an academic and clinician, repeatedly noted that there is no evidence that FAS and milder cognitive disorders are caused by moderate drinking. The DoH know this yet do not want to confuse women who may not be ae to grasp the concept of a unit etc. It's also worth noting that ad was well publicised in the recent David Nutt (cannabis) case, Ministers don't always go with the known science but chose messages which are more simplistic.

That aside, I do think that we have enough to contend with in terms of what to eat, positions to sleep in, to have the jab or not etc. without judging each other, which I think is what ProfL was saying...

AliGrylls · 07/10/2010 20:48

Wouldliketoknow, fair enough that you don't want to drink for personal preferences but when you say you don't believe it can be good for the baby this is actually your opinion not a scientific fact. Do you know anyone whose mother had the odd glass of wine when PG and was harmed by it? What are you basing this belief on?

In 2000-2002 women were told they could have 7 units of alcohol per week. The only reason why the advice changed was because there were some women who did not know what a unit was. It had nothing to do with research showing that this number was detrimental to babies development.

The other point I would like to make is that the women in the study that were capable of figuring out what a unit was, probably weren't the same women that were out bingeing on booze.

ProfessorLaytonIsMyLoveSlave · 07/10/2010 20:48

The advice changed in 2007 not because they didn't know for sure, but because they felt women were confused by advice to drink no more than 1-2 units a week. Look at what the DoH said at the time.

This is a thread about research that has shown, like all the other research, that there is no adverse effect from drinking 1-2 units a week. "They" do know for sure, as much as one can know anything for sure. Coming onto this thread and saying "well, I personally believe that all the research is wrong" is as anti-scientific as "Dr" Fox's infamous "There's no real evidence for it but it is scientific fact." claim. And on a thread about scientific research I feel quite comfortable with being a little harsh about that.

I don't criticise people for not drinking. I don't label people as irrational for not drinking. I will be a little harsh, on science-based threads, to those who proclaim the fact that they believe the opposite of what the science shows as though that's a good thing.

AliGrylls · 07/10/2010 20:51

Does anyone feel that the next logical step for pregnant women is the governments recommendation that all women be fed via IV drips? The dietary stuff is sooooo over the top it drives me crazy.

wouldliketoknow · 07/10/2010 20:55

aligrylls, you are absolutely right, it is my personal opinion, i know a person whose child was born with alcoholic whateverthenameis syndrom, and she did drink in pregnancy, however remote the possibility may be, i didn't want to risk it, i also cannot think of any benefit for the baby... so my choice is not to drink at all.

theyoungvisiter · 07/10/2010 20:56

"I am a scientist of course... oh hang on no just a mum who can actually reason this out for herself and doesnt need any bloody doctor telling me what to do... so why dont they just piss off and research why middle age men have more hair in their nostrils and ears than on their heads.."

I see - so did you reason it out for yourself that folic acid prevents spina bifida? Did you reason out for yourself the precise causes and effects of toxoplasmosis during various stages of pregnancy?

or did you rely on those "bloody doctors" to verify these life-saving facts for you?

Sorry to be snide but my DH is a scientific researcher and I am variously amused, horrified and pissed off by the attitudes trotted out about "scientists with nothing better to do". Some of their research comes to nothing, or produces confusing results - yes. But some of it makes life-saving discoveries. It would be lovely if we knew in advance of every project what the outcome would be, wouldn't it?

Anyway, rant over and can I just do a little cheer for Professor Layton's work on this thread Grin

pinkgrasshopper · 07/10/2010 20:57

Grin Ali! I'm expecting DC1 and am amazed not just at the State's 'advice', but at the fact every other person seems to have the right to judge advise you too.

pinkgrasshopper · 07/10/2010 20:59

Well said YV!

thebody · 07/10/2010 21:08

I didnt took folic acid.. was pregnant in 1989, 91, 96, 2000 (so wasnt advised then) and yes yipee 2004 when it was too late for me to take folic acid because I WAS ALLREADY PREGNANT.. none of my babies has spina bifida.. thank god..

and yes actually I did reason for myself about toxoplasmosis.. i have a cat and the internet... just because I get pregnant a lot doesnt mean I am thick!!!!

of course doctors make life saving dicoveries.... though its a good job my older kids survived being laid to sleep on their backs not on their sides.. as was the mantra from scientists in the 80s...!!!!

I dont know how old you and your husband are but i am afraid that experience has taught me to listen to medical advice.. sure.. and then use my own commen sense and see if the two tally...

SolidGoldBrass · 07/10/2010 21:10

TYV: It's not so much the 'scientists' that piss rational women off, it's the government fuckwits (with no scientific knowledge themselves) and, more to the point, the misognistic newspaper reporters ignoring what scientific evidence there is in order to tell women that they are stupid, that they must shut up and be obedient and that if their babies are born with any kind of problems the first place to look for reasons is what the mother did. Not anyone's genetic history, not errors in hospital policy, and certainly not anything the father did (despite the fact that, for instance, men's use of recreational drugs can affect the quality of their sperm - oh, and domestic violence is not very good for foetal development either).

thebody · 07/10/2010 21:13

and might as well be hung for a sheep as a lamb.. if some of you posters dont lighten up you wont survive the teenage years.. pregnancy and toddlers a bloody doddle... no worries.. nity night...

Piccalilli2 · 07/10/2010 21:24

but thebody.....the information wouldn't be on the internet about toxoplasmosis if the scientific researchers hadn't done their work in the first place. In fact we wouldn't even know it exists, would we?

I drank a middling size glass of red wine once a week during my second and third trimesters in both pregnancies. Couldn't really stomach it in my first trimester (and so missed out on glass of bubbly on my 30th) but didn't beat myself up over the very drunken night out when it later transpired I was actually 4 weeks pregnant.

I do object to being treated like a moron by the department of health though.

thebody · 07/10/2010 21:37

yes I did sy that scientists do a wonderful job.. just may be let us know when its REALLY REALLY important and not just well maybe and hearsay..

As I said before it haunts me that I religiously turned my babies onto their backs in the 80s as scientists told me that they would die of cot death on their sides...(incidentally my mum was dead against it and said it was dangerous how right she was and not a scientist but a sahm of the 60s..). now proved to be total crap..; live and learn.......

pinkgrasshopper · 07/10/2010 21:42

I'm a bit confused body; I thought we were meant to put our babies on their backs these days, as you did? Confused

wouldliketoknow · 07/10/2010 21:44

we are, babies sleep on their back, helps to prevent sudden death syndrom....

louise3louise3 · 07/10/2010 21:45

Pregnant with twins, the nausea was dreadful from about week 6 to week 20. I couldn't lift my head up off the sofa/bed and I lost 2 stone. I craved dry champagne non stop (which I didn't drink and don't like) and the only thing that cured it was a small measure of red wine (roughly 40mls) every night after dinner. Strange because during my first singleton pregnancy I didn't drink or want to drink at all. I have always loathed red wine and went off it as soon as I gave birth at 29 weeks. There must be something in it that quells the sickness because it was the only thing that worked. Ginger and lemon tea was the only thing that worked 1st time round.

pinkgrasshopper · 07/10/2010 21:46

Thanks WLTK...thought I was losing it then. Info overload!!!

Rebeccaruby · 07/10/2010 23:16

When my Mum was pregnant with my twin brothers she was recommended by a doctor to have a bottle of Guinness a day for the iron (1970s). She did this,on top of one or two drinks on a Saturday night (and yes, literally one or two, a very moderate drinker), and a bottle of wine between two at Sunday lunch. My brothers seem OK Grin

The studies seem to suggest that early pregnancy is the most dangerous time for imbibing alcohol, but how many people don't realise they are pregnant for the first few weeks or months? The number of children with Foetal Alcohol Syndrome is very small if having more than a couple of drinks once or twice a week is a factor.

I'm not saying pregnant women should go out and get smashed, but we need to keep a sense of perspective.

LadyWellian · 08/10/2010 00:58

I got shitfaced at about 8wks with DD after I had a very bad bleed and was convinced it was MC number 3 - but stuck to about 1-2 units a week after we went to the hospital next day for a scan they said 'there's the heartbeat (we said there's the what?!!). 1-2 units was the guidance then - 11 years ago - but have to confess that by about 38 weeks (and it was Christmas) I went over it by a fair bit. Neither the 8wk binge nor the Xmas drinking seem to have harmed DD though.

I also [hard hat on] continued to smoke, as doctor told me 1-2 cigs a day would be less harmful than putting my body through the stress of giving up completely.

Thebody is right about things changing - between my sister's two in 1989 and 1991 it went from 'they will die of cot death if you put them down on their back' to 'they will die of cot death of you put them down on their front'.

Oh, and I did take folic acid in all 3, the first of which was in 1998.