Is it really so wrong to punish??

[Zil131]

DS (2.9) is perfectly capable of getting himself to the toilet and having a wee; but has continually pooed in his pants. Patience to ignore what is a concious act (he runs off if I catch him doing it) is wearing thin. We have just come back from a weeks holiday with the grandparents, where regular poo scraping and clothes changing whilst out for the day has got somewhat tedious.
My dad can't believe us modern mums just turn a blind eye...
Anybody punished? I've tried all kinds of rewards, but nothing seems to work.

If I waited till dd 3.4 was ready I would be waiting till she was 5 and noway was that going to happen. I started training dd when she was 2 than gave up as she was not ready, then tried again this summer at 3.1, she is dry in the day, but still have accidents with the poos, she knows when she needs to go but i guess the pooing in the loo will come in time. She can do it and has done. There is noway after how far we have come that we are going back to nappies, what message will that give, it will only confuse. And in this heat I would rather she stayed in pants, as she is prone to nappy rash. At 3.4 i do not want to put her back into nappies just because she has not mastered poos quite yet, would rather clean shitty pants tbh.

That's why its called potty training because you are teaching them a new skill and trying to undo all that they are used to (pooing/weeing in a nappy). For some its going to be easy, for some more difficult as their little ones are more defiant or may not grasp it as quickly, each child is different, what works for some might not work for another.

Waiting until ready can only happen so far, if by the time they are 3.5 they are still 'not ready' you should start training, you might have a child that takes longer than most like my dd. Not every child will have that lightbulb moment and will need your intervention to get things going.

MarthaQuest, you sound unpleasant to be around. I hope you don't have any more children, it would be heartbreaking to watch you berating a three year old for toileting accidents.

Where have I said that I berate 3 year olds?

I've said that I would show disapproval at soiled pants but that would obviously be combined with a great deal of praise and encouragement.

And I find your comment offensive.

i think anything more than 'Oh dear, next time in the toilet' won't help (just enough so DC does not think it is funny!)...parental vigilance and extra encouragement after an accident to ensure it doesn't become a habit.

agree piglet quite often on here you see people making out like if it doen't go fine straight away, it can't be done and you should just give up - some kids would never get it that way.

after all, whatever age you train at, up to that point they've only ever weed/pooed in nappies so they will probably believe that is the right thing to do and require persuasion otherwise...

But there is the added advantage that as they get older nappies begin to feel uncomfortable and they will be aware that other children they know don't wear them. That can me quite an incentive to potty train too.

actually EAP - I do think that sometimes if it doesn't go right fairly quicly you should give up and try later.

I attempted to train DS1 3 weeks shy of his 3rd birthday...........it took nearly 4 weeks before he was dry during the day, and he was 5 before he totally stopped pooing in his pants.

I REALLY wish I'd stopped and waited for a little longer as he so wasn't ready and the frustration of 11,12,13,14 accidents a day didn't help either of us

DS2 wanted to stop wearing nappies at just before he turned 2 1/2. We made some progress, then went on holiday and he had loads of accidents - so we put him back in nappies for the 3 weeks we were away and then tried again when we got back - he got it really quickly

DS3 was 3 at the end of May - he's still in nappies during the day.......

This may be off topic but I thought babies like to copy their parent - does them seeing you use the toilet have n impact?

DD once she clicked what she had to do was fine with wees, yes it took a month, but hey its lovely weather and its good for them to be without. The lightbulb moment came when I swapped her thick training pants for normal pants and she was running round the garden with wee down her leg and was fascinated by it. Though she poos are still hit and miss, I am just glad we are on the right road and are doing really well.

My dd 3.4 has been assessed by the SALT today as having social communication difficulty, so she would not be bothered really whether she was the only one at pre school with a nappy, so would quite happily be in a nappy till 5-6 I presume which we don't want to be really. DD would think it was quite normal to poo/wee in a nappy I just felt it right to train her, considering the lovely weather and I was in the mindset that I dont mind washing pants as long as we get there which we have nearly.

Also in the heat, she gets nappy rash and the DR last year said to leave her without a nappy but I did not fancy it, poo and wee everywhere, but now her understanding is much better and she is dry in the day.

oh DS1 we tried nothing on, pants on, no pants but trousers - he would be soaked..........and not even say anything. I really wish I'd waited a little longer with him.......

We spent the afternoon with friends yesterday. One of them had a 2yr old who had got the hang of wees but was still struggling with pooing in the right place. Both parents spent their time watching her waiting for her to need the toilet - terrified that she would poo in someone else's house - twice she said she needed a poo and twice it was a false alarm. Very entertaining for everyone else So pleased I'm all done and dusted with that now.

When I read the threads on potty training taking months and months on here it makes me really sad I have to confess. I know some children do take longer but most children are able to be dry within a week - if they're ready. And really if your child is wetting 11-12 times a day and there is no improvement whatsoever, why wouldn't you just stop and try again later?

I can't see that keeping on helps anyone - you or your DC. And withholding (poo) is a very real problem which can cause horrible health issues so it really shouldn't be dismissed

Lady my dd when we started 3.1 was ready, but she was stubbon, she would hide in all sorts of places to do it, she would take herself off. I knew that she could recognise when she needed to go and what she had to do, but did not want to. It took a month for her to be dry in the day.

But why was she hiding? That's the thing

some kids do, think that she was just being defiant, and preferred to do it in her pants.

because I might take her to the potty if i see her just about to wee/poo

i think it is very telling that you think your DD is just being defiant by hiding when she poos.

Well a lot of toddlers do hide booyhoo why is it telling i wonder expand

If you read child psychology books it does say that toddlers do hide or take themselves off somewhere to do a poo its one of the signs of being ready. My nephew and niece used to do this too, before they made the transition from nappies to potty. i am a bit booyhoo about your statement tbh.

Its something that she did at first, now she does not sometimes she will take herself to the potty, sometimes she will miss and it will be in her pants. Much better than poo witholding me thinks.

Reward reward reward. When he poos on the potty/in the loo reward. Make it worth his while. Meanwhile, he's getting loads of attention by pooing in his pants.

My goodness some people are being judgy, just because dd used to hide to do her poos and sometimes wee, does not mean I am beating or shouting at her. Yes young children can be defiant its part and parcel of being a pre schooler, testing boundaries. Some do need to read up on child psychology pronto.

nellie - What "evidence based practice" is it that you think points to praise & ignore? If there are any scientific experiments on children in potty training, I would love to hear about them.

Praise & ignore is the current fad, nothing more. If it works for you, fine. Praise & disapprove worked for us. DD was dry in the day within three days and dry in the night within a week. During potty training, she said she wanted the nappy for a poo, mean mummy said "No, you are a big girl now, go in the potty". She held it for a few days, then mean mummy gave her three dried apricots followed by a jug of water, and she ran for the potty. Potty training was done.

(There was no "disapproval" for the few night accidents she had, obviously, more of a quick whipping out of the sheets, changing her, and putting her back in bed)

booyhoo - DD used to hide behind sofas and curtains to do her poos way before she was anywhere near a potty, months before potty training started. This behavious is not "telling" of any parental approach to potty training.