arghhh! how long can this go on? (extended potty training support thread)

[babymutha]

OH KAY.......
I know that DD WILL LEARN TO GO TO THE TOILET at some point before her 18th birthday. But at the moment she's 3 and a half and I am washing out up to 6 pairs of poo encrusted pants and leggings a day some days. It's been over a year of potty training and it's just NOT GOOD.
I've tried all the recommended "stuff", but now my 'inner mother' is telling me to just be PATIENT. When she's ready she'll be ready and this is just her way.

So Please... come share your months/years of unspoken angst. Let us band together in an ongoing struggle for liberation from our offsprings' collective excretions and gain solace in knowing that NOT EVERY CHILD POTTY TRAINS IN A WEEK (or a month, or a year........)

I am so glad to have found this thread, I really believed that my dd was the only 1. She is almost 4 and we potty trained her last January. She can d the wees if she tries, but most of the time she is too busy or distracted. We have started taking her again every 30 mins hoping that she will get bored. The poos are a nightmare, nearly every day she does it in her knickers and doesn't appear to be uncomfortable. We have to sit with her in the bathroom and tell her when she has finished pooing. Concerned that either she can't feel that she needs a poo or she really enjoys the attention. I know that i should move out of the bathroom, but to be honest I am so fed up of clearing up poo! Would love to know where i can get a copy of Mr Poo goes to Poo Land.

Oh thank god it's not just me. I have just about cracked DD 5.3 and am now working on DS 3.6 but we've hit a hurdle see this thread

I have bred a teeny tiny wanker

Oh, please don't let it last another 2 years, i will go mad!!

No you won't Kele79, you will just get extraordinarily adept at removing stains from soft furnishings.

I have just had to scrub poo off my daughters hand and put yet another pair of pyjamas in the wash! I was also lucky enough to step on some that had fallen on the floor. She has pooed her self 2 yimes today at nursery and had to be put in thebath straight after nursery due to the smell.

I really am at my wits end and feel like such a faliure. I am trying not to get really cross with her, but it is so hard.

Does anyone have any other tips? We do stickers, get her to help clear up. We take her to the toilet regularly which works well for wees, but she will not poo!

Please help!

It's not your fault, it's nothing to do with you or HER motivation, it's just she's not there yet. I cannot say this enough. We blame ourselves, or our children for things they just can't control. There is this myth that children turn 2 (or whatever) and suddenly, overnight develop full bladder and bowel control. It's not true.

However in terms of making her poo, is she scared of pooing, does it hurt? Does she know about poo (I know that sounds stupid but does she know what it is, and what it does?) If she associates poo with bad things (ie I poo and everyone gets all cross or upset) then you need to create positive associations (I feel better because I had a poo etc.).

We all get cross, I've been through that too. But it's honestly not anything either of you are doing intentionally. And it WILL GET BETTER.

Tip: get some really nice smelling hand cream for when you have cleaned up the poo, it draws an end to proceedings (also you need it if you are constantly washing your hands after cleaning up ick). :)

Kele - you poor thing. You're not a failure. This is just really, horribly hard for some children. And it is, as a result, unbelievably hard for their parents. And it is bloody hard not to get cross. Big hugs.

Try to remember that it won't last forever. I promise. Though every pair of pants/pjs etc feels like a complete frigging nightmare.

I've got an e-copy of poo goes to pooland - if you PM me your email address I'll send it through.

Stickers didn't work for us - DS just wasn't interested enough in them. For us the marble jar has worked alongside chocolate bribery.

Honestly, for me, it was important that I found a way for me to be able to cope with it and not blame myself/view it as my/my son's failure. I needed a few mins a day to genuinely relax and be calm, on my own. It helped me to be a bit more zen about it. I also took the view that if he did make a total mess of his pants, I'd just throw them out, as I was so bloody sick of scrubbing them that it felt properly cathartic to just get rid. So I bought the cheapest pants I could find.

Just an update from me - we went back to the GP and he's now on Movicol which is helping with the withholding, so he's going more often but still only in pants. We've had to agree with nursery school about changing him. I'm putting him on the loo before bed but he starts crying, says his bottom is "locked" and can he get off. Laugh or cry?!

Thanks whomovedmychocolate and wombonthebroom. I have managed to find a copy of mr poo and am going shopping for marbles and a jar today. She had an accident free day yesterday, so lots of praise. Trying to feel more positive to deal with it and am relieved that i am not the only one experiencing this.

Hurrah for Kele79s DD! :)

Oh thank god there are more of us.

DS1 was a dream at 2.10- mastered poos just after 2, then gradually wees and totally dry day and night a 3. He did it all with just verbal encouragement from me.

DS2 is a nightmare. He's now 3.4 and still 100% in nappies. Other adults (not currently parents of small children) look at me like I'm lazy. I'm not. His poos are horrendous - consistency of soup. There is no point in giving him nappy free time as if a poo comes he has zero time to prepare and they are EVIL!

I think the only avenue is the gp now. Have tried withdrawing various foods from his diet (dairy, juice etc) bu makes no difference. My only comfort is he is a September baby, so no school until next year.

Help!

Oh no captainbarnacle, it sounds awful.

I think you are right to consult your gp now. I know you said that you have removed certain foods, does this include gluten?

I haven't tried the squatting over a nappy ....but I will be doing!

We have about 3 potty books and she loves them...but then sits on the potty, jumping up when she feels the wee coming and then gets stressed out.

TBH I've backed off (again). I honestly think she will do it eventually. I just wish I knew why she was scared of the potty/toilet.

I'm delighted to have found this thread!! DS is 4.3 and regularly wets and poos in his pants. We have been toilet training since August 2010. I have been going insane! Have tried all the tricks - rewards (bribery!), sticker charts, chocolate, prize box, threats, showing no emotion, getting mad, giving praise... I have turned into a total crazy, weeping lots and feeling generally out of control and feel like the most rubbish mother, although having read this thread and a few other things on the internet now I think I need to give myself a break! The key thing I've read is to try and stay calm and relaxed about the whole thing - but that is the hardest thing in the world! That's like locking me in a room full of chocolate cake and red wine and telling me I can't eat or drink! He doesn't seem to be scared of the toilet and we have had periods of 3-4 weeks where we think he's finally got it so I know he can do it but then he just goes back to square one. He doesn't seem to care at all about being in wet or dirty clothes. It drives me insane!

But knowing there are fellow sufferers out there (although I wouldn't wish this on anyone!) is very reassuring and I hope will help to keep me calm. I know he will get there in the end - at least before he leaves home! Just not sure my sanity will make it through!

There have been some useful tips here so I am going to track down the Pooland book and try the marble jar! I am also arranging YET ANOTHER meeting with the HV and will talk to the GP.

I extend my deepest sympathy to all fellow toilet-training sufferers and hope your little ones all get it soon!!

Ds2 and I are seeing the gp in the morning....

Am reckoning he/she will just tell us to come back when he is four :(

An update from me - the Movicol is working in that he is pooing more and he's very good about taking it. we got one poo in the loo last weekend cue lots of over the top praise and choc buttons! Nothing since then.

Ok, gp has referred us to paediatrician straight off :)

that's good captain - at least you'll be able to explore whether there's any physical reason for it. Must be so difficult for your son.

wips - glad the Movicol is working. And although it's only one poo - that's how it starts. DS did that, then a few weeks days later we managed to get another (part of a) poo in the loo, then the gap to the next poo in the loo was shorter, he started doing whole poos in the loo, and finally, once we'd managed to get about 4 days on the trot sorted he seemed to have nailed it. Touch wood, we've not had an accident in weeks now.

Raquelita welcome to the club. And have a and a quality street.

We are in month four.

General pattern is holds in all day (a good 8/9 hours!) until half 3 then has several accidents in a row, even if I pre-empt the first one and she does a massive wee on the toilet.

Generally if I take her to the loo she will produce something, but she refuses to go most of the time.

There is the corner of the front room where she goes and stands when she needs the toilet, so I always ask her when she stands there but she just denies, even when doing the i need a wee dance.

I hate potty training I'm clearly crap at it and DDs lack of cooperation is driving me demented. If she would just come with me when I said it's time to go she would be fine.

ARRRRRGGGHHHH

Also I would like to murder anyone who says she isn't ready yet.

She can and does do it properly, she was actually better at it when we first started than she is now. Last week we had more dry days than wet...

and then this week has been awful again.

It would be so much easier if at least I felt she was making progress instead of 1 forward 2 back all the time.

new to mumsnet but finding this thread really useful in a fore-warned-is-fore-armed way. DS is 2.5 and we've been doing a softly-softly approach for about six months now - he's still in nappies full time (cloth in the day, disposable at night) but we are getting him to sit on the loo (with an adapter seat) and reading him stories like "zoo poo" and "everybody poos" etc. He has done poos in the loo about 3 times but really only "by accident" when we've timed it exactly right, and each time it has seemed to really upset him that it has happened. He does ask to "sit on loo", usually when he spots that one of us is about to use it or if he wants the stories, but 99.5% of the time produces nothing. Whenever we suggest the idea ourselves he refuses. I think he doesn't want to admit to himself that he poos at all - often when he does one in his nappy he will tell us "no poo, just big fart"

Our latest tactic has been to buy some thomas the tank engine pants and tell him he can wear them next time he does a poo in the loo. Whenever I change a dirty nappy I remind him, in a positive way, that he'll be big enough to do all his poos into a loo soon - and if he remembers to tell mummy when he notices that a poo wants to come out, he can have the thomas pants. But although he wants the pants and asks for them regularly it is having no effect on his behaviour.

Am I expecting too much of him? Is he still too young? My mum doesn't seem to think so - she is constantly on at me for not moving faster with this but I feel I can't force him and should wait till he is actively wanting to learn, but that could take years by the sounds of things.

Can I join?!?
DS is almost 3yo. He point blank refuses to sit on the potty. If he can be blackmailed coaxed onto the toilet or potty, he sits down for a nano second and then springs back up shouting 'finished'.

We tried over Xmas but he wasn't having any of it. We left it after a week or so, and because he seemed to get a bit of a 'thing' about it, we haven't pursued it to any great extent. Now and then we ask him if he wants to sit on the potty (NO!), or wants to wear pants (NO!), or wants to go to the big-boys toilets in nursery with his friends (NO!). He just doesn't want to know!

I know he is still relatively young, but we've already had some comments (oh, is he still in nappies) plus school admissions (nursery) questioning the fact he is still in nappies. If anyone can give me hope that he will go from extreme hatred (not even mere disinterest) of potty training to actually wanting to try, that would be great . I feel illequipped, despite DD having very easily potty trained at just over 2yo.

I know this might not be popular, but please consider movicol in this situation. My DD was dry within weeks but it took 8 months before she pooed in anywhere but her pants. She was not physically constipated, it was because of control I think. She'd read the stories and had the treats offered but it just never happened.

Finally we saw a gp, she took movicol, and pooed in the toilet the next day! She's been taking it ever since, it's a long term solution as she still tries to withhold at times. But it's a million times better than it was.

HTH

Hi all, unfortunately I need to join you.

Potty training has not gone well with dd2 at all (in retrospect dd1 was a dream) Started in November at 2.8 (3rd try) She has been dry at night since just after she was 2
She sort of got wees although lots of accidents, didn't get poos or didn't want to do them on the toilet.

We started a reward chart for performing on potty/toilet & halped a little with wees not with poos.

So we were at home together a week & everytime I saw her wanting to poo I took her to the toilet. Nothing & I mean nothing for several days. She had literally just held on to it & severly constipated herself through sheer determination! We ended up at emergency docs on sunday morning as she was so so unwell. Not eating or drinking. Prescribed movicol, suppositories & anaesthetic cream. Back at the docs on wednesday & we were sent straight to hospital. They gave her picolax & said it would work in a few hours - nothing - I had to givea second dose of picolax & then 8 hrs later we had a result - rivers of poo! (sorry tmi)

She is now on movicol permanently, the consultant told me not to put her back in her nappies so for 2 months she has basically been pooing in her knickers. In addition as she got scared about pooing she is doing a little at a time - lots of clearing up. Her wees have got slowly better - she only has a wee accident now if she needs a poo too iyswim

On Monday morning she took herself to the loo & did a poo by herself, I cannot tell you how proud I am. She's also had a clean morning at nursery today so I really feel like she has turned a corner.

Sorry for the essay but I did think my experience might be useful for those in a similar situation.

RedHotPokers - sounds like he is just not ready. I would wait, try lots of stories about potty training, talking to him about how you & dd use the toilet etc. He may yet surprise you