June 2008-keeping little hands off mummy's creme eggs

[poppy34]

New thread here

Deb, keeping everything crossed for you .

DGT, A's sleeping is completely crap at the moment too - have you tried any strategies? We're getting to the point of desperation and don't know what to do .

Hi to everyone else x

Eddie Our favoured strategy is to cross our fingers and hope it gets better soon . Although last night, we did try the 'lets accidentally leave the baby monitor switched off' which seemed to work (in that we weren't woken up, whether or not S actually woke up is another question... ).

He does normally go through phases like this and then just as we reach the really desperate stages he suddenly sorts himself out. I don't mind him coming in with us as long as he sleeps but lately he's regressed back to throwing himself around, kicking, pushing, being generally unsettled. I thought it may be teething but the other symptoms have abated. Nursery asked if they want us to cut back on his day time sleep but tbh I'm not keen on them trying to keep him awake when he's tired. Mind you (and it was unusual) he had a 3 hour nap at nursery the other day!!! We had all been awake most of the night though.

Am desperately trying to cram today. Have resigned myself to the fact that I've not done enough for my exams and therefore don't deserve to pass which is strangely liberating. I'm just going to do what I can and see what happens.... Am taking a break though to go to the Scottish Leaders Debate later. It's on telly up here tonight at 9pm - if you're watch Abdn, Bugger and Biscuits you can try and spot me in the audience

Sounds like you're using the same strategy as us then!

We haven't used a baby monitor for a long time, but we can hear him scream no problem . Problem is A and M don't time their wakings, so once we've got one settled and we're back to sleep, half an hour later the other one's awake .

To say we're knackered would be an understatement.

Enjoy the leaders' debate - do we not get it down here then?

I can't even begin to imagine how we'd cope with two crying at night!!! DH says he always hears S if we accidentally don't have the baby monitor on, but I think it must be more than a coincidence that we always get a good night's sleep when it's not on .

I suspect you don't get the debate in England or Wales although if you can get BBC1 Scotland on Sky or similar then you could watch it that way. I think there might be a Welsh one too. Us devolved nations, we get loads of exciting extras I tell you...

We've never used a baby monitor at night, but I'm a fairly light sleeper and they are just in the next room so I wake up if either of them start crying. H has only just moved into his own room, it's amazing how much bigger our bedroom seems now.

Have fun at the leaders debate DG!

DGT I will look out for you, although we might be stripping wallpaper. We are in the midst of a big kitchen revamp - which is involving moving the kitchen into the dining room to make a big kitchen diner with a utility room and a downstairs loo, instead of a tiny kitchen off a underused dining room. We are one week in, so so far it's the destructive and messy phase.

We took C to the aquarium at Loch lomond today. She was very excited by the 'fishes in the sky' when we went through the tunnel.

biscuits, that sounds like a huge project!

DG, we don't cope! We're utterly on our knees tbh, but what can we do? M is now nearly seven months old and showing absolutely no signs of sleeping through.

Ho hum . . . .

Sounds messy Biscuits. I was all the way up in the cheap seats wearing a purple-ish jumper so you'll do well to see me!

DGT our last place had neighbours that were privately renting and we had to speak to the landlord about a fence and he felt so bad for us that he paid for half - can you ask? Also, the fence wasn't as expensive as I'd been afraid of....

I might not watch tonight - I can see the point the SNP were making about being included because I'm not as interested without Cameron, Clegg, and Brown since they will have the largest influence on the economy etc. But then I think including the SNP and Plaid (and then the Greens etc) would have made the debates unmanageable... Was it good DGT?

Eddie it gets easier - and M's still very young to be sleeping through. A on the other hand should hopefully be a better sleeper. What do you do when he wakes? Is he still in a cot? We just go in and tell Fraser it's the middle of the night and to go back to sleep which he eventually does.... DH sometimes gives him a cuddle but I worry about bad habits.

I know AH, I suppose it's just that there is no sign of him even improving - will it slowly get better or will he suddenly do it? I know it sounds a stupid question but A slept through (dropping night feeds) from such a ridiculously early age that it's all new to us .

As for A, he wakes up crying (really screaming) and we go in, comfort him, stroke his head, etc and tell him to go back to sleep. We try to avoid cuddling too. Sometimes it works, other times he can cry on and off for two or three hours which means multiple trips to his room.

We've tried a night light, door open, door closed, all sorts, but nothing is working.

The hard thing is that they're sharing a room now and when M cries we go and feed him, wind him, change him, etc, while when A cries he just gets told to go back to sleep . I guess his toddler brain doesn't understand why his little bro gets the gold star treatment while he gets nothing .

Having said that though, his sleeping has been atrocious for a couple of months now so it's not entirely connected to sharing.

The other problem is that some time ago we got into the habit of leaving a tommee tippee cup in his cot for him. At the time this worked really well as he would give himself a nighttime drink and not disturb us - now however, he wakes up and cries for it to be refilled and sometimes leaves the top open and soaks himself so wakes up crying too. We know we need to get rid of it but it's become his version of a dummy and those of you whose LOs still have one of those know how hard they are to remove .

Sorry, very me me me. Sleep deprivation is a killer and I'm just not getting much done in life cos I feel permanently knackered all the time .

oh... I didn't realize A was one of those sleeping children Both my two very slowly improved over time but it was so gradual we wouldn't notice until we stopped to think about it. Is he up more than once regularly? Once during the night was pretty much the norm for us until they were both one and I don't think you can do much about that. Because they were smaller I sort of felt they needed to eat more often.

Is A having night terrors? Is there a chance he's not waking up fully? My old supervisor at worked recommended putting toys in bed with Duncan to stop his nightmares and it actually worked. We left him with a mini-football and it seemed to help. My supervisor's wife (they had six kids) said that it makes them feel more secure and at home plus it distracts them.

Could you try switching the cup for a toy?

Sleep deprivation is hell. If our two had slept better I know we'd be trying for a third but DH (who did a lot of the night waking with me for Fraser as he'd seen how hard it was for me to do with DS1) has said he will not go through that again and frankly there's no way I could cope with getting up all on my own.

A slept through from 5 weeks . But, as you can see, it didn't last!

I could have written your last paragraph tbh - it is one of the top reasons we're not trying for anymore . My mum has also commented that if my sister and I had been such awful sleepers my brothers would probably not have been born!

Like you, I'm incredibly lucky that dh is so hands on, but he has also reached his breaking point and said he's just not prepared to take the risk of No 3 being the same. We're now buying a house that means it would be impossible for us to have anymore so that's it .

IKWYM about size too, cos M is so tiny we're doing nothing about stopping his night feeding (usually twice a night ) cos it's the time he takes his biggest bottles (no distractions!) and we can't afford for him not to have them.

A has a cot full of toys, maybe too many I don't know. But he falls asleep cuddling his cup . We could try swapping it and see what happens? I don't think they're night terrors as I have a friend who's DS had those and I think A is actually awake so don't sound the same.

Sorry to bang on about it. I don't mention it much in RL cos I worry people will think I'm being ungrateful, and I'm genuinely not. I'm so happy to have my boys and love them so much, but I'm sooooo tired.

Oh eddie, I hope that A has a better night sleep tonight, you sound exhausted. Tristan was a truly terrible sleeper until he had his adenoids out. Might be worth checking out - you never know?

Eddie, that sounds terrible. Don't feel bad about moaning about it here! Getting one to sleep then 30mins later the other one wakes takes me back to when the DTs were newborns . They were in their own room at 7wks and we never used a monitor at all! I figured if they really wanted us they would let us know. Do M and A have to be in the same room? I know splitting T and E really helped. How is M doing with weaning? I can understand about not wanting to give up on those night bottles - have you had your appt at the hospital about his weight?

DG, sorry you are going through the same thing. I am a big believer in no attention during the night - if T or E wake they just get a quick rub on the back, a 'time for sleep' and maybe Calpol if I think they are in pain, then I just leave the room and let them cry. They always go back to sleep within 10mins but I think that is a lot to do with their own temperament rather than my tactics iyswim. I'm not convinced it would work for every baby I mean or that it can be that easy for everyone.

Abdn, you have good points to make on tranferring tax allowance and it is not something I feel strongly for or again atm, cos I don't know enough about the economies of it. I do agree we need to value SAHMs more, including encouraging more mums to stay at home rather than giving free nursery places. I too was slightly disappointed with the Lib Dems on that issue - it is a bit like inheritence tax I suppose... the masses think free childcare is great so all the parties go along with it. And for some it is great... so not sure on that either!

Eddie that sounds awful. I'm not surprised you're tired, and don't feel bad about venting on here.

My children share rooms, so if T wakes in the night I'm reluctant to let her make too much noise in case it wakes DD1. It's the biggest downside of them sharing a room, I find.

We went to a family party this evening, so the children have collapsed into bed. It was lovely, but made me realise that I'm very crap at that sort of thing. I never have parties, and I think I'd be very tense and twitchy. Wish I wasn't that way - I'd love to be nice relaxed hostess who can handle 15 under-10s racing around the place, but there we are.

Biscuits are you doing all the work yourself? We had our kitchen done when DD1 was crawling and it was pretty grim.

Eddie - been thinking about you, a friend of mine used to put a pile of books in her ds's cot for when he woke up in the night. He also slept in a travel cot in the dining room at his worst as he was disrupting everyone's sleep. He did grow out of it though

how is the house impossible for three?

Bank holiday here but all the dads have gone in to work (American oil companies - they have to give you the statutory leave but they don't close down and we did all make the men have holidays over Easter) so the kids have already been phoning each other (keep in mind DS1 isn't even four yet) to ask each other over to play. They mostly end up at mine because Fraser's the youngest so I find more kids isn't actually more work....

rolf no, we've got a man doing the work, we're just doing the cosmetic stuff, so wallpaper and paint - far too complicated for us to do ourselves! we did put in a new kitchen in our last flat, but this is on a different scale!

DH at work here too AH, just a normal monday for us despite the public holiday! (although quite impressed that our kitchen man is here today!)

Eddie there's nothing worse than being tired with no end in sight. I feel for you. hopefully A will suddenly revert back to his old ways.

C has developed a peppa pig obsession. I am thoroughly fed up of it. there's only so much Peppa I can take!

I love the sleeping in the dining room! Deb, I am crossing my fingers for your potential buyers as well

Eddie/DG, I would cut down massively on daytime sleep if poss if they are waking at night. DG, especially if he is at nursery then they can deal with his grumpy tired behaviour! Do they have a fave tv show or book character you could get a teddy of? E loves her igglepiggle and cuddles it all night. eddie, maybe you need to bite the bullet on the beaker if he is crying to have it refilled, it will be hell for a few nights but just don't let him have it and tell him 'there's no drink tonight'. Do you think he is actually thirsty? Keep a beaker of water in his room so you can give him a sip of that when he wakes. If he truly is thirsty that will be enough. I really hope it improves for both of you soon. Sleep deprivation is the worst .

T and E have got into Bob the Builder just recently, they haven't really seen it much on tv but they have a pair of PJs with him on, so E goes 'wob de wuilder - pan we pix it!'

Ethan loves Mr Tumble on Something Special!!

Tbh Neenz I don't really think it's down to too much daytime sleep. We've just got into the bad habit of letting him come into bed with us too often which means if when he wakes he just won't settle again till he comes in with us. Once my exams are out of the way we'll dedicate a few days to getting back into a better habit again. He has a teddy at night (peter 'babbit' ) and a dummy - he just prefers mummy and daddy cuddles.

I think it does all come down to temperament - we do use CC occasionally and it can work but it takes a whole lot longer than 10 minutes. If I went in and told him to go back to sleep he'd still be screaming blue murder an hour later. At the end of the day we have neighbours with children too. We're fine tbh - very sleep deprived just now, but it comes in temporary waves for us so I'm ever optimistic that it will be better soon.

Rolf I love having people over but a whole bunch of under 5's? Nooooooooooooo!

Have forgotten what else I was going to say but I should be revising so no bad thing. Abdn the debate was interesting - a bit more lively than the UK ones so that was good.

Oh, I remem ber - Abdn I've been deliberating over what to say re: the neighbours and fence. I do know the people who own the property and will need to speak to them because the fence is on their side. I'm not sure that they will be thrilled at the thought of replacing it so I think we'll have to foot the bill ourselves. Knowing the DH of the house, I think if we let him know just how awful the garden is he'd go round and have a go at them and then they'd know we complained. The current tenants are a bit intimidating so am a bit apprehensive about that. I've had a look at fencing online and looking at fence panels alone I think we're looking at around £400 - £500 to do both sides. Then there's all the accessories like posts and cost of labour if we get someone to do it for us. It'll be worth it if helps sell the property down the line. PITA though.

We got our fence done and I think it was only £500 for about 20 meters - including installation. But maybe my memory's hazy... and we only put in a 4 foot fence because while we hated the neighbours, we knew that a 6 foot one would look a bit anti-social when we went to sell up.

We need to get 6ft panels abdn to hide the eyesore next door, but I am worried about how it would make the garden and of course they really nice panels are bloody expensive.

We put in a 6' fence all the way round . Maybe Steroid Bob has a point

rolf it was a small garden in an ex-council semi where most the gardens were still shared. We've inherited 6" fences in this house and it doesn't feel at all the same...