radical cross stitch, theological debate, Easter bunnies, changing bags,and a baby brother...it must be June 08!

[spongebrainbigpants]

Welcome to our new thread .

Biscuits, don't know whether to laugh or cry at your comment about teenagers! Please don't let them take that long to become good sleepers!!

Essie, I was only ribbing you girl - I know Isetyn was a shocking sleeper so I am pleased for you . It's just last night co-incided with dh's first day back at work today - I haven't been on my own with the boys for three weeks now cos had my mum up, then the snow so dh was at home, then dh on holiday. It's been really hard work - M was awake from 9 til 5pm (literally just gone to sleep in the last 15 mins) so I am competely knackered again and feeling low .

I'm actually really seriously considering cutting my mat leave short and going back to work soon - any thoughts? I'm just not enjoying mat leave this time round like I did last and finding it so hard being at home with a toddler I can't reason with and a baby that won't sleep . Even if I just went back two days a week it would give me a break?

poppy and Amber - hope all this isn't putting you off . I'm sure most people cope with two much better than I do .

Viva - I do have slender thighs!!! Sadly I also have a post christmas mummy tummy so its not as attractive a picture as it might sound... It is a pain when buying boots though as they are all too big around the calf and then I look like a little girl in my mum's boots.

Sponge - I wouldn't rush into anything you might regret/feel hugely guilty over later with regards to going back to work sooner. Can you put them into nursey a couple of mornings a week to give yourself a break while still on leave? Think of it as an investment in your sanity. It is really hard looking after a baby and toddler, but it does get much much easier after the 6 month mark. Honest.

Is now the time to point out that J has slept through only twice in his entire life?? Although he is normally only up once or twice a night now, as opposed to the three/four times it was just a few months ago.

Hi all- glad I am not the only one completely lost by name changes.

sponge you are not putting me off but reinforcing what I already think that two would be hard work. Having only recently come to a point where think I can juggle everything (although sometimes with
dificulty hence absence from here ) I do wonder whether I really want another one. Also echo what Essie (sorry can't get head round new name) says about pregnancy being horrendous - more mentally than physically. I really do think should appreciate what I have got. That said when I said all this to dh he was very sympathetic but not so much about me actually going onto some form of contraception...

And sponge it's a result day If e sleeps beyond seven and doesn't wake in the night at the moment...
And ah ask me in a couple of weeks as starting hunt for replacement . Nanny really helping with tips- have to say watching how tough she is finding being pregnant puts me off too .

Amber how did first day go?

Biscuits that ice sounds dreadful - not sure what footwear would help.

sybil, A does go to nursery two days a week already but that is going to have to come to an end soon cos it really is a very expensive luxury that I won't be able to afford once my SMP finishes .

IKWYM about not rushing into anything though - and that I'm sure it will be easier when M is 6 months and also when Spring comes (which is about the same time). That just seems an awfully long way away right now .

poppy, I'm not surprised you found pg mentally horrendous . Good luck with the nanny search - how long do you have?

First day was great - there were loads of kids at the nursery not just the two or three they had at the last one and lots of male nursery workers which I find refreshing. They all sat down and had crackers with tuna and cucumber slices which was great. Luke was making a pillow mountain within about 5 minutes which the other kiddies then played on - was great. He's in for 2 hours on his own tomorrow.

poppy - I am so going through what you are at the moment although I know I can't have any more without help anyway. Personally, I know I will probably be suicidal for the first few months but I want Luke to have a sibling as he'll be spoilt enough as it is.

Amber I'm sure that postponing the IVF for a while is a good idea. I hope you use the time whilst L is at nursery to recharge your batteries.

Sponge what a shame that you'll need to stop nursery for A. You sound exhausted. When you think of all your body has been through in the past few years. two children very close together, a non-sleeper, dark cold winter days...You are doing really well but I'm sure spring seems a long way away for you. How easy would it be to slot back into your job? Something nice and dossy would be just right but I know teaching isn't like that!

Thank you Rolf . The job I'm on mat leave from at the moment is a fairly dossy council job but I hate it . I want to go back to teaching but I'm having second thoughts while the kids are so young - I can't imagine doing a teaching job with two boys who don't sleep through the night .

Maybe will think about my options in the next few weeks and speak to my line manager about what days I could do. Maybe just two days a week?

My mum is up (again!) tomorrow so will also ask her - she is very wise .

Amber, glad L settled in well - it sounds lovely .

'Tis me again, DomesticGoddessInTraining formerly knowly as bitofadramaqueen .

Sponge I'm sorry you're feeling so low right now. I also echo the sentiment not to rush into any decisions. If you go back and hate it you can't change your mind and go back on maternity leave. Also, if you're not keen on your job you might be sat their thinking 'what the feck am I doing here instead of spending time with my babies'? I have no idea what having two under two at home is like and I take my hat off to anyone who does it. I know I found the first 6 months dreadfully hard though and if you'd asked me at 4 months if I wanted to go back to work I'd have said 'yes, please!'. I do remember it getting sooooooo much better at 6 months though. I'm glad you're mum is up again tomorrow to give you some support.

Glad that Luke has settled in well at nursery Amber - it is indeed refreshing to hear that there are some male workers. Such a shame it's such a rarity.

TediBers S has been sleeping till after 8am this week - but he was up in the night loads last week (in fact didn't go to sleep till 4am one night) so I feel we earned it. That 6am alarm clock is gonna hurt tomorrow though!

I'm in the 'don't really think we'll be having another' camp this week. I was chatting to someone who had a baby at 40 the other day and she talked about how physically demanding it was. There's no way we'd have one for at least 2 years, by which time I'll be 39 and I'm not sure I'd want to go through all of this again (if I was actually able to get pregnant by then with the old tick-tocking biological clock). I feel bad for S not having a sibling though.

I've got Duo boots here too! Definitely for smart though. I was sooooo pleased when I discovered Duo; I'd spent my adult life all because I couldn't get knee boots to fit. Oh, the shame of trying them on in trendy shops and not actually being able to zip them up Am your slender thighs and calves sybil !

Sympathies on the varicose veins etc Rolf . I've got all sorts of wierdy marks on my legs since pregnancy - I think they might be thread veins or something (have no idea really). Occasionally wonder if I could get them zapped or something.

Must tell this story before I go - DH and I have booked some flights to Southhampton tonight for a wedding later in the year. Flights were £2.76 pp each way. What was the total - £280! And it wasn't even Ryanair! Bloody ridiculous. It wasn't even the taxes that we took issue with - about £100 was for bags, booking seats, cc booking fee and 'transaction charge' (whatever that is). Ridiculous.

Big wave to Poppy and Paro and everyone else I haven't mentioned!

Sponge - Oh I remember those days when the boys were small, they could be very long, Tristan was a terrible sleeper too and a colicky baby.I went back to work(mornings) when Tristan was only 5 months old , as it was the start of the school year and it worked well despite the lack of sleep, but only you can make the decision.

Evening - who was it who thought my name means Teddy Bears Picnic? Not far off at all! Will explain it if I stick to it.

Sponge you've got to be able to take it if you give it you know! No, seriously, I haven't forgotten how hellish it was, and I'm with Goddess in wondering whether I'll have another. I never wanted to have an only child, but pregnancy was awful, so was the lack of sleep. And (I was talking to a RL friend about this the other day - she has a DS 2 weeks older than Iestyn) I think I missed an useful window of opportunity. When Iestyn was 6m +, sleeping was quite erratic, and I might as well have got pg. Then when he was 1, it got a bit easier, and that would have been ok too. But now I'm loving him (obv. I mean loving being with him - I always love him more than anything in the entire world) and enjoying his company etc etc, and I don't want to lose that through having another. So there will be a good gap. Plus I made a Situation for myself at work and getting pg now or within the next year would really mess that up! (Before Christmas I did the whole 'my child is more important than my job' thing, so I'm not doing it again in a hurry! )

Sponge I'm one who's all in favour of work. Then again, I'm not in a conventional job, and it's more than a job, but also a flexible one. Doesn't stop the guilt though - despite loving my job, I still have little guilt pangs gnawing away at me. I adore being with Iestyn but I also enjoy picking him up after time at work.

Must go to bed now - I've been drinking Winter Pimms!

That'll teach me - first day back at work tomo and S has only just (hopefully) gone back to sleep after waking around 10.

Aaaarrrrrgggghhhhh, still awake!

Rolf didn't know that your DH was another ex-canadian type. Yes it does make the snow familiar but in so many other ways I'm just not prepared for it. What part of Canada did he live in?

biscuits I assume that's a rogue pee not a rouge one. See? I speak a bit of French....

sponge a close friend who had a 15 month age gap was desperate to get back to work (for that matter so was my mother in law who had a 18 month gap). As long as it's part time it should be okay but I'd worry if it was fulltime as my friend seems to abhor the idea of staying at home now and i think it's because all she can remember is the really tough bit with O was born rather than all the lovely times when she just had F (she loved being a SAHM then and told me she didn't want to go back to work). Balance in anything is always good....

(But I never found going back to work restful - just different. No chance of affording a morning of childcare for both boys instead? Or a childminders for four hours during the school day? And you could nap and read a magazine and recover? I know it sounds like a luxury but it's probably more of a necessity. Right now you've no time off. (reiterating that it gets so much easier. Now it's easier for me to have both boys than just Fraser as they play together and I've been having the four year old across the street over as much as possible to as it somehow makes things easier again.))

sibling talk - neither DH nor I are close to our brothers so I don't think any child needs a sibling. It's me that likes the idea of having multiple children and if pregnancy and the first year wasn't so horribly crap, I bet I'd be trying to get pregnant right now. DH is much less keen though and is focusing on the more practical lifestyle side (everything I want for us is easier with just two kids - like backcountry camping with three kids who can't carry big packs or biking with three kids - it just wouldn't work as well).

essie I thought it sounded like Teddy Bears Picnic too but wondered if it was just because I sing that song about three times a day.

sybil uggh! I think your J does deserve the award for most difficult sleeper - he was the one who would only feed when asleep right? I'm glad it's getting better at least.

I need to book a holiday in April at Easter with my parents and the boys. It's the only time my parents can come though. My Dad says he'd like to go to Cornwall (we've never been) - any recommendations? We're thinking self catering caravan at a site with a pool.... Or I'm wondering if the budget might stretch to France instead... (it's just the cost of flights).

I did my 2010 goals (sounds better than resolutions) and realized I need to make 6 baby gifts in the next six months. I'll probably do quilts but I was also thinking of making simple nappy bags that would hang off the back of a buggy and are gender neutral. Just simple messenger style ones. Can I ask for advice? What's the most important feature in a nappy bag?

Speaking of bags, DH bought me this as my big birthday gift (i made out like a bandit this year after some spectacular nothing years). It's just big enough for two nappies and a pack of wipes plus all of my stuff and I love that it's more of my bag than the boys....

Finally - deb asked about my birthday dress. I have the replacement and wore it yesterday and I love it. Now I'm just waiting for the refund on the other one. It's from http://www.howies.co.uk/product.php/2225/9/ howies. Yes, I have a very soft spot for howies stuff... wish it was cheaper but it's definitely replaced boden in my affections.

oh - and DGT hope you had a bit of sleep last night.

First day back at school here and it's a snow day. I had a total of one snow day in my entire school career in Canada - my mother was very lucky . We're (being myself and the other mums) taking the kids sledding at 10.

I like that Howies website too. That dress and bag are lovely.

DH lived in Montreal, then Toronto. Our surname is (Scottish) Canadian.

I wrote a long post before and J came along and deleted it, he's in bed now so I should be safe.

DG - hope you got some sleep in the end.

Aberdeen - Love the Howies stuff but it is out of my price range, in fact most shops are .
On change bags I was intending on making one myself but typically have left it too late as I'm not sure I could reach past my belly to the sewing machine, check out craftster for ideas, look out for things that say tutorial in the title. This for example doesn't look too hard at first glance although I would pick a different fabric myself.
I've only been to Cornwall once, it was nice but it was summer and it was really really busy and correspondingly expensive. I prefer somewhere like Northumberland which is quieter, has the choice of countryside and miles of lovely empty beaches and lots of castles etc to explore. But at Easter you might get better weather in Cornwall.

Sponge - I'd say don't go back to work, it's that time of year where winter seems to be dragging on but spring will come and it would be awful to be sat in work in a few months time when the weather is nicer (optimism) thinking about how you could be at home enjoying time with your boys. I'm sure the sleeping will improve as well. Can you get a break in some other way?

On the pregnancy thing I'm very pleased to be getting near the end of this pregnancy. I've gone from being keen to have more than 2 kids to liking the idea that I will never be pregnant again, but I did want J to have a sibling so if anything awful happens in the next few weeks I would consider doing it again.

Rolf - I think that geocaching thing looks brilliant, we have loads around us. Can't wait for J to be old enough to do that sort of thing, although I will probably have been out and found all the local ones before then

Poppy and Paro - good to hear from you both.

I'm very reluctant to go out at the moment, it's really icy round here and as I can barely walk as it is I'm terrified of falling or slipping and pulling something, I just can't end up stuck in bed with J to look after.
I'm waiting for the midwife to ring me, I have an appointment for this afternoon and DH can't get off work that early, they won't give me a later appointment (which he could make) as she has no one else to see. I don't want to go on my own as walking across their car park with J would be bad enough but most of the time there is no space in their car park and you end up in the P&D up the road. I feel like I'm being a bit pathetic and if any one of the things was different, if I could definitely park nearby, if it wasn't icy, if I didn't have J with me, then I wouldn't be worried but as it is I feel a bit stubborn about not wanting to risk it. At the same time I want to see the midwife because it's just the last week that this pain has developed. Wonder if she will come out to me, probably unlikely!
Sorry for the rant.

I'm sure there was loads of other stuff I wanted to say but I'd better go and have a shower before J wakes up.

Just to remind you all, it's ex-Whinegums here.

First day back at work today, but I'm working from home (obviously really hard!). It took me 2 hours to take B to nursery and come back and I passed a horrendous accident on the way back. Stupid people who can't drive in bad weather, looked like everyone was driving far too close to each other. Not surprised - I had a stupid bitch tailgating me this morning on slidey untreated roads, and then when she finally overtook me the stupid stupid arse hadn't even cleared her back window! And the number of people I've seen peering out of a tiny square of windscreen they've cleared defies belief!

Like Biscuits, I too want to stay inside until Easter.

Enjoy sledding Abdn.

Can I just say B has never really slept through, the longest has been from 10pm til 5am, and of course that was the night I lay awake worrying about him. At the moment a good night is if he only wakes up twice after I've gone to bed and once before that.

I never wanted more than one anyway, so that's not an issue for me. I sometimes lurk on the one child boards, but they make me feel quite sad that so many people are sad they've only had/are only able to have one. I know B has his two half sisters, but they're so much older than he is, and he's my only one IYSWIM, so I think of him as an only. I much prefer it - we'll be able to do things with him that we wouldn't do if we had more. I've also mentioned the horrid relationship I have with my brother before, I think that is certainly the deciding factor for me. There are others too, but that is the main one.

Anyway, I must go and do some proper work, I'm on a publication deadline!

It has taken me AGES to catch up! Been away this weekend at a baptism in Oxford. I didn't leave the house for seven days before that and feel like doing same now, the snow is so bad here!

I think I can just about keep up with the name-changers - although I thought Biscuits would be Puree cos she is quite witty with her names, and i thought Goddess would be Amber! at the £280 fare to Southampton Goddess!

Sponge, I wouldn't rush back to work, as others have said you can't change your mind and like abdn I don't find work a rest, even though I only do two days, you still have to do the other stuff like cleaning, cooking, shopping and washing (and getting the kids ready to go to nursery) so it just adds more stress imo. It won't be long now before M is 6mths and it is spring and it will all be much easier then. Is M in a routine like a GF routine? Could that help? At 12wks the DTs were sleeping through and I am sure it was the GF routine that did it. Could some gentle (very gentle) sleep training help him nap in the day? eg putting him a very dark room before he gets overtired, lying him in his moses basket and shushing him/holding his hand/stroking his head until he drops off? Did you ever see a cranial osteopath? I really liked the Baby Whisperer routine as well, where they wake, feed, have activity and then go down for a sleep in a 2-3hr cycle. You have to watch closely for signs of sleepiness eg rubbing eyes or yawning and then get them into their cot. Having two under two is just about getting through the day so don't put too much pressure on yourself to be a domestic goddess. Hope things improve soon.

Amber, I think you have definitely done the right thing postponing IVF - the fitter and healthier you are the more chance the IVF will work so spending a month relaxing and eating well will really help. Optimum Nutrition Before, During and After Pregnancy by Susannah Lawson and Patrick Holford is an excellent book with lots of tips on how to get your body ready for a successful pregnancy.

I am still feeling very rough/tired with MS. I felt pretty well on Sunday and I was a bit scared it had all come to an end but I feel rotten again now so that is good . Yesterday was the first day I was on my own with DH back at work and I was so exhausted I was in bed at 9pm. Got up this morning at 8.30am The house is a mess but I can't be arsed to do anything . Moving just wears me out! I have a ton of ironing to do though which really can't wait.

I am supposed to be back at work tomorrow but with the snow so bad and not feeling so great I am definitely not going in now. I was going to give it a go even though I feel sick, cos there is a rest room at work with a sofa in that I can nap on . But it took me two hours to get there last time it snowed so no way. I am going to the City v United semi final tomorrow night as well and I thought a day at work plus the game would be a bit much to handle, so I am just going the game now [naughty]

Bugger - bad drivers, another reason to stay in!

Neenz - glad to hear you are OK, apart from the MS and tiredness. I have to say I disagree with you doing the ironing, that isn't an important job.
I think I must really be nesting as I'm considering ironing all the baby clothes I have washed and I only iron for weddings and interviews, will have to try and find the iron first, by the time I've done that I'll probably have run out of energy.

J just made me laugh. He had wandered off into the kitchen so I came in to see what he was up to and he was stood there eating a whole apple! I don't know how he got it off the worktop, it was in a glass fruit bowl and that is still in the same place and intact. He's really pleased with himself and has kept hold of it throughout lunch and has managed to gnaw through 3/4 of it so far and is still tucking in. I hadn't really been giving him apples as I was cutting bits off for him and he has struggled a bit in the past due to his lack of teeth but it seems the answer is to chuck him a whole one!

Not heard back from the midwife yet, will give them a ring in a bit.

Thank you for all your lovely words of support .

I definitely wouldn't go back to work f/t - don't think I'd cope with the exhaustion - but we did the maths yesterday and worked out if I went back 2 days a week I would clear £50 pcm after childcare costs! So, it would just be for my sanity - and as some of you have said, would sitting in an office doing a job I hate make me feel any better anyway?

Neenz, I have tried to do some gentle sleep training with M but the problem is I can only do it on the two days that I have A in nursery. It takes up to half an hour to settle him in his moses basket and of course I can't leave A unsupervised downstairs for that long! Any tips from mums of more than one?

Having said that, he went down in his moses basket quite quickly this morning (maybe we're making some progress!) and slept from 11am til 12 - he woke up just as A went to sleep!! But I did have a friend here who could keep an eye on A while I settled M. Complicated isn't it?!

M crying again - must go!

Got very confused reading back over the last few days with all of the name changes!

Amber It really is wise to wait until you are ready to start IVF. I had measles and a miscarriage a few weeks before getting pregnant with ds and my body just was not ready for it and it was by far my worse pregnancy as I was so worn out. In hindsight I should a waited before trying again but of course I wouldn't change ds for anything in the world!

SPonge things will get easier. I've found it quite hard , very hard at times with the three of mine. The hardest time was probaby between about 3 or 4 months until ds was about 14 months.I am feeling more in control now.

Debs Your dad sounds very mean, very sad that he can't be happy for you as you are happy.

DD2 had an ear infection over christmas but thankfully it has settled. I wonder if her grommit has fallen out as she was oozing pus for days. SHe still hasn't finished her antibiotics so when she has will ask the gp to have a look in her ear.

sponge I have to take ds out for a walk to get him to sleep during the day (though he does fall asleep on the sofa in the afternoon if that fails). It works for us as he can sleep up to four hours and it's really good to have a reason to get out of the house.

Sponge when my boys were little I took the view that I just didn't have the luxury of settling a child to sleep. It was into the cot and run . DS2 would really kick off just when DS1 was in the bath, and at that age I couldn't leave DS1 unsupervised so, hard as it was, I had to leave poor DS2 to get on with it. After a little while he just learned to drop off to sleep on his own. It really wasn't about choosing a strategy though, it was just the lesser of two evils - not letting DS1 drown meant DS2 had to cry.

Ha Neenz if only I was a Goddess even a domestic one! Thanks for the book advice. I am shite at things like that. My big thing I need is sleep. That should do more for me than anything else. I get my new bike on Thursday (eek have not ridden a bike in 2 years) and I am hoping a bit of cycling might do for exercise. Unfortunately it seems that we are on for three days of snow in the SE again. I am so sick of it. We've already had one load and the whole world ground to a halt.

Neenz I also think ironing is not an ugent task by any means. I specifically buy clothes that don't need ironing! Hope the MS clears up soon.

ktpie - impressed at the apple. If it were Luke you would have heard an almighty crash followed by crying. Lue never eats apples unless he's at nursery anyway!

Just put Mr Luke in for day 2. He has 2 hours alone. Obviously he bawled when I left. Hope he'll be OK bless him. We did painting again today. He loves it but it's just so messy. His high chair now is all shades of the rainbow and weirdly even though I tried bleach, it wont come off.

sponge I was the same income bracket as you - £80 pcm for three days a week. It just wasn't worth it to me once we had the problems with D being bullied. And once M is older you'll be able to sleep train him at night if you need to or he'll start sleeping better on his own. Once they do that, the days get easier including getting him to sleep!

Amber I'm sure L will be fine - good for you for painting with him! You're brave! That's the best thing about nursery, that they do those sorts of messy play things with them.

Rolf I grew up in toronto

ktpie my parents are keen to try cornwall or devon as we've already done the lake district and the peak district and they did the Cotswolds on their own last year. I'd rather just stay close to home but I know I'm totally dull nowadays. And I love the look of that bag - think I'll be doing something simpler though as I'd need to make six of them...