radical cross stitch, theological debate, Easter bunnies, changing bags,and a baby brother...it must be June 08!

[spongebrainbigpants]

Welcome to our new thread .

Bugger! Just lost long post .

Your antral count is obvsiouly low Amber, or you wouldn't need IVF - but it's a follicle count of 5 or less that is an indicator that IVF is unlikely to work at all, so you are at least on the side of having a chance of getting some eggs.

Are you having ICSI or IVF? Just wondered cos of dp's sperm count.

As for alcohol, I abstained completely but my consultant was relatively relaxed about the odd glass of wine - I wouldn't get pissed though!

Bollocks, DS2 has swallowed a £1 coin. DH is away so we're looking at DIY surgery if there's a problem.

Amber it's a foreign country to me, but it doesn't sound too bad for you - there is hope. Bet it's useful having Sponge here. (Sponge, I'm going to say it again - you can really help people with your knowledge and background. )

Things are a lot more calm here now - it's all finally sinking in, and I'm beginning to feel normal! (I've had a headache for over a week, though!) But Iestyn isn't very well - he's not very ill either; but on Friday he woke up from his nap unhappy and I took him to the GP and he had an ear infection. He got antibiotics, but he still had a really rough sounding cough which got worse (sorry, distracted because that and the previous sentence are in strict metre according to the rules of Welsh metrics! ) and he had a temperature last night. But after Calpol he slept through (more or less), and was in really good spirits in the morning and fine in nursery. But then again towards the evening he got unwell, so I got another GP appointment (he screamed blue murder throughout) and I had to go to Tesco for the new antibiotics. And he was Mr Sociable in Tesco's. So it comes and goes...

Anyhow, the whole point I'm trying to make is that I've made the right decision in staying here; and it may not be that bad career wise either but only time will tell. (Today - less than 12 hours since the deal was done! - I've been given an important and public role within History. )

Anyways, I'm now going to be nice and answer to everyone - thanks to all of you for your support and comments. Deb, I really did feel like I had everyone's support on here, and I'm so touched that you said you were all going through it with me.

Ktmincepie I'll start with you - how's the pg going? Thought I'd ask! Excited? He/she moving? How are you feeling?

Deb I'm going to blow really hard and hope the snow blows over to Austria! (It's mostly gone here but we should get a fresh batch overnight. I should stress this is only on the mountains.) Sponge I'm still trying to get a photo for you - it's hard, because when it's that cold you don't often get clear weather.

Sybil how's the sleep? I'm not doing any silly snow dances but I'll do a sleep dance for you and Whinegums. I was thinking of you the other day, Sybil - I remember the first time Iestyn slept through, and then he didn't the next night; that was ten times more painful than the previous 8 sleepless months!

Neenz how pg are you? Go on, spill all the details - did you suspect? (I did with both my pgs, really early, before my missed period - sorry can't remember the acronym for that.) Feeling sick? Think it's twins? ( but actually you might not find that funny so sorry in advance.)

OK, monster post so I'll stop now. People, I need to get in a festive mood! I forgot about Christmas and Advent - so help me to get festive!

Fuck Rolf! I'd be down A&E by now but they would just say it'll come out the other end I know. I am paranoid about Luke picking up money and eating it (he still eats everything!).

Sponge/Holly we are having ICSI. Mark's sperm count isn't too bad, it's 21m. I have just read the literature - so many drugs....

Good God, Rolf! How old is DS2? If you're going to do home surgery and it involves sharp objects like knives, get some vodka. Or maybe just get some anyway?
Was going to ask about your plastering! How is it? I'm in the glamorous world of bathroom sealant here.

Amber please tell me what 21m means. Because in my head it's 21 men. It can't be, can it?

Essie, thank you . Not sure who I could help and how, but I do keep an eye on the conception boards here and try and help anyone facing this situation cos I know how bloody terrifying it can be .

Amber, there are a lot of drugs, but I didn't find them too bad tbh. But different women react differently obviously, I'll keep fingers crossed they won't make you feel too crap.

Rolf, have you phoned NHS Direct? Does DS seem in any discomfort? Poor little mite .

Thanks for the dancing and the blowing!!It worked,we had snow last night and the lifts will open on Friday, so you can all stop dancing round now and get on with the knitting - those cork things are lovely!

Amber - good luck with the IVF

Spider - where are you? How's Ethan's birthday buddy doing?

Essie - glad you sound so much more positive

You're all being much more sympathetic than me . He is 8 and was pratting around at cubs and decided it would be funny to hide his £1 in his mouth and then do a big "reveal" . But he swallowed it.

He swallowed a penny about 5 years ago and was fine. He had a sore tummy, then had to race to the loo and had violent diarrhoea. But a £1 coin is bigger and thicker so I guess it will be more painful for him.

Am I being really bad just leaving him?

Rolf - those being sympathetic haven't got 8 year old boys!! You're not being bad, the worse bit's over - he didn't choke!!just keep an eye on him!!

Those of you in London - what's Southwark like? Hoping to come with NIgel in Feb for 1 night, need somewhere very cheap(in case I can't come) to stay for 1 night so Travelodge southwark has the best reviews of them. I know they're basic, but we'll only be there for 1 night, and we'll be going out for a meal etc in the evening, then Nigel's at his meeting the next day.What do you think - it's only £35, and then we can get breakfast somewhere on the way to the meeting(trinity music next to MI5)so ideas of somewhere to go for breakfast?

Rolf - how is your DS? I read something ages ago somewhere on MN I think which said something like:

If your first child swallows a pound coin you rush them to A&E, if the second child swalllows a pound coin you wait for it to pass through, if the third child swallows a pound coin you dock it from their pocket money.

I'm sure if it causes a blockage you will know about it as he will be in agony, will he be wanting to retrieve the £1?

Essie - it sounds like it's worked out pretty well in the end. Hope you can manage to relax a bit now and enjoy Christmas.
I'm fine, thanks for asking! Massive now (32 weeks ) and still really really tired (can manage 2 naps a day if I get chance). Baby is very active and doing some painful kicks, had a lovely blow to the liver at 5am yesterday which hurt for ages. Feeling a mixture of excitement and trepidation. Looking forward to not being pregnant, getting the birth over and done with (although I feel a lot more relaxed about that this time, perhaps stupidly ) and of course baby being here but slightly scared of the first few months of coping with a newborn and a toddler on my own, DH will only get 1 week of paternity leave, we don't have/can't afford any sort of childcare and there is no one local who can help, particularly during the day, friends are all at work. I'm looking forward to the summer when baby will be 6 months and J will be 2 years, in my head things will get easier then (and I'm going to merrily ignore anyone who says otherwise!)

Whinegums - I like knitting on circular needles, find double pointed ones a bit of a juggle to get going but then they are fine. I only recently managed to learn crochet, had tried before and failed but this time it all came clear, I love it, I find it quicker than knitting, more flexible and toddler friendly, the hook is blunter for a start and if he gets hold of it it only unravels one stitch at a time and is easy to pick up again - bonus!
I'm going to let Essie carry on believing I'm a fast knitter! Not really, my Nan however knits at the speed of light.

Amber - IVF doesn't sound like much fun but do you feel better that something is being done now? Will be thinking about you and keeping my fingers crossed.

Sponge - why are they filming you? How is it all going?

I had things to say to everyone else but I've rambled on too much and run out of time, I should be in the shower now, so a quick hello to everyone else!

Lol Rolf - sorry for being too sympathetic! I wouldn't take him anywhere, but maybe just check with NHS Direct as to what they would suggest. If it hurts on the way out then, as long as no harm done, lesson learned!

Deb, yay for the snow!

I'm feeling a little more human today - dh took M and I had A last night. He woke once at 3am when I had to go in and settle him, then he cried out briefly a couple of times at 5am and 6ish, then slept til 7.30am. So I got some sleep .

Listening to dh talk to the mobile mechanic at the mo (he comes round to service dh's car, very useful!) and they're discussing nappies and childcare arrangements - very metrosexual!

ktpie, we did our spooky x-posting again!

Coping with a newborn and a toddler, hmm, I'm probably not the best person to talk to about 'coping' . The only thing I could advise is to be organised (i.e. get everything you need ready the night before), get into a routine that suits you as soon as possible (M goes to bed at 7pm so we have a couple of precious child free hours) and sleep whenever you can. I'm in bed by 9.30pm every night now. Oh, and use a sling! I am also counting down the days til M is six months old - not only cos I'm hoping it'll get easier but also cos it'll be Spring - having a Winter baby is crapola timing, esp during one of the wettest winters on record .

Do you have parents who can come and stay? My mum lives two hours away which is such a pain, and giving up our spare room is a double edged sword cos it means we both have to sleep in with M, but it's a godsend in the day.

Meridian are filming a follow up to the story they did on A last year - they asked me if I wanted anymore kids and were impressed I managed to knock another one out before this Christmas . It's a feel good xmas story and one of those fillers they like to use on slow news days! We all have stinking colds so we're going to look great on the telly!

So Sponge DO you wnt any more kids?

Deb - glad the snow has come along for you!

Ktpie - I would be panic stricken about 2 kids but you cope right, just like we coped with one the first time round. Nothing new this time though!
Rolf - any sign of the £ yet ?

Essie 21 million! per something or other. 20 is the lowest beofre it becomes a low sperm count.

Got a driving lesson and my first ever session of accupuncture today. Wanted a nap this afternoon but the gardeners are here cutting down the forest in the back garden worse luck. They'll be all bleedin day.

Acupuncture is really supposed to work with IVF (or IUthingy that you're getting). BTW, a friend of mine had it - Clomid wasn't the answer for her (she tried it and didn't work - without going into too much detail her OH only had one functioning side IYSWIM so it was a long shot anyway) and it worked well for her - quick and not too emotionally draining. She had acupuncture too.
21 million is loads! But I'm a little bit sad that it's not 21 men going in there like toy soldiers.

Ktpie glad things are coming along with the pg! It's quite exciting - I always thought after 34 weeks everything would be fine and the baby could come at any time! I might have to message you on knitting in the round. Is there any alternative to four needles? It was just too fiddly for me with the korknisse.

Rolf are you going through it with him after every toilet visit? How about weetabix or bran flakes - speed up the process? (Iestyn is on antibiotics and the nappy I had this morning was so awful we had to leave the house, basically. The stench was lingering. But last night he did a poo in the bath, and my Dad did a retching noise but my Mum was ROFL seeing her own 'too nice to get her hands dirty' daughter catching it in her hand on its way out and flinging it in the loo. She never thought she'd see that day.)

Anyway, sorry, we're getting a bit close to lunchtime but why should I suffer alone? Let's hope the stench has gone by this evening.

Sponge I think you're coping. I always used to say that if I was still alive, he was still alive and social services weren't doing daily visits then clearly I was coping. And I only had one... But I do polish my 'worst coper with a newborn' trophy on a daily basis.

I have docked his pocket money . He seemed ok this morning. My tolerence levels are pretty low, with DD1's school horror (her teacher wants me to go to the GP about DD1's behaviour and I'm very worked up) and plaster dust everywhere. You'd think DS2 was from a different family. He is obsessed with TV and computer games (gets little of the former and none of the latter because it makes him loopy), and eats very little. In his ideal world he'd eat sugary cereals, white bread, white pasta and spend all his free time looking at flickering screens. That is SO not the way our house is and never has been.

I had someone round last night to talk about stripping and staining the bedroom floors, and the hall/stairs/landing. He was ok but said we'd need to go away for a week. There's a little apartment nearby that is available short term and it looks like a holiday flat. I'm very excited at the thought of it, although I don't know if we can justify the expense.

Sorry, I know this is me me me. I'm knackered and frazzled.

Oh Essie - I LOL-ed at the poo in the bath comment!!! The whole retching thing! It's funny Luke was sick the other night and I let him do it all over me instead of ruining the carpet. It's funny how your own child's bodily functions don't trouble you at all.

Also Essie - you may remember I was also a newborn a phobic. I don't know what I would have done without MN to help me cope.

Rolf - oh go to the holiday flat and hange the expense! How lovely! They might tidy and do the hoovering too while you're away. All bran - that'll get the blockage moving!

Rolf you're sounding really stressed out. Is there a problem with DD1? (I think you've mentioned it before but I don't know what it is or anything - but don't feel you have to tell me!) But DS2 is ok, isn't he?
The holiday flat sounds ideal - it would be a mini holiday for you and quite exciting for the children, I imagine.
But you're doing an amazing job keeping it all together with your DH away. It's not easy at all. (I always think I could do with someone just to answer simple questions like 'what shall we have for tea' etc. The pressure of having absolutely everything down to me is hard.)

Essie DD1.

I'm hiding from the thread as although people were very kind and helpful, it seemed to go from throwing sand and toy food to instant diagnosis of autism and intervention at school . I think she's ok, just very willful, young for the year and a champion winder-upper. I've actually decided to cancel the GP appointment and see the teacher in the New Year. I'm not comfortable going to the GP with someone else's concerns. Whilst I find DD1 difficult I wouldn't be taking those issues to the GP. I also am being horribly distrustful and am wondering why the teacher wants me to go to the GP rather than making her own referral through the school nurse. Finance? Different personnel? I don't know if there is a subtext but I don't want to go down that path unless I feel a bit more informed and am convinced it's necessary.

In the first year of her life DD1 had an MRI on her brain, ultrasound scans of her organs, chromosome tests, ear and eye checks and was under the care of a neurologist. It was horrible. I don't want to put her through all that traipsing around and I feel sick at the thought of having to do it again. I'm also worried they will tell me I'm crap and call in social services. So a request to see the GP is actually a really big deal for me.

me me me again. Sorry

Rolf, no I don't think you are being hard on DS - I lol'd at docking his pocket money tho! It is not great that they want you to move out to do the decorating - that's the difficult thing when you have four kids, no one can really take you in can they. I was watching Horizon last night about the pressures of increasing population in the world and I felt a bit guilty about having another kid! What kind of a world will it be for our grandkids? Do you think your DD has adhd or something like that? I think going the GP and pushing for a referral can only help.

Essie, I am only 4+4. I didn't think I'd get PG this time any more than other months, but I knew we had sex at the right time and it was the fifth month we'd been trying so I reckoned there was a good chance of this egg being a good'un. I am not sick or anything yet but I do feel quite tired, but that is pretty normal after a day looking after the DTs or being in the office looking at a screen all day. No, it is definitely not twins this time [hope]

Amber, good luck! I didn't need any drugs in the end, so perhaps I didn't have a LP defect after all. It's good that you are moving forward with the IVF so quickly. Have a little drink at the Christmas party, I would.

Looking after two kids is fine as long as they sleep at night so I think at 6mo it will get easier. Not much you can do in the early days to help them sleep is there - the sleep dep was a killer for me, like constant jetlag. I am hoping to co-sleep with the next baby in the early days although I never slept that well when I co-slept with the DTs because I was always waking up in a panic and checking they were still breathing.

Amber, yes we would love more kids but sadly, because of my BP problems we've been strongly advised against it . I've already started getting rid of the baby stuff cos I know if I put it in the attic it will break my heart when I find it in a couple of years time .

Essie, thank you. Although I suspect the reason I'm coping is cos of my amazing mum which is why I'm so that yours lives round the corner. But then my dh is home pretty much every night so it's swings and roundabouts isn't it?

Rolf, with my SEN hat on I think your teacher has asked you to go to your GP cos they are the ones that would refer you to a paediatrician. I don't think the school nurse can do that. Do you get in with your GP? If you do then I would make the appt and go and have a chat. Haven't got time to read the thread at mo cos I need to take M to clinic but I will read when I get back. I think you sound like you do an amazing job coping with 4 kids on your own so try not to be too hard on yourself .

Neenz, the population thing is a bit of a problem cos we actually need more children in this country to fund our ageing population. Very tricky. But, of course, now I know I can't have more than two I think anyone else who does have three or more kids is immensely selfish! [jealous mummy emoticon]

Anyway, filming went really well this morning so I will let you know when it's on - for those of you who live in the right region of course!

Rolf Don't blame your dd's behaviour on your parenting. SOme children are just more wilful than others! A girl in my dd2's year is really not behaving well at school, she attacks other children and even twisted her teachers nose and called her a wicked hag. She's an only child and her mother who is very calm and gentle is a sahm so she gets plenty of attention at home and has no sibling rivalry. This little girl has just been to see a pead about her behaviour though I don't know the outcome as I hear it all second hand.

Amber will be thinking about you lots over the next few weeks, how long does a course take? WIll you have one or two eggs put back?

Neenz are your parents still moving to be close to you? WHich sister is pregnant - the one who threatened to move back to Oz?

Rolf I've read your thread (should be mugging up on Anglo-Saxon laws but there you go...) but I think some people are jumping ahead of themselves a bit. I will ask my Mum - she's a very experienced primary teacher. (She retired, but her last few years involved one child with major major problems - they couldn't fix it (it's tragic - he was basically not loved at home which led to major things like ADHD and horrific behaviour not like your DD) but their main aim at school was to control his behaviour and interaction with other children and teachers, mainly because they couldn't do a thing with the mother. Again, not like you.) My sister was also a very difficult child indeed, sounds a lot like your DD but her frustration and anger would be directed in a different way - not at others (basically more socially acceptable perhaps? But she was fearless and did dangerous things. Gymnastics sorted her out.) Anyway, I'll ask her.
But I think that Mattie person had v. good points. Also the long long post on the cards.

Just to take the opposite view to almost everyone...is this an overreaction? Throwing things - isn't it just one of those things? Like biting (which you haven't got) or hitting? (Iestyn throws things at people now - when he's really frustrated and can't communicate. It's just his anger. Not acceptable, admittedly; and he's only 18mo. But if your DD is doing that out of frustrating perhaps the way forward is to get some different sort of expression IYSWIM.) Some children do it, some don't, and they mostly grow out of it. Sounds more to me like she's finding the adjustment tough, 2 older brothers and a baby sister like you say, rather than the result of some terrible parenting. (The results of bad parenting are much much more serious than that, and I doubt social services would get involved on this one - throwing sand as a result of bad parenting - so what! It happens to the best parents!) 4 yo, she's still so little.

Oops, got to go.

Rolf, I have read your thread and would 2nd what essie says about agreeing with MrsMattie (if that makes sense!).

I think you need to speak to (a) class teacher, (b) SENCo and (c) your GP. This is about finding strategies to help DD and you, it is NOT about judging your parenting. It must be v v hard for you to watch your DD go through this stuff at school and all you want is what's best for her. School is a hug transition in all children's lives and some handle it better than others. She needs to be on an IEP so the school has targets (shared with you and DD) to help her work towards something tangible.

Social services won't get involved, believe me. We struggle to get them involved in cases of serious neglect so they are not going to have the time/energy/inclination to worry about some sand throwing .

Good luck. I've only experienced this kind of stuff from the other side of the fence (i.e. teacher, SEN Officer) so can't imagine how hard it is for the parents. But all good parents struggle when their kids are struggling. It's the parents that just shrug their shoulders and don't give a rat's arse that cause us concern.

Sponge - will we be able to see your TV appearance if we aren't in the right region?
My Mum is 2 hours away but looks after my Grandma who has alzheimers. Grandma goes into respite care for a week every 6 weeks so my Mum normally visits then but I find her visits quite stressful, we normally end up arguing and she tends to just make more work for me so it could be a good thing that she can't come down more often. Similarly I find the ILs visits nice but stressful, at least I don't argue with them but also don't really relax, it will probably be them who have to come over and look after J when I am in labour.
Best thing would be for DH to take some time off but as it is term time at uni he can't just take time off willy nilly, although if desperate he can probably sort something out. On the plus side he's always home by 6pm and doesn't work away (although it was mentioned yesterday that they might want him to go to China) so I can't really complain.
I was chatting to a lady this morning who has a 4 week old and a 14 month old, she said if you prepare yourself for the worst then it isn't that bad

Amber - hope the driving and the acupuncture goes well, DH has had that for his bad knee and it seemed to work well.

Essie - circular needles, but you wouldn't get small enough ones to do the korknisse so the way you are doing it sounds good to me.

Rolf - I can understand the not wanting to go to the GP thing. It does sound a bit like a mountain being made of a molehill by the teacher.

Neenz - glad you aren't feeling too bad, I hope it lasts! I was really tired in the early days too, and in fact have stayed that way throughout.
I have similar concerns about co-sleeping, DH is such a heavy sleeper I couldn't relax with J in the bed, I had the moses basket right next to the bed and chucked him in there.

Goingto - that made me laugh about the kid twisting the teachers nose and calling her a hag!