Dec 08 mums - embuggerance to it all - sleep or no sleep we love our babes

[waitinggirl]

i hope people don't mind, i took the bull by the horns and did it. title a bit naff, but more important the thread exists rather than search for a better title. hope i haven't stolen anyone's thunder...

Re childcare, I honestly believe DS1 benefited hugely from going p/t to his CM - he's a happy, sociable kid and learned early the importance of sharing and playing together (even if he has conveniently forgotten about it recently!). I know you'd be unlilely to get someone who said 'I decided to out DC in childcare and I really regret it' but I thin there can be positives if you manage it well and go for a good place. Plus you get time to yourself of course. On the working from home front, could you suggest you work from home BUT get some childcare so you're guaranteed to be on call?

Veggie: DH set himself up as a limited company too, think it's a good plan if you're going freelance. Which I think is actually the way to go in the current climate, at least he won't be at risk of being done in the eye by another employer.

Oh and on fillums (Arti was it you who signed up for Love Films?). We've just watched Black Orpheus which is a splendid summer film. Lovely music and lots and lots of groovy dancing people.

also I would add that I learned a huge amount from my CM and the way she managed DS1. I don;t think childcare should be all one-way (you telling them how to look after your child) it can be really helpful to have an outside eye on your parenting. The girls women who run our local Sure Start playgroups are another good case in point, they are brilliant at communicating with small children and I sit there mentally taking notes! Esp helpful if (like me) you don;t have many close friends with babies.

The only time I have wished I had a microwave was when a friend emailed around a recipe for the mug chocolate pudding. However, I think it's best I can't do that easily.

Effie, I'm not actually sure if DS1 is gay or not so won't be outing him at nursery just yet

DS1 is finally asleep on my lap after not being able to sleep upstairs due to the heat.

Good advice from Spiggy I think. Legally, oral agreements are just as binding as written ones (altho so much harder to prove) but many people think they are not enforceable. I wonder, is there anything on the early AN threads where you had talked about what work had said? Worth a look?

No microwaves here - several friends have been when I have offered the services of my kettle to warm up tubs of food.

Indith is very perceptive, in that you won't get a nursery mum saying it sucks . IME it tends to depend on the nursery or carer. Some are completely home from home and others, well, I wouldnt' leave my cat with them. My DD's current nursery will let her sit on the reader's lap for stories as she is going through a clingy phase and needs the reassurance. She also sleeps holding hands with her best friend (our next door neighbour's little boy) and the first to wake just waits for the other without making a noise. Nurseries and CMs ain't all bad . Many of us can't or don't wish to stay at home FT with our kids and if you get the childcare right you can find something which works in your family. Outside care can be a very positive thing.

Veggie, I hope you are not done out of your holiday and I hope the redundancy thing works out. It would be great for so many of us ifyou did move back to london. I could lend you our car for a start as I don't drive that much day to day so if you wanted a holiday.... Can I recommend S London to move to next, it's FABULOUS !

By the way, PMK, you very kindly offered help with the kids if I am in crisis. I am deeply touched by your offer - so kind to think of me. I hope that by the end of the summer I'll have something permanent and paid in the bag, but if not.... You are so kind, thank you very much.

Must go. Knackered. Goood night and good sleep to all.

Right, back from a superhot Henley. I was very damped down for me - one Pimms, one Spot of Cheerfulness and one...coffee. It was lovely. JJ, I know you are in Canada but thank you so very much, it was a tonic when I needed it most. I'd forgotten how gorgeous Henley is - is your house in town, PMK? I didn't see Mr Effie, I don't think Just scores of people from central casting in boaters and luxuriant titfers.

I just don't know how to thank you for the sympathy and support from all of you (which has cheered me up immeasurably) and also for the INVALUABLE reassurance about childcare - NJAN, Trace, Effie, Indith, Veggie. To know others have done it and their children seem not only none the worse for it but even enriched by it, makes me feel a lot better. I may be something of a gadfly and yes, we do use a babysitter sometimes and I have been away for nights without her, but the thought of handing her over to someone or some people whilst I am at work has really knocked me for six, which some people might find surprising. I just absolutely love having her near to me as much as poss. I am sure I will enjoy having two days in the office in some ways, as Effie pointed out, but I will still be fretting about her and hoping she is not grieving for me, and also feeling like I am missing out for a bit. That bit that Trace said about accepting that there are some parts of Lucy's life that she doesn't know about - I thought that was really very wise. And I suppose it's a rehearsal for school too (I mean for me, not her!) She was looked after by a friend of mine (not really a close friend but a very nice lady with a DD of 5 and a DS of nearly 3 - two more fabulous kids you couldn't find, truly) - and the DS has childcare for two days a week, sometimes more. And I saw how my DD enjoyed being with them and how happy she seemed even though I'd been at Henley for the day

Spiggy, thank you so much for your advice, it's brilliant, particularly as I have been in a funk and not thinking straight. I have put a proposal together in the form of a letter, outlining simply all that was said at the meeting (could be useful later) and yes, I think I do have some emails mentioning working from home which, again, could be useful if necessary. We didn't have anything in writing at the time but I think I may well have emails which refer to it. My letter goes on to suggest that I work two full days at the office and a further seven hours per week at home (amounting to another day) where I respind to emails and the like, but the girl covering my maternity leave does three full days (she has only been doing four so she may go for this). This would mean that we were doing six days a week between us, as it were. I think work may go for this. My 40 weeks of statutory maternity pay ends soon but I am of course entitled to take 52, the last 12 without pay, which I think I am now going to do to enable me to find suitable childcare for DD and also so work can sort out how my coming back is going to operate. I have made some constructive suggestions about this also. But any more shit from them and I am taking it further. And I will be looking for another job or alternative source of income, yes.

I am going to be very quiet on the thread for the next few days as I feel I have hogged it the last day or two. But before I do -

Spot, I would've thought you would be entitled to see those notes, you know. PD knows about this sort of thing (remember she took some of her hospital notes?) so maybe ring her? Maddening, though, isn't it?

ZJ - I am really hoping you are feeling better...

Jolly, remind me when you are back off to work? Have you made your arrangements yet?

Sybs - I am so glad YOUR childcare issues are part solved. And your affectionate words were, like everyone's, a real balm.

Veggie - sorry about the work stress for your DP but he sounds an extraordinarily capable and talented fellow so hopefully things will pan out.

Indith, DP is probably going to Durham without me in a couple of weekends' time. But my little mate is only just coming to the end of his first year so I will be up at some point in the next two years to winkle you out for coffee and I WILL be up on my broomstick trailing a haze of Chanel No 5 behind me

Kayz, my sandals are green satin high heels and I bought a microwave specifically to take the chill off DD's formula but I bloody love lentils. And I love my DD to the end of the numbers. Furthermore I would not be thinking anyone was a lentil noshing loon simply for bf, not using a microwave, using a sling (I personally didn't get on with them but it wasn't for want of trying), having a homebirth or any of this other normal, regular stuff your neighbour seems to have issues with. I do wonder if people are sometimes jealous of younger mums and it comes out as hostility. I am a very old mum so I will never experience this discrimination

Enjoy l'amour in Paris, PMK Have you seen that ad for that particular airline with the girls in red stilettoes? I thought of you.

Right, my fingers are dropping off. Sweet dreams and quiet nights, all.

Argh! Totally sleepless night. T has learnt to roll over in his cot and gets really upset about it. That plus noise from outside plus snoring from inside and i am beat!

Morning,

LadyT My neighbour is my age. I think that is what annoyed me so much. My sandals are some gorgeous yellow wedges!! I love them.

I have been awake since 4! I couldn't get comfy, was too hot, DH kept trying his luck. I think I might invest in a cattle prod, it is far too hot for sex IMO.

Going shopping to Leeds today with my Mum. We are going to Ikea on the way home! Must not spend all of the tax credits. Boys are going to see MIL with DH.

I have decided that if MIL will have the boys then I am going back to work. Just 3 days a week and we're probably going to put my wages in a savings account. If we can afford to live without using them then I won't go back after DC3.

Hope everyone is well!

Kayzr Enjoy your day out. Am envious, but exhausted by, the thought of you trying for DS3. Fingers crossed for Pmk too BTW, Whitby is on BBC breakfast right now. They are saying how great it is

LadyT Sounds like a good plan and I'm glad you feel more positive. I hope they respond well to you.

And, its been really good for me to read about what other people have said about childcare because I struggle with it myself. But one last thing, a secret fear of mine was that they would kind of forget who I was a bit. But they dont, you get the best smiles when you go to get them and you dont lose that special connection you have with them as their mum

Sorry to hear about your husbands job loss veggie. Would you be happy to leave Derby for London ? Do you ever get out to the Peaks and the Lakes ? I lived in Manchester for a while and thats what I miss most about it.

veggie sorry to hear about dh's job, fingers crossed it all works out for you

ladyt glad you're feeling a little better. Just to say that ds1 has been in nursery from about 18mo & hasn't suffered any ill effects at all! I think it was spot who said it was the quality of childcare that was important & I would agree. I saw a few childminders but really didn't click with them whereas the nursery I had a really good feeling from. Anyway, you've probably got enough childcare advice to write a book now

spot sorry you had a rough night. Any chance of any rest today? I think there are thunderstorms predicted today so hopefully it might cool down a little.

kayz have a good day shopping .

pmk have a lovely time in Paris

I'm taking the ds's to my PIL's today, must get everything packed otherwise it will be last minute & something (or someone) will get forgotten!

Hello hopefully I won't waffle on as I have things to do before getting to the station.

Great advice Spiggy, you've done this before!

Lady glad you had a nice time yesterday. Our flat is quite central - probably 5 min walk to the Angel on the Bridge You just follow the river around towards the station and we're over that side. I really like that advert

Veggie you do make me laugh! Or rather Mr Veg!(comments about desk!)Good luck to him re the work situation, i'm sure it will work out! Hopefully closer this direction!

Sybs no worries at all - be happy to help if you get stuck. Same goes for you Lady or anyone else.

Kayz ooh I wouldn't be able to let that go about your neighbour, not that i'd pick a fight since you have to live next door, but i'd elude to the fact that you overheard her iykwim. I'm probably the worst, I have a microwave - had it pre-ds but do stick ds food in it sometimes.... I didn't love BF, Have a bjorn not a sling, don't have a veggie garden - (though would be up for the challenge if garden permitted!) and have a tv in the bedroom But, I love lentils, tofu, and am (still) planning on taking up yoga (or perhaps pilates without the Omming )

Got a parking ticket yesterday for not parking exactly in the marked space (due to other cars not either! )

Well, must get organised - bugger i'm going to miss the Murray match....

Back Sunday.... Au revoir, un beau week-end à tous!

Hello,
Not sure where the time is going at the moment! Had quick skim through.
Lady I'm outraged on your behalf and think it is disgusting when companies turn round and do this to loyal hardworking people. Great advice from spiggy there (which may help a friend of mine going through similar - her company not happy on the flexible time, want her to be flexible each week about her flexible days, offered a demotion if she worked flexible hours and now have asked if she will return three months early! - am not sure how childcare would fit into all of the above).
Although no personal experience of childcare I know quite a few people who have used nurseries when going back to work full time and it has all sounded very positive. All the children love nursery, hate to leave at the end of the day and are very social little things.
Remain positive and I hope work respond positively to your proposal.

ZJ - hope you are starting to feel better you poor thng.

Spot - am also outraged for you on the tongue tie business. If you don't feel like complaining maybe a letter to ask them to make anyone involved more vigilant in future.

Veggie - I hope things go well for your DH with his new company. It can't go wrong with you as company secretary.
It was Westmead and also the childrens hospital there. We did visit Sydney alot and yes we got the ferry up the river also. After that we travelled up the east coast and visited Darwin and Uluru. Fantastic country. I always planned to go back there to live but funny how situations change. My next plan is to at least get DH out there for a visit.

Well DS has fallen asleep feeding. Last night wasn't too bad with just 2 night feeds but the previous night was horrendous - may take a while for him to realise a different routine on my work day.
Probably off to Leeds to visit DH's grandma this weekend - she has been up and down this week.
Hope everyone manages nice, relaxing weekends.

Aaargh

Am so behind I fell off the thread. And I missed arti's birthday, and spot finding out about tongue tie, and veggie becoming a company secretary, and kayz's neighbour, and so much stuff. Effie's DH in the serge jacket stuck in my mind though. Serge is a fantastic word.

LadyT i am so cross on your behalf. So far beyond reasonable. But as others have said childcare can be a very good thing. I have a rather lovely student helping me out this summer and DS loves her so much that he tells her he misses her (she babysat for us last night, and then came at 12 today and he's following her around like puppy).

We went to see Blur in Hyde Park last night. Was brilliant. Although I kept looking round and thinking that everyone looked quite old and there were loads of pregnant women and quite a few babies. And then I realised it was that we were all now 10 years older too....

Have new resolution to post more. Hen weekend proved to me how difficult it gets when your friends are just in different worlds - and how lovely it is to have this and you all. Pmk I imagine you've gone now - but have great weekend in Paris. Am . Especially as one of the madder things I did this week was take the DCs up to Yorkshire on the train on my own, and actually it was fine. So am thinking we'll brave Eurostar next. Northallerton and Paris are very similar.

Oh I've just had a brilliant idea let's have a Paris meet up. We could find a weekday that's really cheap. Those of us North of the Border could come down to St Pancras and chuff chuff chuffity chuff off we go! We could book out a carriage!

All the excitement of the last post has left me exhausted. Have been lurking this afternoon and haven't posted as have been feeling a little fluey. I think I have what the DS's have had. I managed a trip over to Beeston though, a friend from the BF course and I are planning to start up a BF support group over that way and had our first planning meeting. She has already found a place we can hold it and has looked into how much we need per week. I'm going to draft a letter to a couple of different groups to see if we can get some funding. We only need £20 a week but we also want funding to train 12 more BfN helpers so they we can establish more groups in the area as well as have back up for us including someone to take over when I go home. So it takes the total for a year up to £8000 so so far we have had a no, from the PCT. But we are sure we can at least get the group up & running.

Then this afternoon I managed to sort the house to a vague level of tidiness. We have a usual babysitter coming over, DH has just gone to pick her up. We are going to a new Japanese place that has opened up so very excited about that. It is actually run by a Chinese lady and her sons so DH gets to practice his Chinese.

Thanks for all your well wishes for DH, it is actually all quite exciting as he has so much opportunities. I'm so proud of him. He changed from being a Network computer engineer to security a couple of years after we met so he had to start at the bottom. He never thought he was that great at it compared to the really good creative hackers but just chugged along and learnt what he could from them. Now he is quite well respected in the industry and sort after by employers because he is not only good but he is a very good people person so they know he presents well to the clients (some of the better hackers don't prsent so well and literally cannot communicate with human beings). So it is nice to see him realize he is now one of the big hackers. Bless him. I have always admired his motivation and hope our boys inherit it, he is one of those people who doesn't just talk about what he could do, he just does it.

Also I would love to move back to London, believe me we would be meeting up all the time, but it's just so much better financially to be here so unless a very lucrative job which required him to work in the office came up I don't think it's going to happen. I also much prefer him working from home. It is really brilliant for the boys to have him around so much.

Right DS2 is asleep better get ready. DS1 wants the babysitter to put him to bed which is great as the booking is for 7.30pm luckily it's just down the road.

Oh and JB wait a couple of years then go back when I'm there.

ZJ how are you today?

Lady I think what you are proposing is perfect, I am actually surprised they are doing this. Surely they now you well enough to know who they are messing with! It is nice to think that by doing this it will help your DD in some way for her future. I would hope by the time she grows up women could even consider bringing there children to work where appropriate! It's something many in the area of baby health think should be made available.

LadyT: glad you enjoyed Henley . DH was in some hospitality tent at the starting point and came back well lushed with champagne and caviar and bright red (forgot to take any sunscreen, the loon).

DH has taken some hilarious photographs of the DSs, will wait till he posts them online then pinch for Facebook.

Lal: we were nearly at that concert! We were invited but I couldn't face organising childcare and transport . Friends went and said it was fab.

DH is agitating to watch the Mitchell & Webb I've downloaded so better go! Have great weekends all

Oh meant to say Lal very jealous of Blur concert would love to see them. We had the same thing at a petshop boys concert a few years ago, we were surprised how old everyone was (inc DH & I) but not so many were pregnant.

Had a lovely evening out had 2 big tacky looking cocktails and a teppinyaki set thing, but watched the chef do his thing from afar as we wanted to chat a be vaguely romantic which is difficult with a man doing tricks and setting things on fire. Thought we might go back with some friends and do it again though. Ate way too much too. DS1 was doing one of his funny little dances for the babysitter when we left but apparently went to sleep shortly after we left. DS2 woke up at around 9.10pm and sat quite happily with her but she rang us around 9.30pm when she'd had enough of him clawing at her Cardigan. I think she felt a little violated. He's a funny thing he always wakes around 9 for a feed but then apart from a little top up at 12 sometimes he will go without until 5am (touch wood). I don't understand why he so desperately needs that's feed, and he is properly ravenous when he wakes for it.

I have been considering giving up vegetarianism lately. DS1 eats meat and I assume DS2 will also, DH is gluten and oats intolerant and I feel like we are all going to be having different meals and going to friends for dinner and travelling will get increasingly difficult with DH's retrictions. I broached the subject with DH tonight and he didn't seem to keen. But I'll give him a few weeks to mull it over and I think he will come around. He often does that, I suggest something he vetoes it and then a couple weeks later he says we should do X, that I had suggested, as if he came up with the idea.

Morning,

DS2 is being a real pain!! He woke up at 2, we gave him a bottle and he finished it. But he won't go back to sleep so i have got up.

Got a really busy day ahead of me. Need to make and ice 36 cupcakes and decorate the big cake. Plus got family arriving. Might pop on later.

Hope you are all asleep!!

Morning Kayz Did you get back to sleep ? When do you get your blood test results ?

Veggie Our family gave up vegetarianism when DS1 was 1-ish. I still dont eat red meat myself, but I do cook read meat, chicken and fish about once a week for each. Not having really ever cooked it before, I was surprised at how easy it was to make a tasty and nutritious meal for them (apparently tasty anyway). And if I make meatballs/spag bol, they always have celery, carrot, apple, pepper etc in them as well so I get the veggies in there too. Because I'm working 4 days a week normally it just seemed much easier to do it this way and I will be meal planning soon (old fashioned styly) for those days....

My blood test is on Monday so about Wednesday/Thursday. I re-iced the cake at 4am and it looks much better.

DH and DS1 got up at 6 so I went back to bed for 2 hours.

Just reading your post about putting veg in spag bol etc. My cousin won't eat any fruit or veg but devoured a spag bol that I made that had tomatoes, mushrooms, onion, celery and peppers in the sauce.

NJAN it's more about DH & I being meat eaters. DS1 has eaten meat since he was 2.5 and DS2 has already tried squid. I kind of feel with DH's gluten intolerance and the boys meat eating we are going to end up being a family that eats all sorts of different meals at dinner time and apart from the faff of cooking for all those different diets I also think eating the same meal together at least once a day is a good thing for our family. I'm quite an expert now at hiding veggies, though I have now gotten to the stage with DS1 that he is happy to know the veg is in there as long as he chooses it and it's still fairly hidden.

I got myself all excited because with all DHs work stuff going on and possibly skipping our planned August holiday, we decided to go to Paris to watch the last stage of the Tour!!! Was quite excited but then realized that it coincided with the festival we are going to in Dorset so can't go. Bugger. However we have always planned next year to follow most of the tour in a camper van so have that to look forward to.

Sorry Veggie, I tend to assume that everyone who is veggie feels like me ! I dont know if it was because I was bought up veggie, or because I am just squeamish, but I just cant do it (it makes me feel a bit ill anyway). I can manage chicken and fish, but only if I dont think about it If I was on my own, I'd never eat it. I have to say though, I had very strong cravings for what can only be bits of carcass during both my pregnancies. I can only assume this was for biological reasons so i ate a lot of chicken and fish then !

Hello!!

I have decorated the cake and started the cupcakes!!

Here are some more pics.

NJAN part of the reason we decided not to bring up DS1 veggie was that a friend of ours who was brought up veggie and she actually advised us to consider not making our kids veggie because while she is happy being a veggie she believes she never really had a choice in the matter because she physically cannot eat meat because she can't stand the texture. So DH and I discussed it and decided to kind of give DS1 the choice and he wholeheartedly chose meat when offered. I only give him good stuff and have noticed he doesn't like crappy sausages and dodgy chicken nuggets, though he would live on fish fingers of any quality. I myself don't have a problem with eating meat, I was raised Australian style with meat eating (steak for breakfast lunch and tea), I just believe that western cultures eat way too much meat and the impact on the environment. Australia is the biggest exporter of water, in that the water required to produce the meat we export is amazingly huge, and in a country that is so dry that is rediculous. Oh dear I could get on my high horse. Anyway my quandary is more that my belief in good family dinners is over riding my veggie principles. As far as I'm concerned if we agreed to eat meat for a few days and veggie meals other times I think we would really normalize our meal times (currently a bit hotch potch) and maybe improve DS1's diet IYSWIM. We have several lovely farm shops close by most organic so we are perfectly placed to support them.

I have to say though NJAN your aversion to red meat does sound more like a proper intolerance.