March08 mums- tummy and teething troubles!

[fitnfortyone]

new thread for Merry...

I don't think you're being pfb about this. I'm not saying you should be really worried, but concerned yes. definitely speak to dr or hv this am. as much to put your mind at rest. If he's taken 1oz then I think you can relax a little bit about dehydration.

I suppose you've tried loads of different ways for him to take a bottle, other people being the best bet I should imagine. No idea if this would work, but how about when he's asleep (propped up in rocky chair/car seat/pushchair), if he's not fully aware what he's sucking on as he's sleepy he might (possibly) take some, like a dream feed. (you do want to stop bfing don't you?).

Have had DH and MIL give him bottle, awake, asleep...he usually takes dream feed, but woke up the second bottle touched his mouth. he's not budging for anybody. [exhausted emoticon]
Anyone know how long it takes for milk to kick back in? It's at that "produced on demand" but weak stage.

Am trying to remain a bit positive...he pulls the funniest face when the teat goes near his mouth. Bottom lip disappears completely and he looks like a cross between keeping a secret and sucking lemons!

hurrah...a wet nappy. first since 5 pm yesterday so i(worried, me?) weighed it and it was 165. not much, but at least something.

keep us posted turtle, i think it sounds like he's just going to be a stroppy child who stamps his foot when not getting his own way...but then i haven't had to go through the whole panic of what the hell to do if BM has gone!
{{{hugs}}}

Am having first child free day since a couple of weeks ago. No hope of a lie in since DH had me faffing about at 6.30 to get him a shirt to wear for his sports day at work.

Feeling quite emotional today - got hit over the head with a sledgehammer last night about how much I love my LO and how I don't want to go back to work and miss a second of his growing up

turtle - one of our gps used to be a paediatrician and when an nct friend went to her worrying about dehydration she said that it takes longer than we expect for a baby to get dehydrated. They're robust little things So although it's understandably very worrying, I'm sure Pascal is probably okay and a wet nappy this morning is a good sign. But definitely go to the doctor, and I hope they can reassure you and give you some good advice. All you can do is keep offering the bottle regularly. Hard as it is, try and relax when you do it so he doesn't get put off by your anxiety. Don't force it, and just offer again soon if he rejects it; he'll eventually take it when he really needs something to drink.

There are a number of threads i've seen on babies on feeding strikes etc. perhaps do a quick search of the feeding topic to see what advice there is.

DS has taken his gaviscon better this morning - I added it to some expressed milk and syringed it in. He definitely took some in yesterday despite it going all over his clothes as he has been a bit constipated and the texture of his poo is no longer runny! I was wondering if I should drink prune juice in case it gets through to my breastmilk and helps him out . Any thoughts?

prune juice: not unless you love and adore it, i can't imagine how many buckets you'd have to drink to get any active ingredient through

good luck today turtle!

stuck in again so far today as ds1 has been tantruming unnacceptably and forfeited his park trip, treat and tv! has been doing well for an hour now. time for more big praise. he is keeping clean and dry thru it all, so far. despite my alomst pinning him down and pouring water into him, as i want him pee'ing loads: if we're gonna stay in and do this, we may as well stay in and do this. Lots.

fn41: it was pure torture going back to work with ds1. loathed it. but you have to do what you have to do. we could have afforded to buy me out, but i couldn't let go of the enourmous amount i'd poured into work over 20 years, and specifically had so promised to go back, felt obliged. combo missing him and work issues where they increased my effing work load! despite returnign parttime, i lasted i think 7 or 8 months, and came to work at home for dh until late PG with GG.

I hope things are improving turtle.

Well despite the best night sleep in ages I feel exhausted today. I fed him at 10.30 as per normal, but got hooked into watching that awful beauty queen programme, so didn't move off sofa until 11.30, by the time I'd faffed and got into bed it was midnight, I stubbornly insist that I must read a few pages or I can't switch off before falling asleep, I think I read one whole paragraph before falling asleep and woke at about 2 with the light on and book over my face and drooled upon (and I wonder why our sex life is non-existent!). He slept through until 5.30, short feed and back off until 7.30. Fingers crossed he does the same again tonight and I just behave a bit more sensibly.

fn41 - sorry you're feeling emotional. It's difficult to return to work whenever it happens. I may have missed this information, but what childcare have you sorted out, when do you go back, and is it full time? The biggest thing I struggled with initially was being organised enough to mean that the time I was at home was quality time, rather trying to fit in household chores as well. It can take a while for the family to adjust, not to scare you, but hope your dh is more than prepared do stuff too.

DS only had one dose of gaviscon this morning - made him constipated yesterday and he is really grumpy after it for a while so i'm not keen to give him too much. so i did the one dose this morning and then did lots of holding him upright etc. as well. he had a bit of discomfort after each feed but nothing lasting, and he wasn't sick at all today!!! it really is a miracle, for now at least. i'm a bit concerned that the discomfort means that he is still getting some acid up his throat IYSWIM, but hopefully that will abate as we use the gaviscon more. i guess we might settle on two doses at his worst feeds and see what happens over the next few weeks.

turtle - hope things are okay.

fn41 - when are you due back? do you have childcare sorted? that is my task once summer is over.

Hi everyone, im still here. ive been spending alot of time on boob job forums !!!!! as im having mine done in 13 days its my post pregnancy pressie to myself (no more babies).

i havent had a chance to catch up properly yet but it looks like i have a lot of reading to do.

Izzy is at the 'lovely' stage where she rolls over screams and has to be rolled over and then the whole process is repeated 5 seconds later!

Good luck, spugs! It's a lovely present. I plan on having mine redone the second I'm done having babies.

Hayls - I know that shriek well. A little too well truth be known. Bring back the bubble blowing!

Glad its not just my little darling doing this!!!

Well she's had baby rice for tea the last two days and she loved it. Any advice on how much, when to introduce new flavours? Had asked on the breast/bottle feeding section but only got dozens of replies telling me not to do it - I know they are trying to help but why try to change my mind?

DD is now 14lbs 14ozs and we are off swimming on wed, can't wait.

nik - the general advice is to introduce something new every 3 days so that there is time to see if it unsettles them. Some people say this isn't necessary if you do it early in the day as you have time to see the impact so could introduce something new every day, but I imagine that might be more suitable for babies nearer 6 months old as their gut is more developed etc (hence advice to wait if poss). So I would be tempted to do the 3 day thing (or 2 days at least) to be on the safe side. Root veg are probably the best things to try first - less acidic than fruits and still sweet - and then if she accepts those happily move onto pear, banana etc.

We've had a terrible night here. my poor boy is doing well on the gaviscon for his reflux symptoms but it is constipating him hugely. i fed him at 4.15 and then was woken by his cries at 5.30 (very unusual for him to cry nowadays - he normally just shouts "ah ah ah" loudly if he wants food in the night!) i spent 2 hours doing my best baby massage skills to help him get it out while DH hummed and sang and pulled silly faces to distract him. Two pooey nappies later and he finally stopped crying and squirming. All three of us then passed out until 9.15

i tend to not worry too much about new foods and with ds2 don't get too much chance to. he has to have what is available that day tbh. from the WHO physiological basis of weaning: the gut is actually developed enough for most fruit and veg and non-gluten cereals by 4 months in 'normal' babies ie not prem, not from high allergen families and so rate of introduction of new foods is more about. citrus and high acid berries are worth avoiding IME and IMO.

the WHO advice on weaning from 6 months is that there is enough iron intake from human or cow milk until 6 months so weaning isn't actually needed nutrionally for many babies, they can do without. in addition, there is greater benefit to the mother in terms of weight loss and reduced risk of gut infections to baby from tainted foods and fluids if you wait until 6 months. Note that the last two pieces of research are from Honduras, and may have limited relevance in our land of overabundance and greater hygiene practices. the advice just about suited ds1, but would have been cruel to delay ds2 longer. he is simply hungry, and now has two large meals (size of a clementine in volume) of fruity/veggy cereal gloop a day, plus a pud of a piece of pear or peach to hold and gum. he is not usual do remember his birth weght was 5.3k.

it's a shame yif you got a bruising on another board nik, i guess a lot of people need safety and the comfort of the current orthodoxy when faced with something we care about so much. i don't think we can do anything more than get to know and trust our own babies reactions within what we know is safe. i really spent time on this before taking the plunge with ds2, as the orthodoxy is SO strong isn't it? I was quite scared to start despite obvious hunger signs, and reading all the original research...and it wasn't easy despite i've got an MSc and substantial practice in Epidemiology, the actual science of making and using these studies! In the end I found it frustrating as the research studies on the stuff that really matters IMO just hasn't been done. i'd like to know what is best intro first/when for making a baby and it's carers enjoy weaning, learn to stop when satisfied (major one this one when we are surrounded by too many tasty foods). that sort of question just isn't asked.

i do suspect baby led weaning has many answers to these unanswered questions. it was a real boon with ds1. it helps to have a long term aim i think with weaning. for me, i want him to understand food and his hunger eventually andf then eat moderately. i never let anyone coax him to eat more than he wants, ask him only to try new things a little and he has so far a simple relationship to food. it is never a punishment, and sugar and crisps are a reward treat he stops eating himself when he has had enough. i hate to see kiddies gorge on these things when they are denied them too much. i really try not to give food as emotional comfort (my issue) so wish me luck with that in future sigh my eating is frankly disordered, and i have to raise my kids not like this...how hard is it? Hard.

HQ, gaviscon really constipated ds2 as well, but better that than a raw thorax and inability to eat IMO. i was panicked because it seemed so little when it came (dry) rather than smeary masses of BF poo. Then I worked out the physics and realised he was still getting it all out, just slower and more uncomfortable. Maybe offer a little extra water now and then? Also, top tip, but very unsavoury phrasing is DH's theory that a good long ride in a sling every day helps to 'shake the shit' down, ie gravity is on their side. Thanks, DH, for that lovely imagery but possibly a practical help for you? i hope he heals quickly and he soon settles into using less gaviscon like mine and turtle's did.

merry - great minds etc. My DH has just decided to take DS out in the sling for exactly that reason It's so difficult this mum lark - i know he is better off with gaviscon and constipation for his long term health, but he seems so much more upset with it in the short term. it's also confused by him having a rotten stinking cold so he's a bit grumpy anyway. all we can do is persist.

thanks also for info on weaning - very helpful as always! as you say, one of the worst things will be trying not to impart our own personal food issues on our babies. i have a big issue with my sweet tooth and inability to say no to chocolate, pudding etc. so i desperately want to ensure he isn't a sugar obsessive like me. but i need to make sure i find enough of a balance that i don't deny him and make him crave it anyway. sigh...

Agree that the BLW seems like the most sensible way to deal with the whole food thing as the baby can then control how much he/she takes in. Mine won't wait that long though as milk just won't satisfy him for long enough
Tried him on some mushed up banana this morning, and apart from the bit he vomited up(!) he took in quite a lot and seemed to like it. Will try him on some sweet potato later, maybe real food is the way to go instead of the jars despite the convenience and organic-ness of 'em (bad mummy!).
I have the same sugar issues HQ, want to avoid giving LO anything with sugar in it until he's a lot older...so no rusks if rice cakes keep him happy. DH is firmly of MB's conviction that a little of anything is ok to avoid the deprivation/gorge cycles, but the prob with sugar is that it tends to override the body's normal satiety limit and that's why you always have to finish that packet of jaffa cakes .

HQ, don't go back to work for 2 whole months yet! Be aware that if you try to get LO into a nursery, the best ones may not have space, or may only have a couple of days a week free.

Childcare stuff - lucky enough to have granny look after LO for 3 days a week, nursery already booked for 1 day a week as I want him to get some socialisation with other babies/kids/non-rellies. We could only get him in there on Mons or Fris or both.

I'll be off every other Friday with work, and DH may be going to compressed hours to do a 4day week. Have decided that we could do with his 5 day salary now we're getting another car. Definitely can't afford for me to go part time, though the new working arrangements of a 9day fortnight give me 2 days off a month. The drawback is that I'll have to work longer hours to make up the time for that extra day off so I may not get home until after LO goes to bed I think I'm just bitter that as the high earner of the family I don't have the choice to go part time or give up work, where DH could. And while granny care is definitely cheap, it's more fraught with potential disputes over how she chooses to bring up my child...I may be blowing things out of all proportion as nothing's happened yet that I object to, but a nursery is a much more impartial relationship! Oh, and MB, DH will be useless in the "helping out" with domestic stuff. He also can't do DIY. Will be hiring our cleaner back again very soon.

which reminds me, must get Gran to teach LO to cook. DH is ok with things like pizza with oven instructions, and microwave meals. Anything requiring a bit of common sense is still beyond him. Gave him some fresh pasta to cook for himself the other night and a jar of pesto to stir some in as a sauce. He presented the plate to me with 1/2 jar of pesto spread on the top wondering if that was about right

Hi all

Merry - thanks for your post re weaning - really helpful. Hadn't thought about the philosophical aspect too much as was just desperate to get some calories into her to make her sleep better and had sort of thought that food issues need to be dealt with later, but it makes so much sense that a healthy attitude to food starts early.

One thing we're finding that might be udseful to other people is that she struggles more with root veg as the purees tend to be stodgier than fruit ones - despite mixing in lots of water. So in terms of very early meals fruit might be a bit easier than veg until they figure out the whole swallowing thing.

She is really bad at opening her mouth for food (Turtle was already trying to get her to mimic me... as well as giving her spoon to play with, building up excitement about food etc etc) and I can't work out whether she is trying to tell me that she doesn't want food yet/has had enough and needs me to stop (even after only a spoonful or 2 last night when we were a week into the process?) or whether she just hasn't figured out how to co-ordinate mouth opening. It is SO hard trying to understand her behaviour and interpret it correctly. And now I'm worrying that I will either try to force her to take more than she needs or take food away before she has had enough in order not to force her to eat more than she wants and one way or another be setting up issues relating to food already. God it's so hard.

Can anyone recommend any good books/sites re BLW? am thinking mybe i should explore that a bit more as i don't really know much about it.

Also - what're the rules about giving proper food rather than mush? Turtle and Merry have both said they are giving the odd thing for babies to gum on - isn't there a risk of choking? Sorry - know i am sounding ignorant but to be honest i am rather on this subject!

Sorry for long post - am struggling with this whole weaning lark as really really don't want to be getting food related stuff wrong for her.

HQ - hang in there with LO, sounds like you're having a really tough time of it all.

Turtle - how's Pascal doing??

Have a good Sunday everyone!

morning all. Was supposed to try to be strong and not BF but failed miserably. The two days of desperate BF by baby have stimulated mammoth supplies of milk. Was letting DH do feeds yesterday (but since he never does them, DS was a bit unsure and was screaming) and the chaos made me have letdown after letdown, had to feed to relieve pressure, etc etc and now i am here typing one handed again. Argh. Had dinner with friends last night and DS helped himself to a mouthful of berry smoothie(he loves straws) which was funny, he loved it, but paid the price this morning in exploding nappy.
CM-I give him enormous chunks of stuff to hold and chew or I hold smaller pieces, I never take my eyes off him. You can get a little thing to put food in so it's safe for them to do it themselves like this
Got DS to take 2 whole oz of formula this morning, so am hopng I will have the strength to say no to the boobie today...

I had an absolutely rotten night last night. DS woke at 2.30 for a feed. I then couldn't get back to sleep (still suffering from post-feed insomnia but it's particularly bad this week) and was wide awake for 2 hours. I was just drifting off when he awoke at 4.45 for more food I then got back to bed when he did an explosive nappy that I heard across the landing! I went in to change him, went back to bed, and then he started crying. Went back in to get him, he started grinning and I just lost it. I was just sobbing - I don't think i've ever cried as hysterically in my life. DH came rushing in, DS started screaming and we ended up all sat in the living room until 6. I then went to bed and passed out until 9. DH took DS up at 7 after a bottle of formula and they both slept until 10. So in the end I had 2 lots of 3 hours sleep separated by nearly 4 hours of wakefulness

To cap it all, we have to go to a big DH family reunion today where DS is guest of honour. It's going to be a long long day: he is whimpering whenever we move him and is on edge all the time. I've stopped the gaviscon until his cold settles down, but I think there is also some early teething pain thrown in for good measure. Calpol is the only way to get a slightly happy baby at the moment and I really don't like using too much of that at this age. Off to the doctors tomorrow if he isn't any better.

TBH this is the worst week so far for me and DH. We thought it was meant to get better but it's just getting worse...

hopefully it's a dip HQ, and when babies bounce back they do it faster and with more ease than us ancient-er things. i hope your day hasn't been grim for you. and turtle, you poor thing your boobs and brain must not know whether they are coming or going, i hope a clear path opens up for you soon on the feeding front.

ds1 is 95% daytime potty trained WOOOOHOOO clever him. {wish i could insert link to mad celebratino dance we have invented}. clearly he has found parts of it tough, but is old enouigh and bright/willing enough to have gone from nappies to knowing what is coming when, getting pants and trousers down and on one glorious occasion today: taking himself to loo, pulling down pants, peeing flushing rinsing fingers and asking for 'towel, mummy, towel, daddy'. gets a failure every other day when engrossed in play it seems.

twas an eye opener for dh yesterday, how stressful it is for the adult, waiting on a toddler's bladder and gut. i advised him to mentally surrender himself to a tidal wave of excrement, as what we then get seems less.

anyhow , we are on our 'staycation' AKA indy midwife used all our money up this year. it's great so far. cos we don't need a smooth run through the house in a rush everyday with dh off work, we've let it get a bit of a tip and i'm really enjoying some spontaneity (limited but there!) compared to the usual daily grind of a million bits of routine.

F% it. I'm just going to keep BF. Forever.
HQ-Hope things improve for you very soon!
MB-Well done on the potty training!

Hmmm. forgot asterisks make bold. It was meant to be a four letter word beginning with f.