November 2012 - Is is too early for birthday plans?!

[StuntNun]

Previous thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/postnatal_clubs/1794169-November-2012-The-Adventure-Continues

Cot bumpers, I think, are out of favour at the moment. I have one though for the reasons you listed above.

Is it a safety/smothering type risk?

Morning all, thanks for all the get well soon wishes.
I was very worried as N is not proudcing alot of wee, he is doing one every 6-12 hours. But it's very hot here, in the shade it's 28c

Evil

We have tooth number 2! Explains the oral aversion and extra nightly wake ups / crying in his sleep. I got ridiculously excited.

Izzy I think there must still be some traces in your diet that he's reacting to - maybe from anything you eat outside the home where you can't read the label. Even in a restaurant if I don't read the label or an allergy menu myself I assume that nothing is safe - hence I travel with a pack up of safe foods. It sucks but it works. Are you looking out for whey protein, lactose and caseinate (??) as they're derived from milk? If you're struggling to eliminate entirely then FF might be the best option even if at first it'll be a hell of a battle. I'd wait until this heatwave passes (so you're not worrying about dehydration), let the higher dose omeperazole kick in, and then see where you are and make the switch if needed. Sending so much love and sympathy your way xxx

Hello. To answer a few questions:

The nurses from the paeds dept are due to phone me on Mon to arrange coming back out. The 'good' nurses has been on holiday and returns then so when she comes out I will explain how crap he has been and see what they suggest. I'm still waiting on dietician appointment too which I hope she can chase up. Im starting to wonder if there are more allergies that he has that I'm eating and this could be keeping him up too.

WRT formula I'm not sure how I feel to be honest. I have a few aspects to consider:

When i switched to FF with my daughter it was a relatively 'easy' decision. I was on meds that meant it wasnt safe to feed her, at least in my head thats what they had told me,they had in fact put me on the 'safest' drug but noone would tell me it was 'safe'. I didntbhave the mental clarity to investigate further. The fact i wanted to BF that time and switched early could be clouding my decision this time? This time the decision isn't easy as there are pluses and minuses to either route...

Yes it would remove me potentially transferring allergens through my milk which in turn may help him sleep. However his sleep might be still poor due to not having found the correct omeprazole dosage yet.

If I switch to FF and he STILL wakes at night then I'm fucked as just now if having a crappy night I can feed lying down. Can't do that with FF plus there is the faff of preparing a bottle at night? How do you guys do this or are they all sleeping through?

J is also likely to be genuinely hungry at night due to the fact he ingests no solids whatsoever so BF is easier for us.

One problem at present is his reluctance to take a bottle with the neocate in which proves difficult when I'm not around. If we took away BF then I guess he would need to take them?

He is still not taking a bottle with wholly neocate in, I have to mix with BM in order for him to drink any and even then he will only take 3oz!!

The fact he has allergies means that my milk is better for him from a health viewpoint, it could prevent them getting worse?

Me being in an exclusion diet would also help when it comes to him actually taking solids too I'd think. He could have off my plate etc and I'd know exactly what he can and can't have.

Argh!! I thought if I listed them all then it'd help me see clearly but I'm stll in a muddle! Please help, even if it's just your opinion!!

mm well done baby M!!!!

Izzy all the positives you list are the reason I'm still on this diet. I wonder if he's intolerant (not allergic) to soy? If it were me I'd whack him up to 2.5mg / kg of omeperazole and go right back to basics with my diet - fruit, veg, meat and slowly add in allergens like eggs, soy, wheat before trying anything processed but I realise with your daughter to cook for as well that'll be tough.

izzy so sorry. I hope every night you are asleep.

chasing I have a breathable cot bumper, a great find for £2 in charity. O wriggles all the time and hits her head in the bars so for us it works.

pr hugs

Can I just have another rant about 2 countries not co-ordinating their policies and laws? O if she gets the Hungarian citizenship is eligible for financial support from the government as her dad passed away. Now because They can't recognise just yet dual nationality, she gets nothing. I have 15 days to reply and I feel I can't fight another battle. We are talking about £100 a month till she is in education.

izzy I admire you for still breast feeding and understand what you are saying. I sometimes feel very down about giving up breast feeding at 5 months but O has been just fine. She does sleep through the night but than she takes solids well.

It's tricky yw I'm already avoiding eggs, milk and peanuts. He could be intolerant to soy i suppose but excluding that too would be a nightmare!

I check the labels on everything! I admit I don't look for every ingredient but as these are all 'labelable' allergens I thought if it didn't say it contained milk it'd be ok? We don't have much processed stuff really, some cooked meat and that's about it. I cook from scratch. except last night we had a cold cooked chicken from asda

izzy Personally I would switch to ff so that you can watch his intake, increase if necessary and to give yourself a well earned rest. You have done amazingly. However I've never been fussed about bf vs ff and have no strong feelings about either so I wouldn't be swayed by what I say iyswim.

izzy I use ready made cartons or the bigger bottles for all over night feeds. They are quite expensive but an absolute sanity saver in my opinion. Bottle sterilised ready, pour in formula, 30 seconds in microwave - job done. You can feed them straight from the carton but N prefers it a bit warmer.

chasing I also have a breathable bumper - called an air bumper I believe.

Izzy, we are on neocate and for night feeds we have the powder in a dispenser in the right amount and the right amount of formula in a bottle. We mix it and he takes it cold. If you want to mix the formula with some boiling water to sterilise it first, make the bottle to 1 oz less then you need, and have boiling water in a flask to add to the bottle when needed. Still no need to leave your bedroom!

By the way, Hi everyone!
I was a poster back in the pregnancy days but up until now I just couldn't keep up with the board. Now I seem to have a little more time to keep up more so thought I would I would give a wave and say hi! Mind if I join back in?

I have cot bumpers. We seem to have different guidelines for everything here.

Welcome back ditsy

Thanks for the opinions. It really helps to see what others think.

kirrin his formula only comes in powder unfortunately as its an hypoallergenic one.

ditsy he likes it warm, I guess he's used to my body temp milk, so a flask and separate powder may work.

Oh and welcome back ditsy were a very friendly and very helpful bunch

I'm just going to come right out and say that I think you should make the switch to formula Izzy. I know I'm completely pro-breastfeeding (understatement alert) but I do think that you have been suffering too much for too long. I have seen the huge difference that me cutting out egg has made for my J - from seven wakenings a night down to two which I'm sure sounds like heaven to you. And then I keep screwing up and eating egg by accident and we're straight back to crappy sleep for the next couple of nights. It seems that your exclusion diet hasn't made much if any difference to your nights so as YW says, there must still be something in your diet that J is reacting to. Yes you will still have to tweak J's meds to minimise his reflux symptoms but that will be easier if you have a better baseline to work from than currently. I also think it will be easier for you to get through your operation and deal with J's oral aversion if you are better rested. The oral aversion will take patience to resolve and I know my patience is in short supply when I'm not getting any sleep. As for the best way to prepare and give formula there is a tonne of knowledge in the quiche to help you.

Only you can make the decision on what to do but I would say don't keep breastfeeding for the sake of breastfeeding, iykwim. I made that mistake with DS1 and tbh I think not only would he have been much happier on bottles (he couldn't latch and was fed using nipple shields for nine months) but I think I would have had less food refusal problems with him and I may have escaped postnatal depression as well.

Of course it is izzy - ignore me I'm an idiot
Flask of hot water and pre-measured powder should still work though? Tbh I made 24 hours worth of bottles in advance, cooled them quickly and stored them in the back of the fridge. I know that's against the official advice but I think plenty do it that way. Not sure if the hypoallergenic stuff is different though?

kirrin that's how I make my feeds up here. Oscar has a mini fridge in his room for one night bottle and one of water. Again, not sure how it works with the other formula, but I'm sure det et al can advise.

Welcome back ditsy!

izzy I simply don't know what to suggest. I can absolutely see both arguments.

Re BM being better for allergies - if wee J is allergic to more substances which you don't know about then continued exposure could make it worse.

My gut response is I think the exclusion diet is just too hard when you are surviving on so little sleep. The formula won't be a magical cure at all but it would ensure that he wasn't being exposed at all.

It's so hard!

Welcome back ditsy how are you and your LO doing?

izzy I am not knowledgeable enough to offer advice but the lovely YW and stunt have given some wonderful comments to consider. You need to think of both yourself and J. I do so wish for improved sleep for you.

I make bottles like kirrin and chasing do, but I make 3 bottles in the morning for the day (getting ready to drop one I think though) and 1 bottle in the evening. If he wakes in the right and needs feeding he has that one and we make another in the morning and he has to wait for it. Otherwise he has the one made the evening before first thing in the morning.

S was much better this morning. Absolute rivers of crusted snot first thing though which I loved picking. Hope this is a sign that whatever ENT infection he was harbouring which caused the temperature spike and hospital dash is now leaving the building.

stunt how is the ankle?

lily that's shit. Can your solicitor advise? Does Hungary have the equivalent of Citizens Advice?

Does any of the quichelets figured out that they can turn in the jumperoo? O is rarely in hers and has no idea that she can turn. She is just sitting in it whining. I have a grumpalump today.

Izzy I also think it is time to swap to the formula. He will drink it if he is hungry and there is no other option, or if he refuses to eat it he would need admitting and having feeds via a ng tube potentially. That is something you would need to consider. Could you cope with that?

I think you should swap for the following reasons (and I am extremely pro-bf also)

1. you have given him 9 months of your milk which is awesome, but it is not working any more, despite you cutting out elements from your diet. Enough is enough. Time to try something else.

2. he clearly has some major issues with food going on. Clarity is needed, and this can only be achieved with using regulated formula and working from there. Also as mentioned before, it will then be clear how much he is taking.

3. you need to feel that you can leave him, for a night, a day, for an operation, without the worry of him eating or not. Best get this over with before you are in a hospital with your innards strapped up.

4. once you have made the decision to stop, you will no longer be torturing yourself with trying to decide what to do. He will be ok on the formula. He may be better on it, but he cannot be any worse can he? Except possibly an ng tube, but hopefully that would not happen.

5. I think the medics would take it a whole lot more seriously when on formula if problems continue.

I gave up breast feeding for similar reasons if you recall, and I have felt very sad about it. But I know it was the best thing for my boy.

QQ neocate? Why neocate not Nutrimigen? Maybe trying that instead?