October 2011 chattering, eating and on the move!

[strawberrypenguin]

New thread!

Now on a completely different topic (and please don't flame me!) can I ask if you leave your baby unattended in one room while you're in another? I'm always leaving e to play in sitting room while I do stuff in kitchen/ pop upstairs to get washing etc. and I wondered if this is normal or whether I should have him with me at all times?

littlepebbleyup I leave Jessica. Left her in cot to have shower, when I'm in kitchen I have door open through to lounge so I can hear her and she can crawl though. I always to a quick check that there is nothing dangerous in reach. It's not like I'm out of sight long ad she usually follows me through and "helps" me. Oh and when on loo, I always leave door open now just need to make sure I remember to shut it when we have guests

littlepebble it is good hearing different views but I know that sleeping can be a contentious issue on here and I really am not meaning to piss people off, it is just these are my views and experiences and I'm a big hippy at heart, and it just feels right.

lp I often leave S playing in livingroom if in through in kitchen etc. tbh, she is moving about so much now that she is never where I've left her!! I'm working on the baby proofing

mama it is good to hear different views on things. What works for one, won't always work for another, I understand that. Maybe working with kids for the past 8 years has turned me into a tough nut and I don't stand for faffing about. In my opinion if S was still waking through night and I knew she wasn't hungry/sick etc I'd be wanting to put a stop to it. But i am one of these people that could leave her crying if I knew it was a tantrum. I don't ponder to every need, baby/toddler/child. They need to learn with some things one way or another
now I understand that will make me sound like a cold hearted bitch, but really I'm not!!

lp I leave H, he's not crawling yet so a bit easier for me, although he does still face plant into things so I have to come running back in to rescue him!

fuzzy I'm glad to hear I'm not the only heartless one

mama it's my own guilt that makes me feel bad when I read posts like yours. I feel I'm being selfish because sleep is so important to me. But that's my problem, not yours, so keep posting your opinions

out really hope you can get some decent rest soon

fuzzy you don't sound cold hearted and I don't wonder about every little cry. My eldest is 12 so been in the business a while too I don't flap at every whimper, it prob sounds like I do, but I don't. I just do what works and is easiest lazy

J awake now so lunch and Paultons park I think for us. Catch up later

overreaction nevereant for one second to make anyone feel bad

mama comfort is one thing, but it sounds like out lo wants to sleep with boob in mouth all through the night, and is waking up and crying for it to be put back in, and falling asleep as soon as it is. To me, that's not even comfort, just bad habit. Comfort is if baby is going to sleep, ill, upset. Not just wanting a nipple in the mouth all the time.

Are you saying that if 9/10mo babies sleep for more than a couple hours we should wake them up, just to send them back off?! C first started sleeping through of his own accord, going linger and longer stretches. He was perfectly happy and gained weight fine.

Is ironic you diss "social fads" and then mention "attachment parenting".

I think parents have to do what keeps mum, and baby happy. If out s lo is waking constantly in the night upset to learn the nipple is no longer in his mouth, that is not a happy baby. A baby that's comfortable and secure, not crying and distressed because he's not permanently attached to a nipple, is most parents hope.

To me, it sounds like the present situation is not benefiting mum or baby. Both sound miserable, she even stated its affecting the bond. That is not "healthy" or "natural".

No no no, I didn't mean it was your fault! It's my paranoia about being a rubbish mum - I can feel guilt about anything and everything I'm just going to stop waffling now!

I would say I'm also a bit of a hippy, but I guess I'm more of a humanist. I don't believe in causing unnecessary pain and suffering to anybody- mums or babies, or allowing it to continue by turning a blind eye.

God, its like the scientologists and their "silent childbirth" thing. Where is the compassion?! Telling women to put up and shut up because its "what nature intended" - if we all followed that rule I wonder how many mums and lo's on here would be dead without emergency intervention in labour? I wouldn't fancy my chances without my emergency c-sec.

Had to respond to scheh firstly baby is only just over 8 months. Secondly I am not suggesting waking a baby every couple of hours and that is a fucking ridiculous statement to make. I said that babies often wake (as do adults) naturally during night and that it's more recent people think and do try to sleep or extended stretches. And no I don't think baby cries evey time boob falls out of mouth but if the baby (like wen ds2 was a baby) nurses for extended periods there is nothing unnatural about that.actually I do take huge offence to you using the terms that it is not natural or normal. . I will not get into the whole what is natural and normal debate here as I really don't think this is the place, but if you want, we can in another forum. And my reference to attachment parenting was to say that Penelope leach isn't a guru like dr sears who promotes a particular parenting style such as attachment parenting but offers a more balanced views with lots of alternatives (some of which are leading baby to settle). It is well worth a read.

I am feeding dc lunch so typing a bit shit, but was really pissed off with the tone of your post and the inference that breastfeeding through the night is unnatural, wether for emotional or physical nourishment.

Phew overreaction I waffle away too.

On another note, C is so fickle! Yesterday he had a massive lunch, today he's barely eating. I made him scones and he's not interested might have to grill cheese on them maybe.

Bar meat/fish/eggs, any other good sources of protein?

And a happy and content baby that doesn't have I scream and cry to fall asleep is my hope. Hence the nursing to sleep. Amazingly my ds's were nursed to sleep and can as children go to sleep by themselves.

Babies will vary what they eat day by day. More helpful to view a weeks intake rather than a day.

But that's exactly what you did, suggest those who don't bf in the night are unnatural and following a "social fad" its only as upsetting/offensive/guilt inducing as your original post.

Nursing to sleep is different to expecting a boob to stay in the mouth and waking up asking for it constantly. Again, the difference between comfort, and habit. I used to nurse to sleep happily.

Ooh, it all kicked off here this morning, didn't it! Fwiw, I'm partially with Mama in that nature gave us a built-in way to soothe our children and therefore I soothe! But for out's lo (sorry, crap at remembering names L maybe??) I'd say there is something else wrong, maybe teeth, maybe poorly, maybe WW, which means he needs extra comfort. I know it's hard, I'm knackered too from night feeding several times a night, but it's not forever. If we were two years down th line and still having the same conversation that would be different. But they're still only 9 months old. And we don't go 12 hours without food so why on earth should they?

AP is only a 'fad' in name, parenting has always been like that and still is in many countries. It's only recent centuries and Western culture that is obsessed with parent and baby being separate.

Am never usually this vociferous but didn't want Mama to be a lone voice! And at all the corrections!

LP I leave too, he is always in ear shot though, or else I'm only popping out of ear shot for a moment (ie taking something upstairs and coming straight back down)

Fuzzzy no heartless, just different! Take all sorts and all that. Noone is wrong or right I think, but I know I have come to my conclusion by listening to lots of opinions, mostly here on MN, and working it out for myself based on what I read about others and what works for us. That's the key for everyone

Did you read my original post properly and then the follow on scheh because that is not what i did. And if that is how you've read it then I am sorry .

However, there is a huge pressure on parents that their baby "sleeps" through and to wean early. That's how it is nowadays in our current society. And he's for the truth of it, nursing and cosleeping is what humanity have down for eons with our young like other mammals. And yes, we replace those natural things with man made comforts such as dummy's and teddies and music boxes etx. Now J has oodles of soft toys and music boxes and I tried ds1 with a dummy (he spat it out). So I am not against using alternatives but my POV is that if you are happy to use what nature gave you, then use it. It's not fair or right to feel pressured to use alternatives or to e pressured to leave your baby to cry "for their own good", when it goes against every natural instinct you have.

Actually think I'll piss off now as I clearly have offended and will go spend day with my monkeys.

It's crazy, that I can't speak up for how I parent for risk of inducing guilt in others. I'm not fucking comparing my abilities or saying I'm superior, just giving my experience as a mum of 3. And actually , what people do with their own children is up to them, but I wouldn't want my grandchildren left to scream and cry to sleep any more than I would want my own.

And the reason I post to pit is because our babies share the same birthday and may well be hitting similar milestones. Like J is teething like mad

Don't fight!

I don't believe either mama or scheh posted with the intention of upsetting another mum, only with trying to offer help to outnumbered as she's having a tricky time.

FWIW I agree with both arguments at different times. While E has been ill, he's slept in our arms/ co slept/ fed to sleep etc. as he was poorly and needed the comfort.

Now he's better however he has a different angry shout and isn't really upset, he just doesn't want to go to sleep in his cot, so I'm leaving him in there and soothing by being in the room/ singing etc.

I'm not breastfeeding anymore though so can't comfort feed (oh how i wished I still was while he was ill).

Anyway enough rambling hope no one is upset

All anyone can do is what they feel is best at the time. No need for bad feeling. In my book I think we are all bloody lucky to have healthy happy babies. They grow up so fast. Enjoy them. Actually enjoy everyday if you can, as we have this life and you're a long time dead as the saying goes.

Mama you can and should speak up for how you parent because it's important to have everyone's views! And as over said, you don't induce guilt, we can do that all by ourselves!

And you are so right, can't believe 9 months has gone already, they do grow fast, and we are very lucky to have healthy babes (esp thinking of expat and her daughter atm).

Fwiw, I spent the whole time with ds1 trying to do things as other people thought they should be done - sleeping through, routine etc and found it so much tougher than this time when I'm letting E lead the way. Just enjoy your babies and do the best you can, I guess.

Now let us all be friends

i'm afraid i'm quite militant on sleep. i would aspire to be like mama but alas my personality will not allow it.

i just cant get through life on little sleep. unfortunately with 3 under 2's in the house it is perhaps a twice weekly thing to get through the night without at least one of them waking up!

but they are all capable of sleeping through. and i totally get where you are coming from about parenting being relaxed and co sleeping etc for years.

its the curse of modern society that mothers have to return to work, fit in school runs, football practise etc.

i understand that when everyone aspires to having their baby sleep though, self settle and you have a different way, it feels like they're saying your way is wrong. i think your way is fantastic- hence me always refering to you as an earth mother! i imagine you all serene (long red locks flowing) barefoot, while your children do painting, get muddy and you're all smiling.

me- i wouldnt even buy the paints, my hair is more likely matted and im saying in a high anxiety voice, argh you're filthy, dont move until ive wiped you!

but and its a little but, i think out needs to try something else other than what she has been doing cos she cant function. if its getting to the point of affecting her relationship with him, then something needs to change.

i think what im trying to say is, its not a criticism of your way(although i can see why you would think that) but its more like saying, that this way, isnt working for HER.

Sorry mama if that sounds patronising. it isnt meant to. ive worked very hard on the wording and explanations- so as to not upset you.

i wish you lived in england out then i could come and support you.

not sure whether to try to give you advice or not, because i dont recall that you asked. i will wait until you do. x