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Nov 2010, our thread's babies are way more awesome than yours' ;)

463 replies

hmmSleep · 06/05/2011 10:46

OK, so I sneakily added the word 'thread's', but went with SGJ's suggestion Grin

OP posts:
Are your children’s vaccines up to date?
Vix7 · 15/06/2011 00:40

Just a quick one. K is teething madly; both lower front teeth are making their way out. As such calgel/teethingpowder/Calpol are my new best friends.

Sleep thru the nite? PAH!! Teething has put any thought of tt out the window. Closest was when she did midnite-7am. Now am lucky if I get 4h continuous!

4mad, K is the same w foods. V moody, sometimes she will eat heaps, other times 2spful is all I can get in her. But pple say she's getting rounder so I guess she's ok. 3 full meals are a looong way off for her.

Then again this mama sometimes forgets/can't be bothered with the purees and stuff. This afternoon I had roast beef sarnie and I simply pinched bits off and fed her. She seemed happy enough. shrug...

Rinny congrats on passing driving!

Wallace · 15/06/2011 22:13

H has what we were having. Apart from no breakfast yet. Even my zen acceptance draws the line at BLW weetabix on a school morning Grin

Nice pics 4mad :)

Hi Rinn! :)

Fenouille · 16/06/2011 21:41

Hi everyone, just back from holidays and a week of co-sleeping as Norry refused to sleep into the travel cots provided by the hotels little sod

Ah well, N's been enjoying nibbling our grilled sardines, lobster (he cried when the waiter took the plate away Shock ) and I think we're ready to start breakfast too. However I have the impression he's drinking more milk than ever! We're off to visit my parents at the end of next week so I guess we'll have to wait until we get back to get a clearer idea of what his real rhythm is at the moment.

What I can recommend is to take your babies to Portugal. My goodness, everyone loves children there. Where ever we went people were making faces, kissing hands and feet, playing peekaboo (a bloke in his 20's on the metro!) and talking baby talk to N. Amazing. The waiters at our hotel even took N off us at breakfast time so we could eat in peace - he played with the moustache of one of them who told DH off for not growing one of his own for N to play with Grin

Hope the non-sleeping babies are giving you all some rest now. N woke for 1-2 hours at a time 2-3 times a night for a week a couple of weeks ago but seems to be over it again so there is hope, even if I may also have muttered that we'll be lucky if he sleeps when he's 16 in my darkest moments...

bunnygirl80 · 17/06/2011 03:41

fen glad you had a good holiday, and that Norry's sleeping well again Smile

4mad I think Will must be eating Merryn's share of food - he's a non-stop eating machine

We're still struggling with sleep here- he went straight from jetlag to being unsettled due to his cold/ear infection - and now I'm finding it difficult to get back on track. Bizarrely, although I heard him wake and babble a couple of times on Sunday night I didn't have to go in to him at all. Then Monday night he was up crying in pain from his ears, and it's been steadily downhill from there. He decided it was getting up time at 5:30 am today, and he's been overtired and completely off our normal routine all day because of it. He's had to miss swimming, which is usually his favourite part of the week, as he screamed and screamed the whole way there because he's just so tired. It feels worse now because after Sunday night I know he's capable of sleeping through the night - I just hope that wasn't the one and only time he'll ever do it Sad

hmmSleep · 17/06/2011 07:03

Saw the link to your hotel Fen, Wow, looks gorgeous, sounds like you had an amazing time.

Hope babies start sleeping better soon. Thankfully Lottie's been in a good sleep phase for a while lately. Unfortunately Ds seems to be constantly ill with one thing or another, croup, then ear infection, then Vomitting bug, so still not an awful lot of sleep going on.

Anyone else piling weight back on since there babies have cut down or stopped breastfeeding? Now Lottie is only on 3/4 feeds a day I'm starting to gain weight, think my body hasn't quite realised it no longer needs the extra calories so I'm really overeating, most get some self control. I have a ball in 3 weeks and I can no longer zip my dress up!

OP posts:
sancerrre · 17/06/2011 13:46

Fen, the people in Portugal sound lovely. I found similar in Puerto Rico recently. The people where I live, however, seem to think its they're place to advise me on what I'm doing wrong whenever I go out!

Much fun and mess on the weaning front here. We're doing weetabix (ridiculously messy) and banana for breakfast. There seems to be less to clear up off the floor each day so there must be some progress being made. Sardines seem to be a good one as they're easy for him to pick up but flake into little bits once bitten. Also made some fish and potato cakes, again, easy to pick up, but mush down once bitten.

Still no crawling and much frustration. No teeth either. One unusual new babyskill though, he managed to undo my bikini bottoms the other day! Not in public and I caught them before they fell down but they now have a much more secure knot in them!

Wallace · 17/06/2011 14:50

Grin at bikini bottom undoing! We have hand-clapping but nothing so advanced as that Wink

fen - lovely :) the people in spain are the same :)

Fenouille · 17/06/2011 20:13

Shock at his bikini bottom skills! Although Envy at you (and hmm while I'm at it) wearing a bikini - I haven't lost a single ounce since the fortnight after the birth. Really need to start some sort of exercise regime but I don't know when and with what energy...

Wallace The baby love seems to be the whole of the south of Europe apart from the miserable so-and-sos in southern France (or maybe just the latin bits). My Italian friend said she praised a little baby when she first arrived here and got the response, "Yes we know Angry" Hmm How can you get angry at that?

Sancerre my friend in Germany says every time her daughter cries while she's out she gets a chorus of people telling her that her DD must be starving and why isn't she feeding her? She's starting to get a bit irritated by it all, but at least people are showing an interest I suppose. Can you just explain that as a crazy Brit you have to do it 'this' way? Grin Or do a reverse Manuel? "What, what? Terribly sorry I don't understand" Grin

sancerrre · 19/06/2011 15:03

That's a good idea, Fen, will pretend I don't know what they're on about rather than trying to explain myself to them! And no need to be Envy about the bikini - I shamelessly wore mine all the way through pregnancy. I've not even bought a new bikini top to accomodate my new grown up size boobs!

Bit of a bad night last night. William had a fever during the day and then at night was sick, more than I thought could have fitted in his tummy. There are signs of teething too, hand in mouth, looking like he's in pain. I've heard the fever can be related to teething but can vomiting be part of it too? Or would that be something else? Tummy bug?

Fenouille · 19/06/2011 20:59

No idea Sancerre, but I think that I would suspect tummy bug rather than teething. How's he doing now? Has paracetamol brought his temperature down?

We're having a sleep nightmare here. Last night and tonight we simply can't get Norry to go to sleep. It's 9.30 and he's been wide awake since 7.30 after sleeping for half an hour. I don't know if we should try moving his bedtime back or what. He looks knackered (he isn't napping either) but he is just resisting going to sleep. Any ideas? What routines do you all do? We do dinner, bath, bf to sleep between 6.30-7pm. He normally wakes about an hour after going down but I've always been able to bf him back to sleep up to now. That was annoying enough but this is exhausting. He's sleeping pretty well once he's down (one waking a night generally) but it's the getting him to sleep that's killing us at the moment.

Anybody read the no cry sleep solution or one of the other sleep 'guru' books? What are the big ideas? Just consistency? Or a magic bullet (or just a bullet Grin)? I've reserved the no cry sleep solution at the library for when we're home next week but some other desperado parent has it out so no idea if I'll actually be able to get my hands on it.

bunnygirl80 · 20/06/2011 01:24

fen I think William and Norry must be in cahoots!!! He woke up 8 times on Fri night, 6 on Sat and last night woke up 2 hrs after going to bed and took 2.5hrs to resettle (but then actually slept really well once he was asleep)[grrrrr]

I rang our local parenting helpline, who have really helped me in the past with sleep issues. Their opinion was that frequent nightwaking and staying up for ages was down to a combo of 2 things: overtiredness and the sleep regression they have when they start to crawl. They were reassuring that it's really really common at the 7-9mth age range and it will pass. The advice I got to help speed up a return to normal sleep was to enforce daytime naps so he has 2 of at least 1hr 15mins and possibly a third catnap if he wakes before 3pm from his afternoon nap. If he wakes after 3pm it's a bit late to get a third nap in, so aim for an early bedtime (we're currently putting him to bed at 6!)

As for staying awake for hours, William is waking and not crying but laughing to himself and having a crawl around his cot. The opinion on that was that in their experience you can't make them go back to sleep if they're doing that, so just ignore until he either puts himself back to sleep or cries - then do whatever you'd normally do to settle him. The other key thing was getting him to self settle, which William is more than capable of doing - and I hear him stir and go back to sleep at least once or twice in the night - he's just getting overtired to a point where he's so wired he can't get back to sleep.

I love "no cry sleep solution" if only because it's the only sleep book I've read that gives you realistic expectations of babies sleep patterns i.e. that the average baby isn't sleeping through until well into the second 6 months of their life. The basic prinicples are to keep a diary of his day and night sleeps for 10days, including how what you did to resettle him, and then review what you think the issues are. You then pick solutions based on your problems - so Norry probably thinks he needs to feed to sleep to resettle at night, so you would change that association gradually. To break the feed to sleep association you basically delatch him once he's finished drinking and moved onto comfort sucking and move him away from your breast asap, if he cries to go back on try and settle him with a cuddle, but if he still won't settle, put him back on for up to 30secs then delatch again. Keep going until he comes off without crying. The first few times he's likely to be pretty much asleep when he comes off, but over a few nights he will eventually stop feeding to sleep. You can then either try and get him into the cot while he's drowsy or you may need to combine that with teaching him another way to self settle - the main way she uses in the book is to rock them until they're drowsy, then put in the cot. Once he's happy with that, rock until he's calm then put in the cot. Then move onto just patting in the cot, and basically just gradually withdraw how much assisstance you give him until he's able to put himself to sleep.

I used it to break William's feed to sleep association and it worked very rapidly. We weren't as successful with the withdrawing of the rocking to sleep - we got as far as patting in the cot but no further, so we did leave him to cry one night. I think by that point he was actually well able to settle himself though, as he cried for less than 5 mins before going to sleep.

The methods do work, but they are alot slower than the methods that involve some crying, so it depends how rapidly you want a solution.

After that epic summary you probably don't need to borrow the book Grin

Wallace · 20/06/2011 07:15

sleep regression here too....

hmmSleep · 20/06/2011 10:24

I echo what bunny said Fen, try breaking the feed to sleep association. I now feed Lottie downstairs after her bath, if she falls asleep I wake her up and read her a story in her bedroom before putting her in her cot. This way they learn to self settle and if they wake in the night are much more likely to resettle themselves. I'm always amazed how quickly they adapt to these changes too, normally a nightmare for a couple of nights and then suddenly it all clicks into place. Good luck!

OP posts:
lainey1981 · 20/06/2011 13:16

Hi all,
Sorry for those suffering sleep nightmares, good advice posted here, which
I shall refer to when if Finn regresses again.
sancerre how is William now? Hope he is better x
Not much to report here, just settling dowm to watch Wimbledon. Yay for maternity leave/ redundancy!
Father's day was a write off as dp fell of a chair he was standing on looking for something and bruised his ribs/cut himself. He was stuck on the couch medicating with gin all day while I became a mum of 2 for the day!

sancerrre · 20/06/2011 13:42

No sleep regression here as William's never slept well so nowhere to regress to! Thanks for all the tips above though bunny and hmm. Will definitely be trying all of them. Good to hear the average baby isn't sleeping through till their second 6 months, makes me feel better than all the books and the paediatrician that tell me he should be. Must take some will power, hmm, to wake her once she's asleep, but worth it if it works.

sancerrre · 20/06/2011 13:43

William's much better, thanks. The fever was gone by the morning. Still no teeth though.

Fenouille · 20/06/2011 13:53

Oh no lainey hope he's feeling better now. I've got a massive head cold so DH got the present of looking after N all day while I lay in bed groaning.

Sancerre How are you and William doing?

Shock bunny it does rather sound as if Norry and Will are working shifts! Thanks for the book resume (and the help line advice). I think I need to start unlatching him a bit earlier then. Half the time he wakes as I lay him down anyway so DH goes and cuddles him to sleep. If we don't do that I am wondering though what you do when the screaming starts. It just gets louder and louder here and doesn't stop util you pick him up. Probably 5 mins is the longest we've left him crying and neither of us were very happy about that. It's definitely not calming crying, he works himself up into a proper bate. But if DH goes back in and rocks him off again then surely that's not going to change anything? Or should DH rock him until the crying subsides, stick him back in the cot then pick him back up as the howling starts again? That could go on quite a while... I know you're all right, I don't think any of us enjoy the evenings very much at the moment.

It is definitely overtiredness though as he always sleeps better during the week when someone more competent is looking after him

And bunny can I please ask you how you enforce the naps? He just cries and screams if I hold him and don't feed him and if DH walks him around he just gets really perky, even in a darkened room. The CM thinks he might just be wanting to spend all his time with us at the weekend as he sleeps fine with her during the day but I'm convinced she must have a magic potion to get him to sleep that she won't share with us grrr

bunnygirl80 · 21/06/2011 05:20

hmm glad I'm not the only one who wakes their baby if they feed off to sleep. Sometimes I think I'm mad for doing it, but it definitely seems to help him self-settle if he wakes later (well at the moment it's anyone's guess what he'll do when he wakes, but it used to work Smile)

sancerre I have a book that suggests that they'll only sleep through if they're in the author's preferred brand of sleeping bag. Perhaps your mistake has been an incorrect choice of sleeping attire Wink

fen I enforce naps with a big stick Wink TBH I try and enforce them but it doesn't always work. We have most success if we take him for a walk in the pram. If he's in his cot then if he wakes after only one sleep cycle I'll leave him for 5mins or so to see if he'll drift off again. If not then I go in a give him his dummy. Half the time that works, if not I get him up, but if he still seems tired I'll take him for a walk in the pram or the Ergo carrier, and he more often than not dozes off again.

Norry probably settles well for the CM because he knows she's never going to BF him off to sleep (unless they do things differently in France Wink) so he's learnt to settle himself some other way when he's there. When he's with you he's learnt that BFing is how he goes to sleep so that's what he expects.

The decision re what to do if he cries when you put him in the cot is up to you. If you'd prefer to go down the no/minimal crying route then the book suggests you try and settle him in the cot by patting/body rocking but if he's getting upset then you pick him up and rock him again. You may have to repeat and repeat and repeat but he will eventually drift off, and it'll take less and less time each time you do it. In the book she describes a method of rocking that reduces the shock of going from being rocked in your arms to the stillness of the cot and makes them more likely to settle. You basically alternate rocking with standing motionless, until he's drifting off, then start to place him in the cot. But instead of just putting him down you keep your arms around him and keep alternating movement and stillness. As he settles there gradually loosen your grip but keep alternating the movement and stillness until you're no longer touching him. I did this with William and it worked amazingly well. He would stir and open his eyes as he was lowered into the cot, but then settle pretty quickly after each phase of removing first one hand then the other. Over time you reduce the amount of time you spend on the routine until you're able to just put him down.

If you want faster results then you might just have to bite the bullet and hear him cry a bit (not that I'm saying you should leave him to cry unless you feel comfortable with the idea). I ended up doing that with Will as his sleep was regressing faster than no cry sleep solution was working, but I think because he'd started to get used to the idea that he was going to fall asleep in his cot, it was pretty painless in the end. I just put him down awake and left the room. If his cries escalated from I'm tired, to I'm angry and upset then I'd go in and pat him until he was calm and then just sit in the corner of the room. It only took a couple of days before he was settling himself to sleep without crying at all.

Right, after trying to pretend I'm some sort of sleep guru again, I'd better go and bring the washing in as it looks like it's about to pour with rain.

bunnygirl80 · 21/06/2011 06:02

Washing rescued in the nick of time, and I've remembered what I came on here to tell you all in the first place Grin

My friend's baby who is only a week older than Will has started shaking his head for "no" Shock At first I thought she was perhaps exaggerating the talents of her PFB but I've now seen it for myself and he really truly does shake his head when he doesn't want something. I'm not entirely sure Will even understands the concept of no yet alone have the ablility to try and communicate it. I have signed us up for a baby sign language course so soon he should be able to tell me what's going through his mind........I fear it may be not alot!!

Wallace · 21/06/2011 07:05

H shakes his head sometimes. I must pay attention next time to see what he is telling me Grin

Fenouille · 21/06/2011 12:40

Bunny Your status as sleep guru is officially confirmed, as simply through MN posts alone you made Norry self settle last night Shock Shock I think he must be even more intelligent than your friend's (and Wallace's) nodding babies Wink as he obviously listened to me explaining your posts to DH yesterday evening and then decided to try it out for himself!

Seriously, I don't understand babies at all. But thanks for all the advice, it seems as though we have something to work on now.

And wow at the communicating babies. Norry only shakes his head when I try to spoon slop delicious homemade puree into him - perhaps he's trying to tell me something Hmm

bunnygirl80 · 22/06/2011 01:03

fen if my sleep guru skills are that good perhaps I should start marketing them....I could make millions.

William actually slept really well last night too - only one wake up with a very blocked nose at 2am. I actually had to wake him this morning to get him to nursery on time Shock He was not impressed Grin

BorisTheBold · 22/06/2011 01:11

Lovin' the posts - and really feel for those with night-time ravers

will refrain from posting anything about weird child who never fails to stick her thumb in her gob and falls asleep within two mins , will instead mention how All my children are currently asleep and I, who is also knackered after a day of organising horse riding, can't get to sleep because of fucking hiccups.

I know it's karma or summat Grin

4madboys · 22/06/2011 12:32

bunnygirls tips are great, you just have to have the patience and the perserverace to perservere with them and remember taht is is going to be two steps forward one back, esp with teething, colds etc.

can i ask how the babies are doing with food and milk, merryn still only on one meal a day and doesnt always have taht if i am busy Blush bad mummy

but she is fussing with her milk again, just playing and taking ages, most annoying.

so am debating tryign to give her more food ie twice a day adn then at 7mtsh add in bfast and cut some of her bottles down to 4oz, (she currenlty has 5-6oz 5times a day) i know its 20oz once past 6mths but surely that is once they are established on solids and merryn most def is not and no where near it tbh!

she just isnt interested but she does like chewing on her feet Hmm

IdDoAndyMurrayInAHurry · 22/06/2011 16:01

4mad you clearly need to put food on Merryn's feet. Problem solved.
Finn generally has between 25-28oz a day. For the last few days he has been on. 2 proper meals a day rather than just tastes, so veggies and fruit for lunch then veggies or pasta and sauce followed by fromage frais. Not sure what quantity he is eating half-3/4 of a weaning pot full I guess. He does love pretty much everything and enjoys having food from my plate, like sucking on chicken breast.
I am also looking at when to introduce brekkie, he is 7 months on 29th so might look to introduce it then.
Current schedule is roughly
7oz milk 7-8am
Nap around 10am
7oz milk 11.30-12pm
Lunch 2-2.30ish ( sometimes miss this if i forget or he is asleep)
Nap around 3pm
Dinner 6pm
4-7oz milk between 8-9 depending on bedtime.

Am thinking of introducing breakfast an hour or so after first milk, then bringing lunch forward to 12 and moving the 2nd bottle to before 2nd nap. Will aim to do this over the next 4 weeks.
Does that seem an achievable way to get up to 3 meals and down to 3 milks?

Sorry for epic post