FEB 2010 Longer out than in and first Christmases around the corner...we're 9 months on.

[InmaculadaConcepcion]

Shiny new thread, as promised fellow FEBers!

Figured we would start another new one to mark first birthdays, bethlou, so I've held fire on referencing that landmark in this thread title - hope that's okay with y'all!

Anyway, welcome everybody, pull up a comfy chair, someone get the wine out and I'll open a huge box of chocolates for us all to share.

a few random thoughts before heading to bead - sorry you're having a tough time LBH

Ds fave thing at the mo is fig rolls - WCress good for keeping regular, as is a bit of brown sugar on cereal, or honey (which we used with DD after she turned 1)?

starting to feel christmassy, which is nice

have spent a couple of days mostly with DD cos she asked if we could spend some time just the two of us? all day yesterday baking etc which was lovely but she kept pushing boundaries which became a little tiresome ? and today she has been a little grot with me? bless her

need to fill in the school forms for her, but it seems so daft as we'll not be living here come sept (unlikely at least!)

St Nich? lovely - often used to be in Holland this time of year, and would get to leave our clompen out on the step for St Nich and maybe schwarzer peter?? lost in the mists of time!

off to bed-night all!

LittleBear I hope you're okay. I think it's really hard for both of you. I have lived with siblings who suffer from depression and it is very tough. I know from experience that you want to shake sense into them, get them to snap out of it, and sometimes it's hard to remember that it's just not that easy. I also know that depression is all consuming and I think you have to allow for your DH to have bad days too. I know it's really hard but try to keep the lines of communication open. Believe me I know what it's like. You will get through this, running out of anti-depressants really doesn't help! You sound really down, hang in there and I second what BG said about postponing returning to work. PND is really serious and I'm sure your GP would agree. You may want to suggest your DH reads this Big hug!

LBH I hope that DH was just having a bad day and he's better tomorrow. That link from abs is great and hope he reads it.

Hope no-one laughs at me, but I've been looking at unconditional parenting. I mentioned it to DH and he gave a face. But to his credit he got a DVD out from the library of a 2hr talk Alfie Koln (sp?) and he was quite impressed although unsure about not doing positive reinforcement. Anyone else pondering a UP approach?

I think she's teething again, was only happy last night if she had a nipple in her mouth but was OK today, but we were out in the sling all day, taking lovely walks along the beach, watching the surfers, pelicans and general greatness. Oh and I was also at work, but reckoned I spent more quality time with her than otherwise. I was just supervising a grad student so only needed to set him up and pop in every so often. There's def. perks to having a beach outside your office.

one more thing, it's probably obvious really. We have been struggling to get DD to take a decent quantity of water, pooing seems to quite frequently cause her pain despite loads of fruit etc. I finally realised that we could fix it her making her teat hole bigger (her sippy cup is also quite difficult to get water out, we tried). So a bit of DIY later and she guzzled down a couple of oz's with ease. I don't get why she drinks milk so fast but not water, but hey ho.

We squeezed some oranges into it, hence didn't want her drinking too much. Will let you know the results tomorrow, fingers crossed.

Thanks for support. Means a lot even though I am sitting here in tears. You lot set me off :)

DP doesnt do empathy. Ever.

I will write more when I can. Sorry this is all me.

CC DD wont drink much water, less than 1oz. She spits it out with a grin. She has had a cup from 4 months. I even tried juice! However, she will drink more if the water is lukewarm....

She is not constipated at the moment. But I mash a little water in with fruit as her pudding.

Hope this helps.

Oh, maybe this info is any good to anyone... dd2 is now fine with any temperature of water and drinks from an open cup with me holding it (meaning proper gulps rather than sips). To start with she only drank very warm water (same temperature as her milk basically). Worth a try?

St Nicolas has been

Nikolaus

SO gorgeous, BG!
Your DD2 would probably have been as happy with just the shoe

What is it about shoes? My DD loves eating hers. She has a few (now outgrown) that are designated for chewing on. They are her very favourite things!

Good to hear from you, LBH, sorry we set you off crying! That thing Abs posted looks very useful. Hopefully things will start to pick up again for you and your DH, especially once you've got your anti-Ds again.
But keep venting here. We'll always offer support and it's good to have an outlet (and don't feel you need to apologise for it, either).

Ah yes, CC, I saw you'd posted on the UP thread in Parenting. I will probably look into it, although like most of these things (Attachment Parenting, Routine-based parenting, purees vs BLW etc. etc.) I expect I'll pick out the bits that seem to suit me and DD and leave the rest (a bit like my religious thinking, really ).

DD woke up at 05.45 yesterday and wouldn't go back to sleep. And she only managed 30mins then 45mins napping in the buggy, too. A bit overtired, I suspect - although she was in a cheerful enough mood.
I wondered if it would impact on the night and sure enough, she woke only 45 mins after going down, which is unusual. She cuddled back down quickly, luckily, then woke again (for an hour or so ) at 02.30, then slept until 06.15. She even managed another 15mins or so and got up at 06.45, which, all in all, is an improvement on yesterday.

The weather's been rubbishy, loads of rain.
But this cheered me up

We're off to have lunch with some friends soon - they've kindly brought Spanish lunchtime forward by an hour to English lunchtime to accommodate Rosie's second nap. Bless them. (It's a holiday in Spain today - St Nick, I guess - and another on Wed - hoorah!)

(((big hugs))) to LBH - I am so sorry things are hard right now. The others have given lots of good advice. Important to keep talking to DH. Stick to the point and don't muddy the water with other issues. Try to stay calm and rational (difficult when DHs are being annoying or unreasonable I know). I was depressed for a while when ttc and there was a book that really helped me called Depression: The way out of your prison by Dorothy Rowe. She really gets it, it just helped to read someone describe exactly how I was feeling and know I was not alone but there is also a lot of helpful stuff in there too - www.amazon.co.uk/Depression-Way-Out-Your-Prison/dp/158391286X And try not to run out of anti-ds.

CC funnily enough I ordered the Alfie Kohn book yesterday. It was all the arguments and nasty sniping about it on Parenting from people like LeQueen (who I can't stand) that got me interested. I just want to find out what the guy actually says, am completely undecided as I don't know enough and I don't know what sort of child DS is going to grow up to be.

I'm also thinking about homeschooling if he doesn't get into the nice primary school round here. Either that or leaving London. I had a bit of a heart to heart with DH last night - I am so worried about his education. The big primary that is basically on our doorstep is full of kids from the big estate and I'm worried they will have behaviour issues and he'll be bullied.

We have been starting the day just after 5am for the past three or four mornings so not in the greatest mood. Have decided not to delay bedtime as he is obviously still tired when he wakes up. We have been leaving him in the cot as long as we can stand it and as long as he isn't actually screaming but it is not ideal. Am hoping it is just the 35-40 week unsettled period and will get better. At least he is sleeping from 7-5 without waking, eh?

IC very fetching

In the last 5 mins my child care arrangements have just fallen through too...my friend has just found out she is pregnant, she has a 2.5 yr old and says she will be too tired.

I dont blame her but dont know what we are going to do now... trying not to panic.

Most of the UP is common sense. I think you have to pick and mix, be true to yourself and listen to your child and his needs. And be flexible, because you can have some great theory which won't fit your child and you have to be ready to change your parenting (or go against your family beliefs).
I remember I met a woman from playgroup at Tesco, and she went on that her children were horrible shopping (screaming, tantrums....), but I couldn't possibly understand because DD1 was so well behaved... No she wasn't, DD1 had just been fed on time, and had been playing in the morning and was happy in the pram having a rest, gently starting her nap! The woman's kids had been at the mall all morning stuck in their prams, weren't fed yet and were probably overtired too, DD1 in the same situation would have been horrible (actually if not fed she would probably have screamed the place down, so the other kids were well behave compared to her! )

May be I should write a book to teach parents common sense ! But then I have no idea of what I am doing! . Just that kids need to be fed, need to sleep and need exercises, if you respect that you can almost do anything you want to, just may be not in the order you want to

I don't do positive reinforcement I don't think it is good to teach children to do things for reward all the time. But it can be a tool for something special (you can watch TV if you sit on the potty long enough to poo! ). As for the naughty step/timeout it worked for a bit to teach that some behaviors were not allowed (screaming and punching), but mainly gave both of us time to calm down and is almost not needed now.

And they need boundaries. They have to know that some things are allowed and not others, and the rules don't changed, that actually make them feel safe.

So IC advice sounds sensible to me.

LBH hugs again. If you can't talk to your DH write a note or a email, it helps you put your ideas in order and it might give him the time to read it and understand it better. Make sure he acknowledges it though! Can you have a walk everyday? (it does help to be able to go out a bit even if the weather is not great a the mo in the UK).

I do pick and mix parenting ... pretty much agree with everything IC and mamaloco have said.

IC was it you who imitates your LO's mannerisms? I just did that with mine and she now thinks her mummy has lost the plot . With fingerfood she likes to offer it up to the sun (or something), holds it up high, goes 'Ahhh' and then puts it in her mouth. I just copied her with a spoonful of her lunch and she gave me a look of complete astonishment ['You too, Mama??' or probably 'Are you feeling quite okay Mama?' ]

stoof the cake by the way was quite fantastic. Even dh had quite a bit and he doesn't normally eat cake.

What a lot to catch up on!

LBH how are you feeling now? Have you got more anti-Ds? Very to hear what your DH said to you. And I do hope you manage to sort out your childcare arrangements. How worrying. Presumably you don't have parents nearby? Have you thought of a CM? My friend is paying hers £4/hour which I was at as I paid my cleaner £11/hour (when I had one.... those were the days). Could you afford that? If not, is it worth you going back to work? Does your work provide childcare vouchers, too? Also remember that you can get help with childcare costs in your CTC (child tax credits).

Ah my friend has just arrived for lunch half an hour late, more later.

DD2 and I went to a friend for a coffee. DD2 managed to bite off a piece of driftwood art thingy, then when we removed it she decided to attack the straw chairs (and left marks)

Sneaking on while boys fall asleep (and window clearner does his best to stop them ).

LBH There should be a children's information service for your area who can give you masses (often too much) info on childcare in your locality. Here it had all sorts of useful info about all the different childminders/nurseries etc.. and I only went to see two nurseries and two childminders before making a decision. If you know anyone locally, ask them about minders etc.. as a recommendation often works best.

You are in a very similar situation to my best friend who struggles with depression and had to go back to work just after her original childminder fell through. I know she found it hard, but if you do have to go back at the mo(though BG's advice on sicknote etc.. sounds very sensible), then I know she looks back and realises that it all happened for the best in the end. Maybe you will too?

We have proved in the last few months that we can't live without my salary so I will be going back in January, despite the DC's health problems. I have no idea how I'm going to manage but blindly ploughing on for now (with the knowledge that my lovely GP is keeping an eye on me and would happily sign me off if it was all too much).

I'm so sorry you're not getting support from your DP. I like the idea of writing to him or printing off Abs's link for him. I have a very empathetic DH but at times he becomes exasperated with me on days when I've had enough - I'm not saying I totally understand your feelings because I'm not depressed, but I'm sure it must be so hard for both of you. What I liked most about Abs link is that it tells you straight away that you will get better.

Just having a baby under one year old can make you feel like life will be like this forever, but it gets easier. DH and I got on a lot better last time round once DS1 reached a year old and started sleeping (a bit!). I'm beginning to sense an improvement again this time, although I'm still very stressed with the health issues and DH resents the amount of chores we both need to do in the evenings.

Sorry for the ramble-hope this helps a little (and is sent with more hugs).

mamaloco I think it is time for the dog muzzle idea

Mincepies Really at your friend paying £4 an hour! Is the CM minding several children or just hers? That's not even the minimum wage....

Mamaloco your DD sounds like that shark in Egypt!

LBH how exasperating! Everyone on here seems to be giving you good advice regarding childcare...

CC and BC it all sounds very interesting and tbh I'd never even heard of it until you brought it up. I've just read the interview with AK on his site, it is definitely worth thinking about... don't think Supernanny has read it!

Funnily emough mamaloco he pretty much said the same thing. You should be asking why they're behaving that way (e.g. tired, unfair expectations) instead of just getting them to act like you want all the time. I think it will be good for me to actively think about these things as I don't want to automatically slip into behaving like people around me did when I was going up. I'm afraid of doing it without knowing. Even now my home town kinda behaves like kids should be routined from the get go, early weaning etc etc.

Ladies, the larger holed bottle and 50:50 orange:water worked REALLY well. Today we'll just give her water from that bottle and see how that goes.

Ooh, mamaloco said I was sensible and BG agreed!

"Pick 'n' Mix Parenting" henceforth known as PM Parenting, excellent title!

BG, I think we'll definitely have the SW meet-up somewhere other than my place after reading of your DD's destructive urges...
Also most amused at your DD's reaction to you imitating her, heh!
Yep, I honestly find myself saying "brahbrahbrah, nyang, nyang, nyang...." without even realising I'm doing it. And this is when DD is out with DH!

LBH, that sucks, as if you needed that on top of everything else (although it's good news - presumably- for your friend). Can't add anything to the advice given upthread, hope you can get something sorted without too much extra stress and expense.

On the subject of pg....
Nope, not me, but some friends of mine who spent ages ttc then had a few unsuccessful rounds of IVF (including a failed pregnancy) have just had a DS who was conceived naturally after they had given up the idea of ever having a family. SO chuffed for them.

MincePies how are your friends doing?

Well, we had a lovely day out eating veggie paella cooked by a friend of ours. DD helped by obligingly having two decent pram naps and by being very cute indeed while we were at our friends' place.

Time to toddle off to bed.

Hasta manana, chicas!

Good news on the fluid front, CC!

IC I wish I could go to bed as early as you. But I really can't sleep if I try to go before ten. In fact I couldn't sleep last night even at 11, and I am sooooooooo tired today [hollow-eyed emoticon]. (I know you're an hour ahead but it still seems massively early to me )

Congratulations to your friend! That is brilliant news . They are all little miracles but this one more than most maybe?!

My friend's DD is doing OK, thank you for asking . We heard from them on Saturday, they said she's doing well but has a couple of complications, didn't specify. I don't think you could expect not to have any comp.s at this gestation but it is so encouraging that she's still here and still fighting. I have bought the congratulations baby girl card at last. OK to send it do you think?

I have never heard of UP and haven't had time to look on the link, either. I'm trying to just go with my own flow a bit. I read crazily while preg and the advice is all so conflicting; I just want to be kind to my DD but within a structure. I agree with mama that DCs need boundries to feel secure. But most of all they need love right?!

Good luck to all of those with job interviews and going back to work. I am supposed to be working on my CV right now as my ex-boss thinks there is a position that I could do in a sister company. But I was just coming round to the idea of being a SAHM and poor as a church mouse. The idea of a new job is actually pretty terrifying .

Oh Abs the CM looks after her own one, and my friend's DD I think. Because she is self-employed there are no minimum wage regulations. But still. I find it bizarre that you can pay someone a third of what you would to clean your house,to look after your child

I'm just glad it wasn't me who had to clear it up. One of the perks of being at work

yay, the sun's back

mince I'm the same, although I understand it, it just sits wrong.

IC that's great about your friend

LBH how's things today? You talked yet?