December 2008: because i unwittingly finished the old thread

[waitinggirl]

oops. sorry. didn't realise i was post 1000. hope people find this...

spot Love you sound so down at the minute and being clackered and sleep deprived is a seriously shitty mix.

On the fussy food thing just wanted to add my experience into the mix fwiw. DD was a shockingly faddy eater, it started when she was about 18 mths I'd say. I made it worse I think always gave in to her and offering herwhat she wanted(not that its wrong to do it - I still do!!). I have lost count of the number of times that like you I've begged her to eat, I've screamed at her, shouted, cried myself...never made her eat any more or less. I also know that feeling of trying to get them to eat anything through fear they will wake hungry in the night. However, since starting school (and school dinners) the girl eats constantly and a much more variety. I know its a way off for T but things WILL improve. Sadly, DS appears to be going down the same route. He was such a great eater, now we have a limited amount of foods he will eat and it drives me potty!

DS is usually awake between 5.30 - 6am every day. Its his morning time, he's never tired when he wakes and its often gone 1pm when he seems tired enough for a nap. I guess some toddlers don't need as much sleep as others. Not that any of this is helpful. Just wanted you to know that T is just like a lot of others his age.

I also second what Effie says though. We are so hung up on 3 meals at set times etc. I bet our continental chums find us a crazy bunch! I guess toddlers really do only eat when they want to.

Love to everyone else x

Oh thanks Lady I forgot about that place.

Well tonight dd did wake at 2am this time so just 3 hours after the last feed but only took 2oz so that's good. She barely woke up. But then she woke up at 0530 as her nappy had leaked and wet her clothes so changed her and she didn't want milk just went back to sleep until I've just woken her now.

your ds spot sounds like me. My chest is red raw from coughing all night. I'm sure I kept dh up this time- not the kids.
DS still hacking lungs up.

The bit I don't understand Spot is why he won't have milk in the day. If he went those times without it at night he would end up getting hungry and take it when it is offered. I'd def do the Vitamin drops as lady suggested that way you will feel a bit better knowing that he's getting some nutrients.

Oh dear.... nappy calling

WG Of course you miss your mum at those dark middle of the night hours. I wish I could say something to make things better.

spot I'd say at the moment T isn't well and you are exhausted and you need to adopt a strategy that is easiest for the both of you. I'd second LadyTs vitamin drop suggestion - according to my HV all toddlers should have them regardless of whether they are a fussy eater. I'd then for the moment give T things he likes to eat. I wouldn't worry about variety (he'll get vits from the drops) or introducing anything new. Just take things easy for a few weeks and when you feel brighter and T is back on form you can introduce different things again.

Also just an aside.... my DD eats most meals but since she was 1 has bearly had a scrap of fruit at home. However she has continued to eat fruit at nursery, all sorts, orange segments, pears . In the past few weeks she has just started asking for fruit at home and ate half an apple the other day. I think they have their own strange ideas about food and it may be that they need to come round to things over time. Who know?!

Rubes Have you tried giving DS rice pudding to get him to have more milk in the day? If you are relaxed about sugar I can give you the recipe!

Jolly did you mean Spot? My DS has Loooooooooads of milk in the day - he's had 2 big cups already, but only because he ate all his weetbix and banana

Oh Spot - you poor love. You must be exhausted. It must be so hard. Don't go thinking that you're a bad mother or anything like that - we are all doing the best we can and it sounds like you're doing everything possible to get T to eat. DD1 also barely eats a thing. I can just about manage to get hummus down her, but she just sucks the breadstick dippers and doesn't eat them. Nursery can't get anything down her either. It's so wearing, but when she's really hungry, she'll eat fishfingers and potato waffles. I have pretty much given up trying to get healthy food down her as she's just not interested and I get more and more upset about it. She will eat fruit, which is such a relief. My friend juices veggies and gives them to her son because he won't eat them. I think that might be the way forward with DD1 too. Am going to try it!

WG - it must be so hard missing your Mum. I can't imagine it. Poor love. But am glad your DH is interested in going to counselling. Definitely get him to go sooner rather than later because of 2 on the way.

All well here. I have lost one of DD1's crocodile wellies. She will be devastated. I bought her a new pair of yellow ones, but they're not the same, so will be taking them back. WEnt into shop I bought crocodiles from and they've been discontinued. HOWEVER, I went onto Amazon and found her a pair of the same crocodiles for £2 more and a delivery fee of £2 and I've got them. Spoilt child??! But I loved them too. Am now beating myself up about the cost of them etc, but feel like I've redeemed myself by getting them for her. Hoping they arrive pre weekend as we're off to my parents on Friday morning.

Right, must have lunch as DD2 may wake at any moment! Routine isn't really happening these days. Never mind. DD1 at nursery. She LOVES it there!

beans DD has ladybird ones and I'd buy more online if we lost one! It is really good to hear DD loves nursery!

rubes Sorry I did mean spot re the rice pudding.

Spot, I don't think any of us are "natural" mothers. I found often those mothers who seem to be 100% blissfully happy 24/7 are those who struggle the most behind closed doors. Please try not to beat yourself up ..

I think the age they are at is a very difficult time for eating. They have realised they can say no! And that combined with the exhaustion of tantrums etc is very tiring. I find DD3 very hard work at the moment.

With DD1&2 they were brilliant eaters until they were 2. I used to smugly shovel Annabel Karmel purees down them and they would eat every scrap. Then they realised they would refuse/make a fuss etc. I struggled to get any protein into them at all - in fact to get them to eat much else than yogurt and toast.

Luckily we had a very sensible health visitor who said to look at what they ate over a month, not just a day or even a week. Even if you resort to shop bought smoothies for fruit or pizza for cheese and tomato - at least it's getting some food into the kids. It won't last for ever so plenty of time to expand their palate!

I resorted to making smoothies with bananas, milk and honey and then blending tofu into them - so at least they were getting some protein, couldn't taste it but drank it all up. Now they are at school they eat loads of different things and nursery helps too - the peer pressure of everyone eating the same thing.

I also find that if I give the kids some toast/fruit etc at teatime and then sit down to eat my food later they are much keener to eat something they see me eating. My three will often eat half my plate of noodles and stirfry, yet if I'd sat them down with their own plates without eating myself they would have kicked up such a fuss and refused to eat it.

Hang on in there - hope you get a bit more sleep tonight.

Thanks, Hatty and JB and everyone else for your support and ideas. I really do appreciate them. I am going to try to be more relaxed about things, esp while he is ill (he has a barking cough which keeps him awake).

He really is surviving on nothing at the moment (won't take vitamin drops, won't take anything proffered on a spoon) so I think I'll try and get a docs appt as we're off to Preston on Sat to see DP's parents, they're pretty frail and elderly and I don't want T to give them anything.

I think I gave DP a scare this morning - I was crying as he was leaving because T was just throwing his cereal around and not having anything to eat and we'd just had hideous night and i said "I feel like walking out and not coming back" and he started getting worried that I would do that. I then got upset he thought I would really do it, I just feel like it and needed to say it. But probably not helpful to hear when you're walking out the door for 48 hours.

JB yes please to the rice pudding recipe. I have no issues with sugar, trust me I'd be delighted to get anything in him right now!

Oh, and to those with fussy eaters, do your DCs wake hungry in the night? I think this is my biggest source of anxiety - I think I could be more relaxed about it if T didn't, but after another refused meal I just think "oh shit, there goes another night with no sleep or caving in and giving him a bottle of milk".

My SIL swore by leaving a non spill cup of milk in her DD's cot overnight, but surely it would go off if left for up to 12 hours???

Just a quickie from me. The sing and sing dvd is (fingers crossed!) here. I have just ordered the second one for some variety!
I'm sorry that you're having such a tough time of it Spot. DD doesn't really eat much variety either and I also pour vitamins down her but, strange child that she is, she seems to view "medicine" as a treat!
Rubes hope DD was okay with jabs. DB hope your grandparents are doing okay. LT glad to hear you are taking it (comparatively!) easy. Hope everyone else is well - must plough on with work but will hopefully do a proper catch up sometime before the end of the thread.....

Spot, you can put the Abidec drops in milk! They taste foul (silly manufacturers) but it's only 0.6ml per day (one dose) and you can't taste it in milk, so do get some.

Don't despair. Just get anything into him you can and take the path of least resistance for now. FB me your address now and I will post the sheets tomorrow (am rather hectic today and DD2 won't let me put her down!) DD1 didn't wake hungry in the night tbh, not even at the peak of her hunger strike. Is he still on formula or is he on cow's milk? We were advised to keep DD on formula as it is more calorific and vitamintastic. If she had been waking in the night I think I would have given her whatever the dickens she would eat in any quantity in the evening, however outlandish, in the hope that it would see her through. Neither of you need an evening battle.

Yay, my link worked! Oh and Veggie yes I will be spending Christmas (or Christmas Day at least) in Derby - my little sister will be back from New Zealand with my new baby niece so I'm really looking forward to it already. Right, really going now. Must. Do. Some. Work!

Pudding recipe. All in 'old money' I'm afraid.

1.5oz pudding rice (short grain)
1.5oz sugar
1 pint full fat milk
Few drops of vanilla essence
Knob of butter
Sprinking of nutmeg (optional!)

Put in ovenproof dish, cook at gas mark 3 start checking for done-ness at 1hr 15ish minutes. The cooking time depends on how you like it. Personally I like it so the milk is still very milky and the rice is just cooked, like a broth! Cooking it for longer makes it go thicker and more like Ambrosia Creamed Rice.

Stir in some double cream and jam if you want to increase the calorie content/make it even more yummy.

spot I think when they're ill it is hard to judge if wakings are due to not eating or illness. Unless T's room is hot I wouldn't have thought milk would go off overnight. Have you had him weighed recently? He might just be very efficient at taking what he needs from what he is eating. Would a little supper, some cereal or a banana fill him up just before bed? Sorry I'm sure you've tried all that.

Evening All

Its so nice that some of our old faces are returning. Hello again to Pingu and Verso and Hatty! I am a little worried about Kiwi though. Are you lurking Kiwi? Are you doing OK?

JJ ? I saw your post about DD2?s large stomach circumference. My DD1?d 20 week scan revealed a 91st centile stomach and DD2?s was off the scale. I didn?t have GD or anything else. When they were born they were both big babies with big chubby tums (9lbs 4oz and 10lbs 2oz) but there was nothing wrong with them and they seem to be in proportion now. Try not to worry.

Spot ? I?m sorry that things continue to be hard. I have no advice to offer but I still wanted to acknowledge what you are going through. I bet your next DS is easy as pie. My (unscientific) theory is that those with easy DC1?s get more challenging DC2?s (this happened to me) and those with challenging DC1?s get a bit of a break with DC2 (this happened to several friends of mine). I reckon Mother Nature makes it all balance out in the end!

I was pondering what I do when stuck inside with the DCs. Its true they amuse each other a lot but I do lots of cooking with them. It doesn?t have to be sweet stuff. Often I make a huge bolognaise to freeze and as I chop the vegetables I ask the girls to do pointless-but-time-consuming jobs like put all the carrot slices in a bowl for me, or count out 50 pasta pieces. They think they have important jobs and get quite into it. I also find play-doh is a life saver. We have various play doh kits with different moulds and cutters and we have lots of fun making play-doh worlds. In the summer we draw chalk pictures on the patio paving stones but its a bit cold for that now. If I want DD2 to play independently I give her a job like emptying the tinned goods cupboard and she normally gets into some involved game of putting the tins to bed and singing to them which is always very funny to watch.

Its been interesting reading peoples? takes on Halloween. Those who don?t participate, is it for religious reasons or because of the commercial nature of the day? Because I used to live in America Halloween has always been a bit of an event for me. I quite like a cheering party at this gloomy time of year. On Sunday we are having 8 adults and 16 kids round . The kids are all going to dress up and I am cooking a Halloween tea (sandwiches shaped as spiders, sausages with faces wrapped in pastry to look like mummies, hummus with carrot dippers made to look like severed fingers, cupcakes with icing spider webs on them and strawberries dipped in white chocolate to look like ghosts). The dads are going to take the kids Trick-or Treating but only down our street and only knocking at the doors with pumpkins in the window (so that we know they are celebrating too). Last year we got loads of trick-or-treaters at our door and I have bought lots of Halloween Haribo to give them.

spot I don't think DS wakes hungry in the night if he doesn't eat. he doesn't get milk in the night and never seems particularly ravenous for his brekkie so I guess he's just not hungry! I'mhoping you have a much better night tonight.

avo my take on halloween is partly religious but in the main I just can't bear the commercialism of it all, it was never done when I was young

Evening ladies. I'm shattered today. DS2 slept through until 4.38 am (it always seems to be the same time to the exact minute most mornings) he went a bit mental kicking and screaming but not for milk and didn't want a cuddle so I just left him and eventually went back to sleep then he woke at 6.30 for a feed then back to sleep until 8 am when I had to wake him because I had to take DS1 to school. Why won't he do that on the weekend.

I ran into a friend on the school run and so popped over to her house. Of course because it was the school run I left home with no nappies (of course he did a big poo) and DS2 & I hadn't a had breakfast so DS2 ended up having honey puffs that my friend had rather than his porridge that was waiting at home for him. Then tonight I was trying to force him to eat his porridge pudding because I'm scared if he doesn't eat enough he will wake overnight. I found myself screaming at him that if he didn't eat a spoonful he would get no TV. He just looked at me baffled. Now Spot I know you said you did similar with MrT but poor DS1 had already eaten all his dinner! Spot I really don't know how you do without DP so much, DH is rarely away, and he's only been gone 24hrs & I'm already screeching at DS2 for being full after eating his meal! On top of that the poor little guy no nap today as DS1 has a half day at school and then violin lessons at 2.45 so no time to fit in a sleep.

Spot I used to leave a beaker of milk for DS1 to drink overnight. Unless its baking hot it won't go off. Also when his eating was at its worst I used to buy single cream and put loads of it in his milk, esp his bedtime and overnight milk, it helped him put on weight and stay asleep overnight. DS2 is really not very keen on milk and I would put it in his porridge but they don't really have fresh cream here.

Well I feel like a right shit, tok T to the docs today as he just wasn't himself and coughing loads and apparently he has bronchitis and has been given some steroid tablets (as he's asthmatic) and antibiotics (again ). No wonder he's not wanted to eat anything. The steroids seem very heavy duty though, I shouldn't have read the packet, the side effects look horrific! Has anyone used Dexamethasone on their DCs? He is currently crying in his sleep and shouting about monkeys.

Veg sounds like you've had a hard day too. Thanks for the milk tips. I don't really deserve too much sympathy for DP being away a lot as when he is here he can do breakfast and bathtime, which I know is a lot more than other people get. Plus at least there's no one to argue with in the middle of the night about what medicine to give him/whether to give milk etc etc...

Those are good playing tips, Avo, I shall try and remember them. And your party sounds fab . Any update on the house purchase?

Thanks for the recipe, Jolly, will def make when T's back on his game.

Top link , Pingu, thanks.

Lady will try the vits in milk (along with everything else I'm trying to hide in his milk at the moment!). He's on cows milk because I hadn't seen a need to keep him on formula but he had eaten a relatively balanced diet until recently. If his eating doesn't improve when he gets better I'll consider going back to formula. And thanks for the sheets, will FB you now.

Oh, wanted to say to the Cambridge peeps, I wouldn't really recommend the Varsity Hotel, v expensive for a room that looked like a Travel Inn and noisy because of the wooden floorboards. In fact there were quite a few problems and I've considered complaining but don't really have the time or energy.

I feel like I've really monopolised the thread recently with my self-pity and I do apologise. I can only thank you all so much for all the support I get here. I honestly don't know what I'd do without it.

I thought Halloween was originally a religious thing. Actually I've no idea, I heard something about all hallows een or eve or whatever. I don't know I just loved watching DS1 dress up like a bat and get free lollies.

Oh Spot didn't see that I'd cross posted with you with my ramblings about Halloween.

Hiya everyone, soz not to do a proper catch up but just remembered that I asked if anyone was about in London on Friday then forgot all about it. SL I am still thinking of going if you fancy meeting up.

spot sorry to hear T is poorly.

Effie only saw you for the first bit (have recorded the rest) but you looked v glam on the box.

Verso & Pingu hello!

Trick or treating - did it last year unplanned as next door neighbours dragged us out and I was pleasantly surprised. We are in a village though and it's mostly just the families with toddlers that take part. I don't know if I'd be that keen in a town. It was quite atmospheric with all the pumpkins. DS dressed up as a shark (like I said, it was unplanned) and his haul was one fun size Milky Way but you'd thought he'd won the lottery. He gripped it so hard there was nothing left of it by the time he got home. Very sweet. And yeah Veggie I think the origin is All Souls Day or something like that.

Was loads more I wanted to say but must get to bed before I turn into a pumpkin myself. Will try to catch up properly soon I promise...

spot are the steroids the small reddish ones, that you dissolve in water?? If so yes DS has had them (he was nearly hospitalised due to his wheezy chest). T may seem a little worse before he gets better but they are very effective. Also I used to dissolve ours in a tiny amount of water and mix it in his yoghurt. It was all he would eat, wouldn't take them as a liquid. The GP said it was ok to do it.

Poor man, you weren't to know. He'll be on the mend soon take it easy x

Hi everyone. Barely time to breathe this week. Having a lovely half term with a few solid tantrums in there.

Lovely to hear from verso, pingu & hatty.

Avo house the house stuff going?

Hows all the ill littlies? We all have horrid snotty colds.

Seriously brain dead can't for the life of me remember all I wanted to respond to. Will do it properly later from my laptop.

Oh yes Halloween we are big supporters of it here. We don't do trick or treating. Mainly as we are down a lane and never get any t&t. Although we did get it when we lived in town all teenagers so am amlittle anti that. But we go all out with pumpkins and decs for the family rm. Got quite used to it in the states si it has followed on.

Oh memory coming back.

Fussy eating both mine are now officially fussy eaters. They live on pasta. Have given up trying to force them to eat. Am trying the absoloutely no snacks to see if it makes them more inclined to eat so far it's not working. They must be hungry but are stubborn little sods. No idea where that comes from.

Right best get in the shower while the boys are being entertained by cbeebies god I hate chuggington.

DB how is your grandad?

Chaaaarrrrggington, chugger, chugger, chugger....sorry Jam :o

Spot I completely forgot I was going to comment on the steroids thing. DB is right you can dissolve them, I think they are designed to be dissolved. As far as side effects, those are more for long term use. Doctors are very good about steroids and don't just dole them out Willy nilly, if he prescribed them he needs them. I've known people who've had to have regular doses of steroids for asthma or excema and they are fine, in fact I think someone on here did. Some people don't like them because they suppress the immune response, but if I was struggling to breathe or the boys were Id have them in a heart beat. they will sort him out for this bout then boost his immunity afterwards.

Grandad is still much the same Jam. He has days where he is bad but then the next day seems to have picked up a bit. They are trying to sort out care for when he comes home, whichitself seems to be an uphill battle! When MIL was ill she had fantastic support in place, sadly its not the same at my Grandads hospital. I think my Nan has realised she isn't going to be able to look after him.

Right bestget off to work, have a shocking red wine headache. Over indulged watching The Apprentice - how shocking was that Melissa? And them 3 girls arguing in Soho over who gets what cut - I thought Nick was going to weep