September 2010 - we've met our little ones now!

[comixminx]

Or most of them at least - there are some late September ones still to come!

Congratulations AliKatt!

Arrgh, so many posts since I was last on. :) Our broadband is very temperamental and was completely caputt since Wednesday.

Congratulations AliKatt. Love the photos sassy and comix.

Watersprite, :( at the colic. Pooing is not one of Louis' problems. I hope the lactolose makes things better.

We had a visit from the health visitor yesterday. Louis is now 10lbs 40z! He's still a little jaundiced though so it's going to be out in the garden for him whenever he's not feeding for a few days...

To anyone worried about loosing posts, I always copy mine before I submit them, so if they get wiped I can just go back and paste the text.

Louis 5+2

Hiya ladies, knew it wouldn't be long before I needed some advice. I am bf harlyn who is 1 week old today. I had been giving him 30ml top up after every feed whilst waiting for my milk to come in but have since weaned him off that.
Concern number 1: Like others have mentioned, he is having problems latching on as he won't open his mouth wide enough and on the rare occasion he does, after a few sucks he looks luke he choking and spit half the nipple out resulting in a shallow latch. So my nipples are slightly sensitive to say the least.
Concern number 2: He seems to sleep a lot. He's happy and content but often sleeps for 3/4 hours at a time during the day and around 6 hours through the night. I'm worried that he's not getting enough feeds! I assumed on demand feeding would be every couple of hours but he only seems to be getting in 5/6 feeds within 24 hours! Surely this can't be right????? Should I start waking him for more regular feeds?
Concern number 3: attempted to express a feed last night whilst he was sleeping as was worried about milk production with all his napping and the result really upset me. I produced about a thimble full from both breast after 15 mins of pumping!! This has made me think that Harlyn maybe isn't getting enough milk from me when he feeds (which is normally for at least 40 minutes a time).
Any advice on the above would be greatly appreciated. Think I may give the me a call too as don't want him to lose weight.

JodeyLea - has your comunity MW visited yet? They normally come out to see you the day after you are home from hospital? If weight gain/loss is an issue, she would/should have said something when she weighed him? My twins have also been v sleepy and the MW advised me to feed every 3 hours for the first few days - ie, wake them up for a feed, then when she came back afew days later and checked weight gain was all going ok, she said approx every 4 hours was fine. That's what we are still sticking with although I am going to start stretching them a bit longer overnight next week if they'll let me! (they'll be 4 weeks old on Monday)

About the expressing - I've heard that some women can BF just fine but get little milk out when they express - don't know why ths happens. Some women also find that looking at a pic of their baby helps to get the milk flowing better for pumping too.

jodey it is very early to expect to be able to pump alot of milk. Your supply is just starting to establish itself, pumping will be much easier in a few weeks time.

Trust your baby, he is taking what he needs and sleeping well - make the most of catching up on sleep it could all change next week and he may well start feeding every couple of hours or cluster feeding then you'll be wishing for those long stretches back!

Try not to worry, generally babies are very good at taking what they need, be that milk, sleep, cuddles etc, try to let him lead you and relax, nothing stays the same for long at this stage, even though at times it can feel like forever when you're in it.

jodey

Also regarding latch, you are only a week in, he is learning how to feed too, you need to be determined and keep taking him off until he latches comfortably for you, this can take time, try to stay calm even if he starts to get frustrated, he will get the hang of it. If you have access to BF councellor where you are take it, it can really help. Also because your milk is just getting going it can be very fast coming out of your boob this can make the baby try and gulp really quickly to cope with the speed of the milk which can result in him coming off the boob or being sick/windy because he is ending up swallowing lots of air at the same time.
I had this problem with my DD and BF councellor advised feeding lying down as this slows the flow and using hot/cold flannel on the boob before feeding.
Once your milk has settled this won't be a problem any more, but it can take 6-8 weeks for this to happen, don't give up, it's so worth it!!

jodey, I asked about this on a different thread a couple of weeks ago because one of the visiting midwives said I should express to build up my supply and I had very similar questions to you.

• what you can express and what your baby can get out are different - your baby is much more efficient than the pump, apparently, so don't feel like your baby is getting as little as you can see with the pumping!
• I expressed as much as I could over a couple of days and that really helped to up my supply (I managed 5 times for a couple of days, and 4 times a day for a bit thereafter). I can now see my breasts are fuller, I get more out when I express, I can see milk in the corner of DD's mouth as she feeds.
• they reckon that 6 feeds in 24 hours is what you should be aiming for; not sure if this is a minimum, probably so?
• re your latch - go to see as many bf counsellors as you can manage until it's fixed! I've seen loads and it's now going v well, but only this week really.

Aphra 5 + 2

jodey, can I also add that my midwife pointed out to me that what goes in has to come out, so as long as Harlyn is producing about 6-12 wet nappies per day then he's probably getting enough milk.

Now it's my turn to ask for advice. I'm going to start expressing. I'd like DP to be able to give Louis a bottle to give me the odd break, and maybe to top him up in the evening when he's very hungry and my supply is a bit low. Should I express in the morning after he's fed, and then in the evening to boost my supply? What do other people do?

Louis 5+2

JodeyLea I would say if your baby is sleeping he is not hungry, hungry babies cry. My midwife recommended waking Luke if he didn't feed for more than 6 hours but otherwise he was fine. As others have said if you are getting wet nappies and he is content after his feed all is good. Persist with making sure he has a good latch, if your breasts are very full and hard it can be difficult to latch them so you can hand express a bit first to help soften them a bit. I could not express with ds1 and was pretty depressed as I was going back to work when he was 6 months old. I tried again when he was 10 weeks and got 6oz in 10mins. Babies are much better at getting milk than a pump so don't worry on that front. Babies should be weighed in the first week to determine weight loss so I'm surprised your midwife hasn't done that yet and would definitely contact them.

Mapletrees as I said couldn't express until 10 weeks but when I could my most effient was about 1 1/2hr after feed as he fed every 3 hours so was about half way between feeds, then when there was enough for a feed I'd express while he was having the bottle I expressed.

I'm really tired tonight, the first week back at work has gone well but it's taken it's toll!! Luke has chosen tonight to start his constant crying early :(

Hi all
Congrats to those that have had babies since I last posted.
Im finding the juggle all a bit wearing at the moment. Phoebe feeds a bit in the evenings so getting supper ready and the boys off to bed is proving a feat. Also I am having a trying time at night. She wakes for a feed anywhere between 1 and 3. This feed is usually ok and doesnt take too long 1/2 hour in total. But then she wakes again anywhere 3 and 5 and we will be up for two hours! Between feeding changing, feeding again and settling it takes 2 hours. I started formula at this time two nights ago. She is doing both breast 20-25 mins, then taking 3oz. The funny thing is once she is settled she sleeps soundly but wakes two hours later!! Im wrecked and its wreaking havoc on the morning as she feeds very closely together all morning so its nearly 12 noon before we are ready for the world. (luckily Dh is home 3 mornings a week and the boys are in playschool the other two)
Im dreading the growth spurt. I dont have the energy to keep all of this up but dont want to give up bfing as it is actually going quite well this time for a change. She is a far more civilised feeder than the boys were!

Thanku ladies! U have put my mind at ease. My midwife has been out to me twice and when he was weighed he had lost weight but was within his 10%. he gets weighed again on Wednesday so fingers crossed all will be ok.
We are having a very unsettled evening with him tonight for the first time. He seems to have tummy pain and is really grizzly. I've been winding him for an hour. Feel so sorry for him I could cry. He had a good old cluster feed this afternoon and I'm thinking that maybe he has become very windy due to his inconsistent latch. Fingers crossed he will settle soon. Right, off to relieve hubby of back rubbing duty x

Hi

What a change from the last thread, still sleepless nights for different reasons.

Congratulations to all who´ve had there little ones since I last posted.

Maia is also struggling a bit with settling during the day, but she´s an angel at night so Im not going to temp fate by grumbling.

She has lots of pimples (like a heat rash round her face/neck), the nurse recommended a massage oil that is suppposed to sooth irrated skin, I went off to the shop to buy it expecting it to be quite expensive but was at the 40? price tag for 200ml. It better bloody work now.

DP has taken DS off to his parents for the weekend and my mum is staying her so its just the girls today and tomorrow. Im enjoying the time to focus on Maia. I thought that I would spend less time focused on DS but have realised that I spend a lot less time focused on Maia. Im a sling person so shes most of the day strapped to me (thank god for pilates ), but I dont take her out and "play" like I remember with DS.

5 wk +8

Hi Patito, DD has also got some spots a bit like you describe. I'd looked them up on MN and decided they were just milk spots and nothing needed to be done about them. For other skin issues I've been putting on a bit of breastmilk, or olive oil if it's just a bit of dry skin. What have others been doing?

5 + 3

Morning....just. I've had an horrendous 32 hours and it's not over yet. My boobs are absolutely killing me. Don't know what it is cos the way i breast feed isn't different and Jacobs boob is hurting also and he never hurts. The nipples are killing me but i also have stabbing pains in the boob itself. Looked up breast pain on the internet and can only find 2 different reasons (other than not latching on) and that is mastitis and oral thrush. It sounds like oral thrush more than mastitis but even then i haven't got all the symptoms, and also if one of the babies has it why is it in both breasts when i don't change them over. I've ended up putting Kamillsom (sp) on and it has helped the nipples a bit but they are still very painful. Any ideas anyone? I tried an ice cube the other night and it hurt twice as much!!!!

comix Isobel has had terrible skin from day 1. She has had milk spots but also a different type. They look like bites when they 1st come (yellow in the middle and red around) the mw told me their name but i forget. I've not done anything- just left them and they are starting to clear up now.

8w +2

sassy Can I strongly urge you to see someone if your boobs are still hurting? If it is thrush it needs treating, and if it's mastitis and you don't sort it out quickly, it can lead to worse things. And if it's something else entirely then still best to know. (I don't want to scare you but I had a friend who had mastitis and left it for a while and ended up with an abscess, not good.)

comix Louis has been getting lots of little spots too. I was told it was just his skin getting used to all the chemicals etc it's now being exposed to and nothing to worry about. We just wash him with plain water, each one doesn't tend to last long. And we also use olive oil for his dry skin.

cinnamon, I tried expressing mid-way between feeds like you suggested. I got 5oz, is this about right? His dad gave him half in a bottle to see if he would take it, and he wolfed it down as if he'd been having bottles all along, so no worries on that front :) Then I let him finish feeding from me as I had a sudden, irrational fear that he'd like the bottle so much, that's all he'd want from now on. DP's just having to accept he's living with a nutter :o

Not a nutter at all mapletrees!! 5oz sounds pretty good to me!

I had thrush with ds1 sassy34264 and it caused a lot of pain in my nipples only, I also needed two different treatments as the first didn't work and the difference when it had gone was amazing. With mastitis the pain is more in the breast tissue rather than the nipple itself. It could just be that you are a bit run down and thrush has grown on both nipples (milk is a good source for anything to grow and in a warm place) not that it has spread from one to the other. If you are using breast pads change them regularly. As it's sunday give nhs direct a call they may recommend you see someone today. Try and leave your bra off to let the air get to them and if it is mastitis the best thing is a heat pad where the pain is before you feed and change the baby's feeding position to help clear it then a cold flannel after feeding to soothe the heat and pain.

Luke didn't scream all evening yesterday but was asleep, this meant he didn't do his usual cluster feeding and so was up twice instead of once in the night, not sure which I prefer!

Comix Oliver has the spots too! I'm not doing anything. I asked the HV & she just said "its not meningitis!" Well, I knew that! Honestly, she's useless, thats just a small example of the many "useful" comments she's made!

Is anyone else ff? Am I the only one?

5+5

Yes, I'm not doing anything much about the spots either, just interested if anyone else was. I suspect that patito's expensive lotion was an unnecessary recommendation on the part of the nurse.

I feel like I'm being a bit "me too" but during today I've also started feeling a hard, tender bit in my left breast, which is very engorged with milk - so like sassy I am having breast trouble, though unlike her I think it's more likely to be mastitis than thrush. Am sitting here expressing like mad to try to empty my breast totally! (As per NHS Direct advice.) If it's still tender tomorrow I'll definitely see someone about it. Gah, if it's not one thing it's another!

Once I got antibiotics comixminx I felt better so quickly, so do get it checked out! Use the rugby hold when feeding your little one, it's supposed to help clear any blockage.

I think chelle1986 is ff bananastew, not sure about anyone else. It's quite nice for me to have other bfing mums as in rl I'm the only one and feel very left out and a bit of a spectacle at times :(

NHS Direct on breastfeeding says there's two kinds of mastitis and the non-infectious kind is treated by emptying your breast thoroughly (expressing, checking your latch, etc) - though it can turn into the infectious sort so to be careful. I've now got my breast properly empty and it feels so much better! Suspect it was more of an early-warning sign than proper mastitis, fingers crossed anyway, but i'll definitely be keeping a close eye on it. I pumped for ages and got a moderate amount out, but it was still tender and a bit swollen; but when DD decided that yes, she did want some more, she made so much more of a difference! Hooray for baby efficiency and a better latch than she was showing earlier today (lazy me for not correcting her sooner).

I'm no better. Cn't even have them lying on my chest because it hurts my nipples too much. They are a very sore looking pink colour. I'm still thinking it might be latching on problems rather than anything more serious. Been thinking that my boobs are really massive at the moment (they look like fake looking football boobs)and that may be the reason that Jacob is hurting me -because it's too big to latch on good. But on the other hand i keep checking them and his bottom lip is usually turned back and it looks good. I'm dreading every feed and having to pull them off before i'm sure they've finished and stick a dummy in. Know this is bad. Think i will phone doctor tommorrow for an appointment before my determination to breast feed them for 6 months falters any more.

Oh dear sassy! how horrible for you. Good luck with the docs - hope you get the right help very quickly.

Hi Everyone, it is so good to catch up on everyones news. On reading through all the OP it seems as if lots of us have niggly/colicky babies in the early evening/late night. Jessica is a bit funny after her 9pm feed and takes a while to settle (normally about 11.30pm) but she is a star (at the moment) at settling after feeds in the night. She is an incredibly sleepy baby which is great in some ways but frustrating in others. Feeding her during the day takes forever as she falls asleep after about 10 mins. At night i feed her about midnight and 3am and she takes about 5 or 10 mins and then settles straight back to sleep until between 6am and 7am. Pretty good going for a 10 day old - however it could all change i know! I wasn't sure if it was something i was eating or drinking that was making her fractious after her 9pm feed, but think it may just be me worrying too much. She doesn't scream, and certainly has no problem getting the wind out of her bum! I have given her a dummy to soothe her and this seems to help, but i won't let her have it in her cot.

All in all everything is pretty great - just dreading being at home next week for 2 weeks of half term with the 2 DS's!!
Sorry for long rambling post! x

Sorry sassy just read your post properly - poor you! Hope your nipples feel better soon. My DH bought me a fab cream from Boots that has really helped my nipples. Can't remember the name, so will post it later.

Is there a breast feeding counselor or workshop near you? IF so, try and phone them and get some advice.
Good luck x

Sassy (an anyone else whose nipples are suffering!), I really recommend this lansinoh stuff - it's really soothing. My nipples have been getting a bit sore from expressing and this has helped a lot.