This post nails it about left wing voters on Mumsnet over the last two days

[ProudAmberTurtle]

It's by an ex-academic on X, about posts on Reddit over the last 48 hours but is equally applicable to Mumsnet, where I can seeing posts stating things like:

"How stupid are Reform voters? Don't they realise they'll get fewer benefits?!"

The irony is of course that it's those posters who need to be educated, not the working class voters they mock because they think they're thick.

Here you go:

Reading through Reddit threads in which leftists/progressives express their bewilderment/confusion/fury at working class English voters for casting their lot in with Reform, one of the things I'm starting to understand is this:

They simply do not understand how a government could help working-class people in any other way besides giving them benefits, handouts, and other free things.

Their entire mental architecture is premised upon the premises that

1. Working class people are poor
2. The only way for them to not be poor is for the state to give them free stuff
3. So left-wing parties need to promise them lots of free stuff

Then, when these working-class voters instead vote for right-of-centre parties who instead promise an economy in which they can build a career, start their own business, make a financial success of themselves and start a family, they're confused.

Because, again, in their mental architecture, what the working class are supposed to want is free benefits from the state.

But what they actually want is a fair shake at making their own way in the world, making money, getting on in life.

And the left simply doesn't understand that what these voters want from the state is an economy in which they can actually do this.

x.com/i/status/2053073719086469193

Most people emigrating are foreign nationals - including students.
246,000 British nationals emigrated.
British emigrants include a significant no of naturalised dual nationals, from Poland, Romania and Bangladesh + a smaller number of those born in UK going to eg UAE/Dubai

ONS

Can you show the evidence of the fact it’s rich and talented leaving?

That is odd isn't it ? I post on a long running "serial" thread, and that is the only place I think I have posted bingo cards. I have not seen that poster post anything there.

There was thing where I was suspended. In error according to MN, but there was an awful lot of my posts reported. "Disclaimergate" we call it. By we I mean all the people who were reported.

But yes. Reform threads. " The left don't engage, they shut down the debate, and they call us names"

As you have said yourself Alan, MN is an open forum where people can decide to read any thread at any point so yes I have seen your bingo cards before.

Hmm at this. I don’t think it’ll wash.

It's also worth noting that the ONS changed how they collect data tail end of last year. This especially impacted the emigration numbers from the UK. This was reported at the time.

Improving long-term international migration statistics, updating our methods and estimates - Office for National Statistics

They used to get data on people leaving the UK by having people in airport departure lounges with a clipboard. And they changed to checking tax and NI records. So there was a big jump of course. Because they went from very rough estimation to a more refined method.

This was reported in the press at the time. But not all the press it seems.

Its also a forum where people, when asked questions try and deflect - which you do a lot

There aren't any cultural things can brits can not do anymore

I would say there are more cultural things people can do these days.

Anything from thatching, dry stone walling, and yes, even Morris dancing.

English Folk Dance and Song Society - Morris Dancing (efdss.org)

10 quid a lesson.

There are some things that have been limited by law. Elver collection and eel fishing for example. But that is because the eel is now an endangered species. So it has nothing to do with any sort of suppression.

No she doesn’t. Having read a few threads on the board mentioned below I’m amazed at the calm responses given the attacks.

"How stupid are Reform voters? Don't they realise they'll get fewer benefits?!"

The irony is of course that it's those posters who need to be educated, not the working class voters they mock because they think they're thick

Whilst Reform voters aren't thick, they are, as Sir John Curtice says "less likely to have higher education qualifications, less likely to have A levels"

Those on the right were rioting yesterday in Southhampton, now some might not like labelling such people as thick but they certainly aren't educated to a high standard or they wouldn't be so easily led.

On "Benefits" that includes things like Maternity rights, health services & yes tax credits and a welfare safety net.... all things Reform want gone/changed or cut.

Plus they wish to deport people here legally, those working in adult care services, factories, agri and food production.... and anyone with a so called ADHD diagnosis and had better get ready to do these jobs and if they think adults with ADHD don't deserve help, then you get your last euro, they will remove them from your SENDs children too.

If anything cultural was going to be stopped - surely it would be morris dancing, the face painting "would cause offence" would be used

Maybe Highland dancing, given the swords.

I do remember years ago when I used to wear a kilt, I had a couple of real Sgian Dubhs. The knife that goes in the sock. Even then I remember a few times deciding not to wear the Sgian Dubh, depending on where I was going. But there are non bladed dress one available. Has been for a long time.

But I would not rate that as destruction of culture.

red tag

I would recommend you listen to some of Ayaan Hirsi's talks on Islam on YouTube.

Why ?

Can't you just post here what she says ?

"The “only credible answer, I believe, lies in our desire to uphold the legacy of the Judeo-Christian tradition,” she said; that legacy includes an “elaborate set of ideas and institutions designed to safeguard human life, freedom, and dignity.”

Ayaan Hirsi wrote that in an essay in 2023, on her conversion to Christianity. After 2 decades as an atheist. So she went to the US, worked for a right wing thinktank, and converted to Christianity.

I am an atheist myself. Ex evangelical in fact.

1 Tim 2:12 comes to mind.

So I think I can give it her youtube a miss. There is no shortage of right wing folk saying that the " Judeo-Christian tradition" is the only way.

Source for the quote I posted :

Outspoken atheist Ayaan Hirsi Ali says she is now a Christian – EWTN Great Britain

I don’t deflect any more than others do on here in debates.

I used to try to keep on point with my own threads but got told I was “policing the thread” so now I accept people talk about what they want to 🤷🏼‍♀️

Most of the foreign nationals who are leaving are well qualified. Most the ones coming in are not.

Any evidence of that?

Can you define what you mean by "most" ?

I think the term "well qualified" can be subjective. Because many classes of UK visa are done on income rather than qualifications. And likewise, the same often applies to UK nationals leaving the UK, because many other countries have similar rules.

That's not me moving the goalposts from your statement. I am saying the goalposts really should be set up at the start of the discussion.

Agree that a lot of supposed leftists are brimming with contempt for working-class people

disagree that any right-wing party in this country has presented any feasible economic plans (no, I don't think the left-wing ones have either)

Answering a question isn’t policing a thread 😂

I didn't say it would be, I said I don't deflect more than others and that when I used to try to keep people on point with my own threads, I got told I was “policing the thread.”

You still haven’t answered the question 🤣

Who says I have to?

What’s with the badgering plus emojis.