Why would mumsnet leftists vote Green over reform?

[Wizeman]

Now I have your attention

What are the substantive political reasons for voting for the Green Party over Reform UK?

Please avoid responses based on personality or tone (e.g., claims that one leader is “nicer” than the other). Instead, I am interested in clear policy-based arguments and ideological reasoning.
Reform UK is led by Nigel Farage, a businessman with a long-standing role in national politics. The Green Party is currently led by Zak Polanski, whose professional background includes work in theatre and as a hypnotist.

With that in mind, I would welcome serious explanations focused on policy positions, governance approach, economic strategy, and long-term outcomes, rather than personal character assessments.

Well we don’t welcome dependents now though do we.
Carer visa stopped dependents a while back - in fact all worker visas to level 6 can’t have dependents.
Students pretty much the same unless gov’t sponsored or phd
Family reunion stopped.
Other routes with dependents are stringent on requirements and getting more so.
There is a general no recourse to public funds on nearly all visas as well.
So I’m not really sure what else you want?

Net migration has fallen.

A millionaire who earns 200k per year loses 70k to income tax.

70k x 10000 = 700 million

So the government would lose atleast 700 million per year.

That's 700 million they would pay for the rest of there life. That 700 million adds up every year. From 2024 700mil per year atleast is lost 2025 thats 700million x 2 plus the 700million from the millionairs who leave in 2025

2026 the millionaires from 2024 700million x 3 = 2.1 billion

2025 millionaires its 700 million x 2 = 1.4 billion

2026 700million

Add it up and the total loss for 2026 is 4.2 billion. And thats only taking into account the numbers that have left from 2024.

How worrying, I hope you understand the maths

It needs to fall ro a rate where the infrastructure being build is more than what is needed for who is coming in because there is a backlog of infrastructure that needs to be built.

At least you’ve exposed your true intentions.

Imigration down to net 10k. Would fix everything.

And what about the fact that we have an aging population and a falling birth rate?

Who pays for and cares for the elderly if we stop migration?

There is an argument to stop it until we sort growth out, but overall, we need migrants to come here and pay tax.

None of Reform's plans would boost economic growth or create jobs; if anything, they would do the opposite. Taking money from the most vulnerable means they'll cost the NHS more and have less to spend on goods and services.

I don’t vote for Labour or the Conservatives.
Im a Lib Dem supporter. As a Centrist, theirs are the values that most closely align with my own, not particularly when it comes to education, which, as a teacher, is one of the most important considerations for me.

? I think ive explained pretty logically why its my opinion though.

Alongside less than voluntary euthanasia, collapse of NHS and social care- then yeah sure!
I’m not sure why you brought the Green Party into the OP? Were you even interested in what some people like about them?
I’m not even sure why you asked about Reform policy in general either? You are only ‘discussing’ one potential policy they have, and I’m not sure ‘discussing’ is the right word anyway.
If you want to discuss what you see as a good aim for net migration then you should start a thread on that topic.

British people will pay and care for the elderly. Money saved over 5 to 10 years from net 10k imigration would allow tax cuts for people who have children. I dont believe in getting benefits for have children i believe you should work and get large tax cuts. This would prevent people taking advantage of benefits.

We dont need migrants to pay tax, we need rich people stay and pay existing tax.

Gosh that's so naive
You really need to do wider, neutral reading on aging populations, different industry sectors, climate change, economic policy etc. Scary that you have no concept of this

Again no concept of the actual reality of statistics behind these claims. Ridiculous

All ive heard from green people in here is they like the idea of legalising drugs and saving the planet, thats fair enough I get it. Other than that ive not heard how the greens would fix the country.

How is it ridiculous? Net 10k imigration would allow infrastructure to be built, once we have enough, funding can go elsewhere and im talking hundreds of billions.

I do have a concept of this and the only way to free up the funding to enable these policies is for imigration to decline. This would allow us to build the infrastructure we need over 5-10 years, the the money freed up from this could be used to fund things like net 0. What's the point in building hospitals when you have enough. The problem we have now is we cant build enough quick enough unless the population stops growing e.g cutting imigration.

OP have you seen Reform’s handling of the local councils they already influence?

Missed meetings, internal rows, resignations, confusion over basic governance and a lot of noise with very little delivery. It’s been shambolic.

Local councils are where politics and ideologies meet reality. They deal with bin collections, housing, social care, planning, budgets… It requires competence, teamwork and attention to detail.

So far, Reform have shown none of that in practice.
If a party can’t organise itself, work constructively with others, or manage relatively small budgets and responsibilities at a local level, how on earth can we trust them with the NHS, the economy, national security or international diplomacy?

Running a country isn’t about being loud, angry or anti-establishment. It’s about doing the hard, boring work well. Based on what we’ve seen in local government so far, Reform haven’t demonstrated they’re capable of that.

Really - that is what you heard?
Saving the planet is quite a big issue - not if you’re a climate change denier of course?
I never saw the legalise drugs one on this thread but maybe I missed it.
If you missed my reasons I said I liked their 2024 manifesto - I had thought you knew some of it - but to expand then I liked investment in the NHS, free care, rent control, nationalisation of public services, not least climate policies - fyi personally not wanting the assisted dying bill - I just said I wasn’t sure on the figures.
I am sure suddenly ensuring net migration is knocked to 10k will not help the economy or lives of anyone in the U.K., and it wouldn’t necessarily bring back all these multi millionaires you say have scarpered with cash.
They probably didn’t really need to - as a fan of Reform you must be aware that Farage speaks at events for such as these rich people to advise how to not pay tax via getting different passports - he advises specifically on how to obtain these passports.

Out of the 2 I would choose Green as their policies broadly fit with mine.
Also Green Party members have a say in what new policies can be put forwards, or any amendments.

Farage’s Reform is a Limited company with him as a majority shareholder. Members have no power.
I don’t agree with moving to an insurance based healthcare system and massive one - I do not agree with bringing back fox hunting.

Whereas Zack Polanski has already served his time in local government in the London Assembly, isn't that so?

Neither party are financially or economically credible.

Reform are promising significant tax cuts funded by unrealistic and unworkable spending cuts.

Greens are promising significant spending increases funded by unrealistic and unworkable tax increases.

Because I agree with almost all of Green’s policies and none of Reform’s. It’s as simple as that.

I don’t vote for racist wankers and that is exactly what Farrage is. Simple.

A back of the fag packet calculation based on unsubstantiated assumptions - that the millionaires who left are earning £200k, that they are paying £70k in income tax and working until they die is not evidence. You need to be a bit more rigorous than that.

Do you ever listen to More or Less on Radio 4? You might find it helpful for understanding statistics and how to properly think critically about politicians claims.

😂😂😂😂