Reform plans to scrap indefinite leave to remain for migrants

[Twiglets1]

BBC report following Farage's press conference this afternoon:

Reform UK has announced it would abolish the right of migrants to qualify for permanent settlement in the UK after five years, if the party wins the next election.

Under the plans, Reform would abolish the right of migrants to apply for Indefinite Leave to Remain (ILR) - which gives migrants rights and access to benefits - and reapply for new visas with tougher rules.

Reform will also unveil plans to bar anyone other than British citizens from accessing welfare. The party claims their plans would save £234bn over several decades.

Reform said it would replace ILR with visas that force migrants to reapply every five years. That includes hundreds of thousands of migrants currently in the UK.
Applicants would also have to meet certain criteria, including a higher salary threshold and standard of English.

The announcement launches Reform's fresh assault on what they brand the "Boriswave" - 3.8 million people who entered the UK after Brexit under looser rules brought in by Boris Johnson's administration.

Speaking at a press conference, Reform UK leader Nigel Farage said the "main reason" for the policy was to "wake everybody up to the Boris wave".

Hundreds of thousands of these migrants, who have come to the UK since 2021, will soon qualify for permanent residence under the ILR scheme.

Reform said the changes would not apply to EU nationals whose settled status is protected under the European Union Withdrawal Agreement, who make up the majority of benefit claimants by people with ILR.

But EU nationals not benefiting from the provisions of the Withdrawal Agreement will be subject to the new system.

Reform will also introduce a new scheme called Acute Skills Shortage Visas (ASSV) for jobs in crisis. Under the scheme, firms can hire one worker from abroad only if they train one at home.

Reform will also raise the average wait for UK citizenship from six years to seven.

Reform say their policy is designed to bring Britain into line with other countries such as the US and United Arab Emirates (UAE) and save the UK more than £234bn over what it calls the "lifetime of the average migrant".

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c930xypxpqpo

Again. The snobbery. You say "These Farage champions" and then you very decisively list some negative views that you assume everyone else thinks. In one big homogeneous group. For some reason. And without justification. Or presumably any knowledge at all.

I think this sums up the problem with politics these days.

Dh is an immigrant Doctor in the NHS, been here 30 years now. All this anti immigrant rhetoric has been upsetting him and making him feel unwelcome, I've posted that on other threads. Even though he has British citizenship this latest shit stirring from Farage will make him even more upset and angry. Most of the nurses in his department are Filipino or Indian, they are fantastic, and he's very proud of how well the department runs, he worries about them in the current climate. He's bought himself a T shirt with big writing that says "I am an immigrant" and wears it when he's out walking the dog or shopping! To be fair he's only had good feedback about it so far. Can't somebody gag Farage, the media need to stop giving him such a loud voice.

I didn’t say anything about “what everyone else thinks”. Why are you making things up?

I was very clear about the illogical and self-contradictory views that I was criticising, the holders of which Farage’s latest proclamations are clearly directed towards because anybody with a vague understanding of immigration law or economics can clearly see that his latest ridiculous proposals are unworkable, unimplementable, would be economically catastrophic and don’t address the problems with our immigration system that need to be changed to improve the situation.

I certainly was not attributing to “everyone” the ridiculous views of the xenophobes to which he is pandering with these nonsense “policies”. That would be a very sad state of affairs indeed.

It's not personal although your DH clearly feels it is. The vast benefits burden affects us all. Its not about individuals. If he's a UK national then he too should be supporting any efforts to stop the bankruptcy of this country.

I don't know if Reform have the answer.

Oh dear. First you try to accuse other posters of things they haven’t said, and then taking personal offence at the things you’ve invented that nobody has said, and now you’re resorting to personal attacks on other posters and calling people names.

Twisty turny Claaaw. We can all read your posts.

Clearly not, in your case.

Well it's good you are backtracking now. I assumed you were writing for the Guardian with the tilting at windmills you were doing. Making up views you think other people hold in order to stridently argue against yourself. For some reason.

Of course it's bloody personal. It's about people! Deporting people en masse means deporting individuals. Most of whom are net contributors. You can't deport the shop keepers without deporting the doctors, or the stay at home mums without deporting the carer that works with your granny in the nursing home. You can't have no immigrants and have a functional society. You can't even have the level of immigration we had in the 60s and have a functional society.

I haven’t backtracked on anything.

I’ve been very clear in my earlier posts - if you’d read them - about changes to immigration and benefit conditions and the links between them and about how they could be reformed to be more workable.

Which part do you believe I have “backtracked” on?

I don’t read the Guardian. How tiresome and unoriginal. And now you’re trying to accuse me of making things up? You’re the one who has made straw man arguments and engaged in ad hominem insults.

That makes some sense!
Imagine if he ever wanted to retire to France or Germany after being the PM....
It could be interesting to see how he could justify it!
"Oh well... I can go over there. Just.. you... cannot be here."

Why would disagreeing with Reform voters make someone a snob? Are you saying that Reform voters are inferior or lower class?

Are you saying that immigrants are bamkrupting the UK?

Look up the definition of snob. It's not just class related. Although the Left left the working class behind a long time ago.

That's not what Farage said this afternoon. The immigrants that come and never work and claim benefits are the ones that he reasonably wants to prevent more of. Sounds fair. Fair to British taxpayers.

I wouldn't be able to live in another country and not support myself or pay in to the system.. Neither would you. He's just trying to make us a normal country like most others.

Your disdain for people with opposing views oozes from your posts. You clearly feel yourself superior to Reform voters. The definition of a snob.

The irony of this post appears to be lost on you: your “disdain for people with opposing views” apparently extends to you repeatedly writing personal insults to other posters, which nobody on this thread has done except for you.

Immigrants can only start claiming benefits once they have IRL, at least 5 years from arrival

Farage lied but you seem to believe him and agree with him

I don’t like this policy but to say it couldn’t be done legally is wrong. It could. ILR is something you can change, and people should really apply for citizenship. I thought they let the cat out of the bag on the retrospective element.

It can be done but will be at huge costs.

That's the whole point of extending the time period for ILR from 5 years as that period is coming to an end shortly.

Oh, awesome. They can't even deal with one-off applications in a timely manner, let's just increase the workload for the departments exponentially. But then it would be necessary to contract it out to somebody else with a fantastic, bespoke, not at all cobbled together from an existing product software system and send millions to at least one overseas company that absolutely won't be funded by a foreign government or oligarchs/venture capitalists paying significant sums to shareholders in absolutely blind trusts for plausible deniability.

What could go wrong?

Again, I didn’t say it was “just class related”. Why do you keep fabricating things?

I asked why you said people disagreeing with Reform voters makes them a snob; do you think Reform posters are inferior or lower class?

The definition states: “a person with an exaggerated respect for high social position or wealth who seeks to associate with social superiors and looks down on those regarded as socially inferior”.

So by stating that you think that those who disagree with Reform voters are “snobs” you are implicitly stating that Reform voters are socially or otherwise inferior.

And that will reduce the wellfare bill by how much?