Labour Supporters - Do you think it would help if KS was replaced?

[Mrsmunchofmunchington]

I am a life long labour voter. Like many I am incredibly disappointed, in fact I’m devastated by the direction of the current government.

Something needs to change in a pretty radical way or we are opening the door to Deform.

I’m torn between thinking the last thing we need is another revolving door at no 10 but I have lost any confidence that KS is able to lead us out of the mess the tories left us in.

Would it be a good thing to change leaders if this was possible and if so who should it be?

We all cope as best we can.

You're using ableist language to describe people you don't like.

Why do supporters of parties adopt this ‘see no evil’ approach? It’s true of Tories, SNP voters, LibDems, Greens etc. But it’s always been strongest among Labour supporters.

Starmer is plainly not a good leader. He’s a weak man and an incompetent. Look at his attempts to do something, however trivial, about out of control welfare costs. A sign of trouble from his backbenchers and he shat himself and ran away. Look at his judgement on Haigh, Siddiq, Rayner and Mandelson. Look at his decisions about Chagos. Look at his freebie grabbing. And on and on.

But most of all look at the economy. We’re in real trouble now. We all know why the budget’s been delayed as much as possible. The pitch rolling will start soon enough. Except now the bogus measures floated will have to be especially unlikely because the real ones will be so bad.

Nothing will help them now .
Reform will get in next election and God knows what will happen then .

Ha! Abelist language my arse.
And fyi I am disabled.

I'm not sure that is fair to say it is strongest amongst Labour supporters. Many tory voters supported Boris regardless of the shit he did. Maybe less so with the Libdems and Greens but their MPs rarely have to do anything that would attract complaint.

Yet you don't see how calling people deformed is ableist?

Why use it?

It is strong within the supporters of this version of Labour.

It certainly is ableist to use the word Deform like that. Being disabled doesn't excuse you.

I agree but Boris could have killed puppies live on air and his supporters would have still loved him.

I am calling the party Deform.
Not an individual.
Christ on a bike.
Also quite hilarious that you try this enormous stretch in light of Deform’s attitude to disabled people and disability benefits.

Lol probably. It runs on both sides I'm sure

I think we can conclude that since you find this hilarious and consider "Deform" dark humour. We have very different senses of humour.

It’s not necessary or funny to keep using it.

Personally I think the biggest mistakes they have made are:

1. tying their own hands with the manifesto promise of not raising VAT, income tax or NI. Left them with very little room for manoeuvre except increasing employers' NI which is absolutely not helpful for a government that's supposed to be focused on growth. People say they needed to make that commitment to win the election campaign but I think they'd have easily won without it. And saying stuff to win an election which is going to stuff you in power is v short sighted.

2. Stupid high-profile policy mistakes like the Winter Fuel Payment. To this day I have NO idea why they did that or did it at the time they did. Trying to signal willingness to take tough decisions? Belief that everyone thought well-off pensioners didn't need it/pensioners don't vote Labour anyway? Honestly baffled by it.

3. Being overly obsessed with Reform and the next election rather than just getting on with the business of making the most of their time in office. I just feel like they're acting like they're not a government in power with a huge majority able to do significant things and just constantly running scared of Reform. Make a solid case for what you're in office for and get on and do it. There's just no big picture sense of what the government is about. I think they won on perceived competence following the shambles of the Tory government but I just don't think they've successfully sold a vision of what they are about. And they've made so many missteps that Starmer's totally lost the perception that he is a 'safe pair of hands' amongst the public. The irony is that Reform certainly couldn't organise a piss up in a brewery.

Yes, because he doesn’t articulate or defend any actual ideas, and he is war obsessed.

Only if was by Andy burnham which can’t happen anyway cause not an MP

Well the first one has spoken out: Clive Lewis to the BBC

I was a Labour voter, defected to voting independent for the GE. I’m furious with Starmer so far, he has been a huge let down. But now is not the time for change. He needs to get a grip. They should have been much better prepared for government - they had plenty of time!!!

Once the backbenchers start speaking out it is always a sign the cards are about to fall. Party discipline out the window. The core problem is that Starmer is an administrator not a leader.

Yes they will have been saying for weeks behind closed doors but now he has publicly spoken I imagine it will intensify. Starmer no longer has the authority to discipline MPs.

This government might be well meaning, but it’s inept and, worse, causing real damage to the economy and to our reputation.

Starmer is, I am sure, a good barrister. But barristers are given a brief, and then use their knowledge of law argue it well. From either side, depending on who briefs them. Starmer can’t write the brief, which is why there is no vision, no plan.

His approach is ‘I’m the leader of the Labour Party, where do you want to be lead’. He can’t lead. Didn’t he say in his opening speech as PM that he’d put country before party? The last few weeks don’t support that. In fact, his whole term to date has been Starmer first, then Lord Ali, then party, then country. For the good of the country and the PLP he should go.

Agree - but I actually think it is also the advisors surrounding Starmer that are a problem too, as well as Starmer himself.

The thing that this government don't acknowledge is they got in because they were the best of a bad bunch and if they don't do something radical to make ordinary people's life's better then they will be toast - even if that means upsetting their rich donors and the Media (understandable they wouldn't say it but they might behave in ways that show they understand this, but they don't)

I agree. However Clive Lewis is to the Left of the party and will cause problems for anyone who is a centrist leader. The only way Blair got anything through was by getting his strongmen to sit on the Left. Lewis wants a Corbynite figure to take over but that would spell fiscal, political and electoral disaster. He and his cronies are unlikely to support anyone else. I can't think of anyone strong enough to take over. Maybe Wes Streeting.