Is America under Trump having its own Cultural Revolution moment?

[logicisall]

I found this article very thought provoking. As we try to understand what is happening in the world and the seismic shifts in foreign and economic policy under Trump, is this what is really happening? More importantly, what does it mean for the rest of the world if this is a permanent change?

New York Times

If we take the view that every cloud has a silver lining, the main positive from Trump's actions is that the EU and other nations have realised that they need to devise diplomatic ways to push back against Trump and Vance without further escalating tensions.

I think that we have to address the fact that the US has declared not only that it is relinquishing its self appointed World Police role, but will be actively turning away from anything it believes would not generate perceived benefits to itself.

In Poland, prime minister Donald Tusk has called for all men to undergo military training. In Germany, Merz said “Given the threat to our freedom and to peace on our continent, the mantra for our defence has to be – whatever it takes".
Britain has agreed to ramp up defence spending. In France, Macron, to give him his due, who believed in strategic autonomy years ago, has said that arming ourselves now, would help us avoid tomorrow's war.

The rest of the world is also undergoing a sea change as we assess who our allies really are. I would put the US firmly in the Russia, China, North Korea, Hungary bloc.

And now Republicans are told to stop holding townhall meetings. They've been unpopular in deep red states and they won't go meet their constituents... democracy indeed...
https://www.politico.com/live-updates/2025/03/04/congress/gop-town-halls-richard-hudson-00210024

That was an interesting read @StandFirm , and a sinister development in shutting down complaints. Labelling complainants as 'paid troublemakers/Democrats" will play well to Trump supporters, and Republicans will point out that it's not mandatory, so there's wiggle room if some want to continue the In-person Townh Hall events.

I agree that none of it makes sense and i cant see any national goal for the USA, that's why I wouldn't categorise it as a revolution. It just looks like a massive power grab for the sake of it.

More Putin than Mao.

While I'm not happy about the sudden apparent affection for Putin, President Trump's changes at home make a lot of sense.

Forget Air Traffic Controllers. The democrats have been pushing that nonsense from the start. They tried to say that plane crash was caused by sacking ATCs when the only people let go were people who served on a policy board and they hadn't even gone yet. They had heard about honesty and integrity, but were having none of it.

When challenged they couldn't name one ATC who was fired or threatened with firing.

Trump has been removing illegal immigrants. Well within his right as president. The word illegal should be a clue.

He is rooting out waste and corruption because his country is in an insane amount of debt and that has caused a lot of criticism and resistance from those lining their pockets. Of course they are sad and angry.

When someone fights to stop people checking the books in a government office you know what they are don't you.

He is pulling back from paying the bills for other countries. Again this is his right. It's like an ordinary family in debt cancelling donations and extras like Netflix so they can pay the mortgage.

He has declared that women and girls have rights and that has pissed off a lot of men, but surely no one here thinks that is a bad thing?

And of course he has put a stop to drugging and operating on children to meet the demands of what is either an ideology, a mental illness or a fetish depending on your point of view, but whichever it is defending kids counts as a good thing in my book.

There are claims he has been curbing free speech. I've not seen a rational attempt yet to demonstrate that. Unless they are referring to the right to tell toddlers about anal sex.

He has apparently signed an executive order ending censorship imposed on online platforms. Presumably those worried about Free Speech are cheering that? right...?

I'm uneasy about his plans for other countries but I note that he threatened to impose tariffs to discourage his own people buying from Canada and Mexico unless they acted to stop people crossing their border into the US and that worked.

Perhaps some of his other statements were also a way to push people in the right direction. We'll have to see.

In terms of permanent consequences @logicisall, I think Europe will become more self sufficient and innovative as the US becomes more erratic and unreliable.

I can see the end to the Two Party System. I don't think the Republican Party will survive Trump's administration. I'm not sure The Constitution will survive in tact either.

I have no doubt that we will be living alongside a stronger Russia and more emboldened Putin.

One thing that's clear right now is that America has lost the trust of the rest of world.

Actually, @TooBigForMyBoots , I have quite a bit of trust in middle America. I lived in suburban NJ for a few months, and took the bus to the city until I moved to Jersey City. Cheap (in 1980, $285 per month) and very unfashionable. We had a 1930s built apartment with two bedrooms.

Now my DC is in need of something similar, in the UK, there is no choice of options unless you have or inherit a lot of money,

I just don't think those voters in Middle America who supported Trump are getting the full perspective needed to realise the danger to democracy, to the economy (although grumblings are getting louder) and to world diplomacy.

Why are the Democrats not holding mass protests? It's so disturbing.

Those are quite some rose-coloured glasses.

Forget Air Traffic Controllers. The democrats have been pushing that nonsense from the start.

How do you feel about Elon’s purported incoming Starlink contract?

When someone fights to stop people checking the books in a government office you know what they are don't you.

So you think Elon’s DOGE is doing a well-considered, legal, stand-up job on this? Even as he stands on stage with an actual comedy chainsaw? What do you think about the cuts to USAid? Have you read the concerns about his flip-flopping on the employees and agencies that oversee, for example, Ebola outbreaks? How he fired them, re-hired them and then now they’re hobbled with actually being able to do their jobs? Enjoy that Ebola breakout. How about the layoffs to nuclear employees that manage the safety of plants for example? Those same ones that he then panicked and tried to reinstate because he fired them by accident, but couldn’t contact them because, he cut off their email addresses I could go on for pages on this one, but you get the gist.

He has declared that women and girls have rights and that has pissed off a lot of men, but surely no one here thinks that is a bad thing?

Oh yes, he loves women. He especially knows who women are when he takes away their reproductive rights. Resulting in the death of women that cannot access reproductive care, even when they’re miscarrying wanted babies. Oh yes, don’t forget about the child rape victims that can’t access abortions. He really loves women does Trump - the convicted for sexual assault felon.

He has apparently signed an executive order ending censorship imposed on online platforms. Presumably those worried about Free Speech are cheering that? right...?

Oh, he’s all for free speech isn’t he, you mean Trump who made a post last week threatening students from making peaceful protests? The same Trump, who banished the Associated Press from the White House?

I mean, I could write pages on this. He is dismantling the protections of a democratic government. No concerns? How about when he downgraded Russia as a cyber threat to the US? No concern either? Like the way he spoke to Zelensky? You know, Zelensky, President of Ukraine that previously agreed to nuclear disarmament under agreed protections from other countries, including America? No concern there either?

How about the insurrection then? The one that Trump said he didn’t agree to and had no part in, the one he told the Supreme Court that he had ‘called for peace’ in. The one that he just pardoned those convicted in taking part in.

Yes, an all around great guy. Can totally see why you’re standing up for him. FFS.

@TooBigForMyBoots "i cant see any national goal for the USA" - I don't think there's a national goal, but there's a goal of personal aggrandisement for Trump, masquerading under the MAGA banner.
Let's be honest, Trump supporters probably haven't thought deeply enough about what MAGA means, so while Trump's actions might be confusing atm, they're willing to give him a pass for now. This might change when the consequences land at their door and prices increase, the USD falls more against other currencies, unemployment rises and it becomes difficult to find a job as domestic demand stalls and export markets shrink.

Many people will only start asking questions when things affect them personally.

@LastTrainsEast I don't think that everything Trump is doing is wrong, just most of it.

The devil is always in the detail and DOGE is wielding a blunt hatchet to the public sector, rather like a lazy financial adviser managing your assets, who decides to shave 5% off everything when you ask for 5% in cash. No attempt is made to assess the assets, get rid of the dross and keep the ones generating the high returns.

Regarding illegal immigrants, the same applies as above. Correct me if I'm wrong, but my understanding is that many of them are working in poorly paid jobs that Americans do not want eg agriculture. Why not make those in work legal, or those who have been in the country for X+ years?

'Checking the books' whether in a government office or private company, shouldn't be done by the same person who stands to gain from accessing confidential information on business rivals. It is unethical and a conflict of interest.

His links to Russia are long standing.
This explanation of why Trump stopped aid, including intelligence to Ukraine is shocking.

Keith Kellogg, the White House’s special envoy for Ukraine and Russia, characterised the US decision to cut off intelligence sharing and military aid to Kyiv as like beating a farm animal with a piece of wood.
“Very candidly, they brought it on themselves, the Ukrainians,” Kellogg said as the veteran diplomats, academics, and journalists in the room recoiled in surprise. Several held their faces in their hands. “I think the best way I can describe it is sort of like hitting a mule with a two-by-four across the nose,” he continued. “You got their attention, and it’s very significant, obviously, because of the support that we give.
The Guardian. 09.03.2025

America as a mafia state is also well worth reading.

It's not about trust in the American people.

The US government has lost the trust of businesses, organisations and governments. The Trump administration is actively driving instability. It's word is no longer it's bond, in fact it's liable to change its mind within days.

This, I know that there are lots and lots of devastated Americans and there have been a smattering of protests but I’m shocked by how meaningfully unchallenged most of it has been. Even republicans, where are the non-MAGA’s? They can’t all think that aligning with Russia and N Korea is a good thing. They must see the brazen untruths. Will they have to change the national anthem? It’s no longer the land of the free nor the home of the brave 😢

Wait, I thought he was a Hitler loving Fascist not a Communist, he can't be both, or is it whatever is 'bad'? Just anything bad? what about Stalin? Trump hasn't been compared to him yet.
It's all getting a bit much, there's plenty to criticise about Trump if you want to but this is TDS nonsense.

I think there may be some kind of revolution, but I'm not sure if it'll be cultural.

Do you mind if I add something about your link? I post links to the NYT quite often, and I usually type in the title, author, and usually a snippet to convey a sense of the article. That provides enough information if someone wants to look it up elsewhere and avoid the paywall. Your link ended me up with something I've never seen before: A captcha hoop to jump through, then a half-page with nothing beyond the title and sub-head. Not even the author.

There's little the Democrats can do. Trump has a majority in both Houses and on the SCOTUS.

There are some demonstrations happening and Trump's actions are being challenged in the courts. At the minute only the Republicans and the Market have any real sway and Trump is ignoring both.

He's taking America into recession.

There are many protests. Our social media is always showing them. What we’re not seeing is many of them on mainstream media.

I like to stick to convicted felon. Factual and succinct.

Many people will only start asking questions when things affect them personally.

If it wasn’t so fucking frustrating and terrifying, I would actually feel quite sorry for the people that voted for him that don’t understand what they’ve done. Those with very little money are going to be screwed when Social Security cuts come in, jobs disappear because of recession and Medicaid decimated.

They’ll still be blaming Democrats and reacting to social media posts with their moronic laughing emojis. Never has turkeys voting for Christmas seemed a more apt phrase.

By then, I suspect they’ll be so many other fires burning that it will be hard to focus on that at all.

Russia hasn't been a communist country for a very long time. So nobody's saying he's a communist. "TDS" does not exist. It's just Trumper bullshit. If you aren't a Trumper, maybe you should stop enabling them by repeating their nonsensical claims.

Good on you for taking that post on. Sadly, your words will fall on deaf ears. Trumpers are impervious to reason.

I know… usually they’re the ones who will be most impacted by him, ultimately, too. But you’re right, they are beyond logic. Or having a bar of basic decency for world leaders.

I actually like the Mafia comparison best. Fascism, Communism and Stalinism all have an underpinning ideology. Trump's callous response to the increased Russian bombardment of Ukraine after military aid and intelligence were pulled, is shocking. The EU & UK need to focus on how to untangle themselves from years of allying with the US now that no countries can trust treaties signed by the US, to be honoured.