Reform are getting a shitload of voters

[HeBeaverandSheBeaver]

I have not voted
Reform and live in a safe tory seat But I voted
Lib dem tactical vote

I said ages Ago on here the reform would do really well and was shouted down.

Same as brexit, no one will admit voting for reform but
They still do it in droves it seems.

I'm Willing to bet they
Might win an election in four years at this rate!!

Scary
Times

Labour have real problems in defining a rich or wealthy person. I think the UK does generally.

I'm terrified. Reform came in 3rd in Lincoln with just over 9000 votes.
While I understand that for some it was a protest vote, that's still a very high number.
It shows what a lot of your neighbours think of you.

Pps spoke about them being racist bigots, I do genuinely think that not all of them are. They just agree with some of the manifesto points - and some points look great at face value, if you don't critically think about how they'd achieve any of these promises. But if they ever win there would also be repercussions for women's rights, employers who employ foreign workers and many more. As a woman and an immigrant (despite moving here as a child, and life here being the only life I know) I'm genuinely scared for our future if in 4 years time they are elected.

One thing that is somewhat baffling is that considering Farage's central role in Brexit and how it's turned out to be a spectacular failure he has hardly been picked up on this during the election.

The other point I'd make is that mainstream politicians adopting hard-line positions emboldens and helps the far right flourish rather than helping defeat them - France is an instructive case study on this. And here in UK despite the hard right manoeuvres on Rwanda deportations and hostile environment by Conservative party this has helped lay the groundwork for Reform winning 4 seats (it also helps they punch above their weight with media influence).

Extending voting rights for all elections to all citizens including foreign workers would help counterbalance this. If you're good enough to work in the country and pay your taxes you should be able to have a say in how they're spent.

Men have been killing in the name of religion for millena, it's about land resources and power it's not about religion.

I don't believe most people voted for Reform as a protest vote, I think their manifesto offered what a lot of people actually want for the UK.

I really like some of their policies, especially the dumping of the inordinate ridiculous cost of Net Zero. That was a vote winning policy in itself.

and again I would ask what " Muslim" means to you ? I have Irainian and Egyptian collegues who might describe themselves as " culturally Muslim" in the same way great swathes of middle england are vaguely C of E. What they mean is they don't eat pork, probrably don't drink ( though some do) but they may or may not observe Ramadam but definately celebrate Eid. They most definitely don't pray 5 times a day or go to Mosque weekly. There are millions of moderate Muslims in the UK, they certainly believe in education of women, they don't wear the veil. It's like comparing Orthodox Jews to a " culturally Jewish" New Yorker or a Christmas church attender with a member of the Amish...

BYW I know this is how the BBC are reporting it - very lazy journalism.

They are crossing through multiple countries to ‘escape’ persecution. They don’t need to risk their lives on small boats. They would be safer remaining in France and claiming asylum there.

Funny how your nation only declines as it becomes more multicultural. Just rearranging the deck chairs on the Britannia lol

Another 5 square miles that wouldn’t have been taken had Hamas not started all this on 7th October….

@Livelovebehappy haven't Israel been taking parcels of land well before 7th October.

Sorry this complete bollocks, wjat on earth are you actually advocating some sort of closed system like Japan circa 1890 ?. Japan has v. low multiculturalism/ immigration and a v. low birth rate- not working out so well for them is it ? Whereas USA which is effectively a nation of immigrants has bucked the trend of other nations showing strong growth over the last 10 years. You do realise we have had black and brown people living in Britain for over 200 years ?

In terms of womens rights, they are actually the only party that have a clear non-wishy-washy stance on the gender/trans issue.

Give over. Stop spouting stuff parrot fashion.

Unfortunately we’re already hearing the excuses coming through that it’s going to take at least two terms for Labour to clear up the mess left by the Tories. People aren’t going to buy into that. They better start making things happen and hit the ground running, or out they go at the next GE.

Japan has v. low multiculturalism/ immigration and a v. low birth rate- not working out so well for them is it

Japan is a safe and lovely country that I lived in for many years. It actually serves them fine to have extremely low immigration numbers, and those that do come tend to be East Asians with similar cultural backgrounds.

United Kingdom is not doing economically as well as Japan. So what are you really saying here? Do
you really think importing culturally alien people would improve Japan?

Whereas USA which is effectively a nation of immigrants has bucked the trend of other nations showing strong growth over the last 10 years

You are not growing like America — you are actually declining. I think there are other factors tbh.

You do realise we have had black and brown people living in Britain for over 200 years

Not in any significant numbers. I can also say Japan has had white people living there for 400 years. Still doesn’t make it a multicultural country.

@Livelovebehappy , I really hope you are not thinking that it is a punishment for Hamas and would not have otherwise happened.
It is Colonisation. The Americans did it when the settler communities on the Eastern coast spread west from late 18Century. Google 'The Trail of Tears'.
The US did it again in with Texas and New Mexico from Spain.

I will say this.

I LOATHE Reform and everything they stand for. But I know what they stand for.
Ditto Green (don't loathe, wouldn't vote,) but understand their core values.

I think Farage's votes have been made up by a number of things - mainly die-hard Tories who can't bring themselves to vote Tory, protest voters, fed-up WC communities who are just desperate, but also a slice of people who are just happy to vote for someone whose policies and position are clear.

That is not in any way an endorsement, but I reckon they have won a fair few votes through being fairly direct and open in their views - whatever you think of them. People are sick of evasive answers and waffle. Of vote chasing and appeasing. They cut through it.

Japan is in recession
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/business-68302226.amp

What about the lost decades ?
It is undoubtedly very beautiful and has wonderfully low crime. However it also has enormous problems with depopulation and ghost towns.
https://www.economist.com/the-economist-explains/2018/11/26/the-challenges-of-japans-demography?utm_medium=cpc.adword.pd&utm_source=google&ppccampaignID=18156330227&ppcadID=&utm_campaign=a.22brand_pmax&utm_content=conversion.direct-response.anonymous&gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQjws560BhCuARIsAHMqE0ExHVkx1mE8O4WQ3Xz1jHZS_kggzqGbQQcIc-WZggAqkY8Xn3SkgB0aAjXWEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds

Let me get this right, you lived in Japan for many years presumably plugging their labour gap due to the declining population and benefiting from a favourable £/yen exchange rate, but you don't want brown people to have the same chance in the UK ? Or am I missing something ?

Let me get this right, you lived in Japan for many years presumably plugging their labour gap due to the declining population and benefiting from a favourable £/yen exchange rate

When I went it wasn’t so favorable, but I was there for graduate study, not really for work (iykyk)

but you don't want brown people to have the same chance in the UK ? Or am I missing something

It is weird how you reduce everything to ‘brown people’. Different nationalities have different effects. I doubt UK would mind well-educated and productive people from, say, Japan.

But here’s the thing. People can work in Japan and never, ever become citizens. Just isn’t possible except in special cases. So they mostly work a few years and go home. Get a big fat lump sum on their way out too.

I wouldn’t make too much of Japan being in a recession, it is still a safe, beautiful and prosperous country. I heard UK was once like this too. I wouldn’t know, I am not actually British but a married-in who won’t take citizenship. I feel I have some outside perspective

I also think it’s so reductive and facetious to say “hurr durr Reform hates immigrants and all the voters are racist”. I am an immigrant and have lived here most of my life. I speak fluent English, work, don’t claim benefits and am totally ingrained in British culture and society. I don’t think many people take issue with that.
They take issue to mass uncontrolled illegal immigration in unsustainable numbers, immigrants who never learn English or work, whose values could be totally at odds with traditional British values (like believing homosexuality is a sin and should be banned). Just like those Brits in Spain who live in English enclaves full of Linekers pubs and never learn a word of Spanish, who rightfully piss off the Spanish locals, do a lot of people honestly want areas like this in the UK? It’s a lot more nuanced than just “immigration”.

Also I agree with a PP, many people are sick of fence-sitting vague bullshit and want a party with clear stances on issues.

Yeah let the planet burn. Great policy.
More extreme heat deaths, deeper floods, bigger storms, more infrasture damage - it's all a bit of fun really, isn't it?

Read my posts; I absolutely do not reduce everything to brown people. Perhaps I should have said people from the global south as that is what I meant.

When exactly were you in Japan ? The £/yen exchange rate was pretty favourable all through the 80's and most of the '90s. Was it before this ?

I was in Japan last year one of my best friends immigrated there in 2020, I wouldn't describe it as more properous than the UK. If one was being unkind one might describe it as a dying culture, gentle and quaint but certainly slightly stuffy and old fashioned.

It is human nature to immigrate to a nation where your labour is worth more than it is at home, that why our junior doctors are all going to Australia.

Meanwhile Farage is currently on receiving end of some good old fashioned plain talking himself, protester at his conference telling him he's a racist. He likes people who call a spade a spade so presumably he approves.