Why isn’t there a political party who sit in the middle

[UpcomingElection2024]

I’ve been following all the political news recently and watching the live debates and can’t help but think why isn’t there a political party that represent the majority of what I would call hard working normal people want. I’m aware that this means different things to different people but surely there are some policies that people in both labour and Tory camps would agree on such as:

proper control of migration:

1. allow in skilled workers to plug the gaps in labour, we should welcome people who add value to our country and want to contribute the society and allow them to apply for residency / dual citizenship after x years.
2. allow safe routes and channels into the country for those fleeing persecution in their own countries, but not when they have travelled through other safe countries to get here. I’m genuinely curious why they come to UK after they have arrived in France when they could stop there - what is the draw?
3. hard stop on illegal immigration, surely options 1 & 2 above are the correct viable options. If investment is needed in 1 & 2 then we should put it in place.
4. stop any type of benefits for group 1 above, they haven’t paid into the country to qualify and should work to fund being here.

proper investment in healthcare:

1. properly fund clinical staff in healthcare, overhaul managerial roles and invest in up to date IT systems to streamline services
2. Add in more frontline clinical staff to improve quality of care basically have a more sensible ratio of clinical to admin/managerial roles (more Indians less chiefs)
3. give PIP benefits to those who truely need it and ensure they can have a proper quality of life and support for families, the Kate Garaway documentary was heartbreaking.
4. reduce ambiguous PIP payments for hidden disabilities that can’t be properly proven. Why does ADHD need paying for? (Genuinely curious) it never existed before and people made adjustments to their lives to accommodate any needs.

Education:

1. make teaching an attractive profession again and support teachers to be able to teach and not be tied up with targets etc
2. stop school fines - it’s just a money making ploy

Councils:

1. hold them to account on their spending
2. invest more in public services, local swimming pools, maintaining public areas, the councils should work for the people who live in their communities and reflect their needs not be run like businesses

Energy companies:

1. again hold them to account and cap the profits they are allowed to make.
2. enforce them to reinvest in xx% beck into infrastructure

welfare/ benefits

1. It shouldn’t be an option to choose not to work because someone is better off on benefits, this baffles me that it’s a viable option for some.
2. why should workers fund those who choose not to work ( not those who physically can’t)
3. cap how long someone can be on benefits like in other countries. It shouldnt be there as an option to help short term to help get people back into work and shouldn’t be used as an alternative to working

I suppose my point is surely there’s a mid point in some of these topics that both Tory and labour voters would buy into that would make society a fairer and more united place.

once we get the country back on track we can then move forward but to me it feels like we’re in a sinking boat trying to get the water out with a teaspoon.

it’s frustrating to agree with certain policies from each party but none that truly take in the views of the majority. (Again maybe I’m disillusioned on what this is) surely there’s topics that the majority of the country agree on!

Wouldn’t we all like to have the money to pay for private health services but that’s not what benefits are for.

ido agree though that the NHS needs better management and possibly better funding

@bergamotorange i did say maybe I’m disillusioned but thank you for you contribution 😊

Normal working people = people who go to work (maybe full time) and expect a nice happy society to live in without anger or animosity

Have you tried doing the Vote for Policies quiz to see who you align with,

Because we have two centrist parties and they're probably both standing in your constituency.

And you probably need to update your view on ADHD @UpcomingElection2024

If one of the extra costs of the disability is that she needs private medicine then that's what it's there for. The whole point of the DLA/PIP/AA group of benefits is that you get the cash and you decide how to spend it.

This is what I mean - you need to understand the reality before you start moaning.

Also understand the political philosophy behind different policy proposals from different parties.

And avoid words like 'normal' because both Conservative and Labour are normal - these views and principles exist in all democracies.

Add in more frontline clinical staff to improve quality of care basically have a more sensible ratio of clinical to admin/managerial roles (more Indians less chiefs).

Compared to private businesses the NHS is undermanaged. It has a lower ratio of managers to non-managers.

It's a lack of managers that's requiring consultants, doctors and senior nursing staff to have to spend large amounts of their time managing staff rostering and supervising administrative staff. Time that everyone would prefer them to spend on patient care.

When politicians talk about over half the staff not being patient-facing, they're including laboratory staff, porters, domestic staff, cleaners, drivers, cooks, janitors, payroll and accounts, maintenance staff, etc. and all those that provide the backroom services that enable the NHS to function and provide patient care.

If the NHS employed a sufficient number of managers they wouldn't need to buy in as much management support and consulting as they do.

expect a nice happy society to live in without anger or animosity people who live in lala land you mean?

Adult politics requires adult-level engagement.

@DogInATent ah that’s interesting as my perception was more clinical staff were needed, but that makes sense. Ultimately I suppose the NHS just needs more funding or a review of what it provides so there’s no postcode lottery

@bergamotorange oh you’ve made my day with your passive aggression 😊😊 have a lovely day full of rainbow sprinkles

Hidden disabilities are complicated

If someone has had both legs amputated they are clearly and visibly disabled.

But most disabilities are "hidden" in a way - stroke, heart attack, brain injury, Parkinson's, etc are all serious and major problems but not immediately visible.

The current PIP process (please note this is different for children as they get DLA) is really quite extensive. You need to submit a lot of medical evidence supporting your claim.

If you have a stroke/heart attack/brain injury then it is reasonable to look for help to the state as you are likely to have difficulty working either full time or at all. I'd hope that this doesn't change and I personally wouldn't want these sorts of "hidden" disabilities to be excluded from the benefits system.

@Octavia64 i absolutely agree with you

I am having a nice day thank you.

But your opening post is a bit silly, you claim you are 'normal' but you are no more normal than anyone else, who do you consider 'not normal'?

You could easily learn more about real politics if you wanted to, but you want lovely cutesy easy politics perhaps?

We have over 20% of the population claiming disability benefits - all other, comparable European countries, such as Italy, Germany and France have 6,7 or 8%.

@bergamotorange i don’t claim to know a lot about politics, but I also don’t think they make it easy for ‘average’ people to align to their manifestos and make them easy to understand but maybe I’m a bit of a Luddite and need a dummies guide to manifestos or a crib table for each party highlighting their policies and the implications.

The purpose of PUP is to use in anyway that is suitable.

There are no provisos

In your compassionate scenario she wouldn’t be able to afford the meds and then would be more disabled.

Maybe sort the NHS out first eh?

She spends all her PIP on jewellery and books to wind people like you up. I get it too. I spend it all on clothes and make up for the same reason. .

Also the number of ‘normal, working people’ paying tax is only just over half the population - if that trend continues it simply isn’t a viable system - there won’t be enough people paying in to support it!

This needs a source because it sounds like crap.

From the House of Commons Library:
The number of people entitled to receive a disability benefit in Great Britain has risen over time, from 3.9 million in May 2002 to 6.3 million in February 2023

The difference between a policy and a slogan is whether it's possible to disagree with it. If you can't really imagine anyone arguing for the opposite, it's just a slogan. And that's what a lot of your list is, OP. The difficult thing- the actual policy- is how you do it. "Hard stop on illegal immigration"- again, not a policy, likewise "properly fund clinical staff"

Other parts of your proposals aren't centrist at all eg not allowing asylum seekers who have travelled through a safe country. This isn't a centrist position- it's a breach of the UN Refugee Convention and generally argued for by the far right and people who think we should't have any international obligations in respect of refugees at all. Likewise point 4- the idea that people come here to work but never become entitled to any state support eg in the case of illness is not a centrist position.

We all see our own views as being the sensible ones, of course, but it's worth spending some time questioning this assumption. The only positions you stated that I agreed with are the ones so vague that they are practically meaningless.

It’s not to pay for medication that is not available on the NHS. If there is a clinical need for medication it should be provided on the NHS

It’s to pay for ANYTHING you need.

There are no rules.

And there is no NHS.

After reading your ‘rule’ which doesn’t come from the dwp, I’m going to spend mine a massive fuck off holiday.

voteforpolicies.org.uk/survey

That.

Exactly.

How much time have you spent reading either the manifestos or some serious (not FB!) analysis?

People need to engage - which means put a bit of time in.

Politics is complicated. You have to pick your own level - do you want it dumbed-down to primary school level or do you want a real understanding?

your post makes no sense.

it seems neither of you work and it’s difficult to see what extra costs you have from your disabilities. Given the huge rise in disability benefits and the fact that we simply can’t fund everything, I do think we need to look at these things again.

This is sort of useful, but doesn't help with understanding why policy A is better than policy B. People sometimes vote for policies that actively harm people like themselves!