webchat with "loons, fruitcakes and racists"

[glasnost]

Is it ok for MN to be hosting a webchat with someone branded the above by our PM?

.....Or to cope with reality [Smile]

(While I should check my emoticons before I post them...)

Whereas I should just check my emotions

Tondelayo. Me, too. Lord knows what permanent damage that chat's done to me. Or to my browser history.

'I've seen things you wouldn't believe....'

MmeLindt- I support our membership of the EU but it is far from perfect. The CAP and CFP are dreadful both economically and environmentally and are in need of reform but I think we need to do this from within the EU.I also think there is enormous waste within EU institutions, the sitting of the Parliament in both Strasbourg and Brussels being one example but surely it is better to work within the EU to try and eradicate this waste. The benefits of EU membership and integration are accepted by most and so I think it would be very foolish to withdraw and leave it.

To all of those not well informed 50% want out of the EU. fullfact.org The EU is very undemocratic. Wastes huge amounts of money and pokes its nose into Britians affairs whenever it can. It stinks.

Why didn't anyone wait for Nigel Farage outside MN string him up, or arrange for him to be hung drawn and quartered? I have never seen so much biase in all my life. 74% of our laws are made in Brussels, and that is a fact acknowledged by the government.

Don't let that stop anyone posting nonsense. Many here don't agree with facts even when put before them!
God help democracy! It's probably why we have been held to ransom by the EU, because we have people such as those on here, who wish to be ever so PC and roll over and accept the EU instead of standing up to it. Nigel Farage is the only one with the guts to do it. Cameron makes piecemeal attempts at confronting the EU. He is wimp.

glasnost. When did you join MN? are you really Georgeorwell?

When did YOU join MN? Nosey parker. I wish I WAS George Orwell. That means I wrote 1984 the greatest novel ever. FACT.

Anyway complimentary I'm sure you're none too happy after your admired one Mr.Farage got rightly and roundly pasted today due to his willful obtuseness and glibness.

You still going to vote for him?

Yes. I think you are georgeorwell.

uk laws arent 75% eu.the higher figures of 84%, 75% and even 50% claimed by the likes of hannan, farage and cameron are based on miscalculations, misunderstandings, or sources unknown, and often derive from parts of the EU other than just the UK ? and so with no hard evidence to support them must be dismissed as either too high or inapplicable to the uk situation.

huddspur
Exactly my thoughts.

I live in Geneva and have heard stories about the UN that would make your hair curl. There is so much waste. I imagine that those living in Brussels and Strassburg could say the same.

I still believe in the EU, and hope that there is the will and the determination sometime to push through reforms.

Insight
The problem is, there are always going to be initiatives and laws that are unpopular with the voters. If Kohl had waited until he had public opinion behind him, the former East Germany would still be 40 years behind the West. The extremely unpopular Solidaritätszuschlag was used to rebuild the DDR. No one would have voted for it. But it was necessary.

SM
I was searching for the origins of that rumour earlier. Farage said it was from Roman Herzog, but I found no evidence of where that figure was from.

Yes georgeorwell (glasnost) joined around 23rd feb?
Just in time to slander Farage. Yea right!

There's no need for anyone to slander Farage. He does an excellent job of that himself.

I honestly hadn't thought he'd be quite that silly though, frankly. He thought he could give obtuse answers and get away with it. He obviously hadn't been on MN before or the MNer/UKIP supporter who suggested to him to do the webchat had underestimated the intelligence of the women on here.

One thing that does me is why UKIP-pers and Euroskeptics love Norway so much. A country with a 28% basic and 54% higher rate of income tax. A country with 24% VAT. A country where food & other living costs are hugely expensive. A country with the highest level of maternity pay in the world.

I love Norway very much (and hope to visit again next time I remortgage ) and admire its welfare state - I just wonder why UKIP people are so fond as it is the complete opposite of their values (low taxation, low regulation).

I think they bring Norway up because the issue of overriding importance for eurosceptics is national sovereignty and democractic control of one's own country with the ability of parliament to make its own laws. Money and cost is not their major concern, as Farage said when he said that his opposition to the EU was not due to cost but due to democracy.

Strange, isn't it, how they admire Switzerland and Norway.

Switzerland's standard of living is high, but they have even more interference in the agricultural industry than the EU. The markets are highly regulated. They have different standards of kitchen appliances, for instance, purely to ensure that Swiss buy Swiss products. Even the plugs are completely different to the EU plugs. It is a right PITA.

I have mentioned the cost of living in Switzerland before - the house prices [faints] - £3500 for a 3 bed house a month. £20 for 4 chicken breasts. £1 for a litre of milk.

We have to pay import taxes on goods from outwith CH. It is highly regulated. Totally at odds with the policies of UKIP.

Yes but Farage sid that he admired Switzerland because it was a rich country and becuse its people had true democracy and could have referenda on whatever subject they wanted. I think for UKIP it really comes down to freedom, democracy, national sovereignty and national independence. Money is a secondary issue, they are not prepared to sacrifice sovereignty for silver.

Hmm. He should try living here to see if he still likes the direct democracy. It makes everything go at a snails pace, and there is always the danger that extreme policies are pushed through into law. See the banning of the Mosques last year - which was done on a campaign of misinformation and scare tactics.

Or the Ivan the Rapist campaign that was passed to ensure that foreign born convicted criminals are automatically deported, not just for rape or murder, but for drug dealing and social security abuse.

Yes, but that is democracy, it is the real will of the people, not the will of the planners. You either trust the people or you don't. You either want real democracy or rule by politicians who say they represent the public, but ignore the wishes of the public and award themselves expenses out of the public's purse.

If he wants the real will of the people - why are his policies so dedicated to micro-managing side issues - like what music Radio 4 plays or what British designers make.

if it is really about the will of the people, then surely his manifesto should just be "we will referendum everything - up to you guys"

Ah, but I don't really believe that we should trust every decision to the public.

We vote representatives into power so that they can make the decisions in our stead.

Some pieces of legislation is too important to leave the decision to people who have no idea of the wider implication of the laws that they are voting on.

Any Swiss citizen can introduce a law, from minor matters to major changes in the constitution.

I don't know what his side issues are. I don't know if referenda are part of his policies. I am sure he has lots of policies that are not to my liking, but that doesn't invalidate the fact that he does have a point about his major policy, which is about national sovereignty and the ability of parliament to make its own laws, whatever those laws are, and whether we like them or not.

are too important, not is.