Do you believe in god?

[Unicorndreams24]

i have recently been thinking a lot about religion and wondering how many believe in god and also what made you come to the decision of believing?

In the [Catholic] church's view, sex is only approved where there is a possibility of conception, within a marriage. This is consistent with multiple biblical assertions; there are none at all in favour of extra-marital sex (though the definitions of 'marital' tighten up as time goes on) or gay sex. The Catholic church also affirms the injunction against masturbation, fwiw.

The Vatican has made a dispensation for blessings of same-sex unions, but even these are restricted. Similarly, it doesn't recognise divorce. A marriage can be annulled by the church, if it agrees the marriage 'never truly existed' as a sacramental union. Civil divorcés aren't excommunicated, but will be if they remarry.

Apologies, you are right, and I too have been engaging with tangents. To bring it back to the original poster’s question: I would say I believe in God because of the Christian gospel.

The why for me? At its heart, the gospel is the good news that God loves us, that humanity has fallen into sin, and that through Jesus Christ— His life, death, and resurrection— God offers forgiveness, restoration, and eternal life to all who trust in Him. It is not about earning favour or being perfect, but about receiving God’s grace and being invited into a relationship with Him. I also love that the gospel invites a personal relationship, not adherence to religious rules, with Jesus. I feel relieved that anyone can come to have a personal relationship with him regardless of intellectual, economic, social, sexual, racial etc background. The gospel shows both God’s justice and His incredible mercy, and it’s this message that anchors my faith.

I know others may not agree with this, and I respect that, but for me personally, it fills my life with joy, peace, and deep comfort. It has quite literally saved me, and has brought me great comfort through suffering and tragedy. It is a personal faith that makes me joyous every day!

Would it really stop teaching the gospels?? Would that make it non-christian?

I could see why the C of E might consider going full secular, but can't see it working. It would stop being a church in most people's eyes: so what would it then be, and what for?

It has quite literally saved me, and has brought me great comfort through suffering and tragedy.

This is exactly what I say about antidepressants and therapy 😂

Beautifully stated.
I concur, in every detail.

No, and I believe that the Church is one of the most corrupt instutions which exists!

No I don’t believe in god - there is no evidence. It’s very straightforward.

Really good points. Honestly, I don’t know. In practice, the message of sin, redemption, and Christ’s lordship can get blurred when we start moving away from what the Bible teaches. That’s why it raises questions about what being ‘Christian’ really looks like in that context. As many have pointed out, different denominations interpret aspects of the Bible differently. But when the core message of the Gospel—sin, redemption, salvation—becomes threatened, it naturally raises the question: what then is the church? Is it still a community of believers, or a community following a false gospel? I don’t know.

Thank you! Sometimes on these threads, it sounds as though there are misunderstandings or people imposing their thoughts or views on how we might feel or believe. I feel true comfort and peace that walks with me in a stable (and free!) manner every day in the ups and downs of life’s experiences: whether that’s a family member being struck by cancer, the death of a child, or conversely the warmth of marriage and friendships or the satisfaction of a meaningful piece of work!

The implications for anyone promulgating a false gospel are horrendous. Galatians 1 makes that crystal clear. The stakes could not be higher for any church which loses its way.

Indeed. And that’s why I do think it is really important that people who are curious should ask questions, interrogate the Scripture, and also read it for themselves — and never stop doing so if they decide to become Christians, to grow deeper in that personal relationship with God. But also, it is important that this is something figured out for oneself — as plenty on this thread have done and decided for themselves.

I disagree with Mischance's complaint, particularly as they aren't bringing anything to the discussion.

It's very straightforward for me to say there are no gods. Everything presented as evidence for their existence can be better explained by logic and science.

It's less straightforward for believers. They have feelings that I might label differently, which to them are evidence. They see these feelings reflected and codified in religious texts. Many welcome [some of] religion's rules to live by: we all have such rules, often the same ones. Only the faithful have them set out in ancient texts with expert bodies interpreting them for the modern world.

When you ask "Why do you believe, and why don't you?" you're actually asking about all these details. For me, this thread's an interesting examination of some of the relevant factors. I should imagine it's even more interesting for those who've renounced a faith, as they must have given it deep consideration.

For those of you who are Christians how do you explain heaven, hell and sin to your children?

”It's less straightforward for believers. They have feelings that I might label differently, which to them are evidence. They see these feelings reflected and codified in religious texts.”

It’s always interesting to see how others view you. Here we have an unbeliever coming up with a schema to try to make sense of a believer’s faith. It’s not unkindly framed, and I’ve certainly had worse suggestions made to me.

But here’s the problem - an unbeliever, by definition, cannot comprehend what a believer’s experience of Christ is.

I will only speak here for myself.
I know Him.
I have met Him.
I had my first encounter with Him in 1978.
Unsought, unplanned, un-prepared for.

That initial encounter shook me to my core and changed everything. I was so fearful by the implications for my life that I told no-one, and tried to put it out of my mind. For three years. Until He finally reeled me in. That’s when I welcomed Him into my life and the relationship began that has endured without a moment’s doubt for 45 years.

I hadn’t been at church or interacting with Christians. I hadn’t been reading the Bible and didn’t start reading it until after I welcomed Him into my life. He taught me personally day by day from scripture for a full year before leading me to His choice of church.

An atheist by definition cannot accept this. To an atheist I must be deluded, deranged, mad or something. Because their own cognitive dissonance will not allow an atheist to accept my testimony as true.

So we are separated by a great chasm, the unbeliever and the believer in Christ, even members of the same family cannot comprehend what it is to know Him.

I think I do. I definitely believe Jesus was a real person. I want to believe, I just don’t believe in the dogma of organised religion.

Why do you want to believe?

Yes. I used to be an atheist. I'm a professional scientist and the more science I learn the more it makes me believe in God/a higher power. I think it's all just too beautiful, magnificent, perfectly orchestrated, to be random. But really I only came to believe in God through personal experiences, through meditation.

And I do think that religions have been manipulated by humans so most of what we hear in houses of "God" aren't the real deal.

Try doing some meditation consistently - until you experience God yourself it really is just a belief/"faith". Personal experience is what changes your mind about it all, at least for me and a few people I know

I don’t know really. Might have something to do with the fact that my mum has stage 4 cancer. However, I’ve always thought that the possibility that there is some kind of consciousness beyond what we recognise is a nice idea. How plausible it is, I don’t know. Many people believe, I just don’t know how much faith I have in things I cannot prove.

Thank you for your lovely reply, @LeaningOnTheEverlastingArms. I've heard similar from many others.

I'm interested in this for reasons I'll try to explain a little bit. Friends have sometimes said I walk with one foot in the real world and the other in ... another world 🤔 but I do know what they mean! I have, unusually, been diagnosed as not having a personality disorder or any MH condition other than depression & low-grade CPTSD. So normal, yet the fact these other diagnoses were carried out says something.

I'm writing - so slowly, a crippled snail could write faster - a thing about the ways human thinking has changed over time. This is why I'm so interested in the 7th century BC (and, much later, the Enlightenment) and am re-reading ancient mythologies. People used to think with their instincts; intuition if you like. Obviously they were capable of analysis, but it meant something different to them. For the mathematicians of Babylon, the engineers of Egypt and Greek philosophers, knowledge 'came to them', after which they tested, explored and codified it. Leonardo da Vinci was like this, and I'm sure geniuses in every discipline experience it. But for people before around 500 BC, this was the only way knowledge was gained. It came directly from the gods.

People heard the voices of the gods. These days, we experience what they did at crucial moments; we use terms like 'inner voice' or, sometimes 'the third man' in major emergencies, when survivors report hearing a literal voice telling them what to do. You would doubtless call this the voice of god. I might call it your amygdala! In the early to middle iron age, it was an everyday occurrence.

To an atheist I must be deluded, deranged, mad or something.

This is where you're likely to get cross with me. Deluded and deranged are loaded words. I propose that short-term psychosis is far more usual than anyone admits, and that is why the DSM's two diagnoses (schizophreniform disorder and brief psychotic disorder) are said to be rare. When it happened to me at 19, I was working for a psychiatrist so I took it to him. He told me it's really normal in the late teens, early twenties, particularly for women, and not to worry unless it went on for more than a month: it didn't.

His hypothesis was that the massive hormonal disruptions of puberty, and the subsequent reconfiguration of the brain, could reasonably be expected to produce a few short circuits. Now we're learning more about both hormones and neurology, it looks like he was on the money. When we add in the now-recognised phenomena of PMD, PPD and pregnancy psychosis, sharp changes in oestrogen levels look likely culprits.

I hope I've managed to show we may not be different, except in the way we interpret things. I'm not saying your interpretation is wrong, just different from mine. One last similar-but different experience: miracles. I'm a massive fan and follower of Derren Brown. I guess you can see why!

Well you didn’t disappoint me.
I expected this response, as I said.

You missed the part where I’ve been in constant relationship with Him for the past 45 years. Oh, no wait… what will that mean now- some ongoing, older onset psychosis?

You absolutely met my expectations.
Cope with it whatever way you need to.

I know Him.

Oof, dismissive.

Yes, I think you were rather dismissive, but as I said it’s what I expected, so no harm done.

An atheist can’t allow that He might be real so it must be my amygdala, a psychosis, a flux in the hormones. Anything but that God is real, is able to meet with us and be in relationship with us.

Isn’t this just what I said in my original?

Thanks for your contribution, sincerely.
You have illustrated my post beautifully.

I'm satisfied that I've shown respect and compassion. I was overly optimistic to hope for the same. Thanks, you've taught me something.

“we use terms like 'inner voice' or, sometimes 'the third man' in major emergencies, when survivors report hearing a literal voice telling them what to do. You would doubtless call this the voice of god. I might call it your amygdala!”

It’s not respectful to put words in someone else’s mouth. It is very dismissive and condescending. I was disappointed to see you resort to this. I had thought better of you than this, and wouldn’t have drawn attention to it, but since you don’t seem to understand what you just did, I feel it’s appropriate to point it out.

Im sorry that you have had mental health problems. That’s bound to have been upsetting for you, and likely still is.

But it doesn’t give you the ability or the right to attempt a diagnosis by proxy here. When you said “This is where you’re likely to get cross with me…” indicates clearly that you knew very well this wasn’t a respectful or compassionate response.

But I’m not cross at all.

You’ve proven my point, for which I am, most sincerely, very grateful.
Have a great day.

Reminds me of the Episode of Yes Prime Minister, " The Bishops Gambit".

- The Church wants to maintain the balance.

- What balance? Between those who believe in God and those who don't.
Is there anyone in the Church who doesn't?

-Oh, yes. Most of the bishops.

:-)