Rules which must be followed by orthodox Jews.

[SchlemielSchlimazel]

I am slightly mystified by various aspects of orthodox Judaism, particularly rules that people are obliged to follow at different times.

Please can anyone who has relevant knowledge explain to me the purpose of having myriad arcane rules and then finding workarounds to circumvent them?

For example being forbidden to carry items in public on the Sabbath and then stringing a wire around the area in order to make it no longer public.

No tearing toilet paper, but you can do it in advance.

Not being allowed to turn lights on and off, so having a special cover which essentially allows you to turn the lights on and off (I think this is called a kosher lamp or kosher switch).

Do Jewish people unquestioningly accept these rules as being deeply respectful and meaningful, or do they privately think they are a bit crazy?

I’m not sure what your question is
Being deeply religious means following rules which give life structure and meaning and you’ll live in a community which follows those
I think an Eruv - the line you’re talking about - is a sensible way around the not carrying and the communities they’re placed in, are more religious, so makes lives easier

But the way I like your user name (parks and rec is deeply funny)

I saw a TikTok that explained the toilet roll/paper towel pre tearing and light switch thing is because you can't create anything new on shabbos (apologies if this is wrong). They precook the food for the 24 hours I believe.

There was a very interesting AMA thread not that long ago by a Jewish Mumsneter. She answered an awful lot of questions and it was really good. I learnt quite a lot.

yes I agree it’s an interesting question,
like don’t they sometimes put something in the fridge door to stop the light coming on when it opens? Or something like that, I can’t quite remember. But things like that seem to be circumventing the laws on a technicality like they are following the letter of the law rather than the spirit of the law

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/AMA/4974877-im-an-orthodox-jewish-woman-ask-me-anything

I follow a lady called Miriam Ezagui on Instagram & she highlights her life as an Orthadox Jew - it’s fascinating. I have learnt a lot.

But my point is you're not really following the rules if you're just finding work-arounds and loopholes for everything. You're not following the spirit of the law and if you're not going to do that then what's the point?

It's not a very good analogy, but if I decide it's fine to eat a steak sitting in the dark so I don't see it and no-one sees me eat it, that still doesn't make me a vegetarian.

Thanks but I haven't seen it.

Because as with all religion it’s a load of old mumbo jumbo that makes no sense and exists many to control people?

I know this and the not being allowed to work (which seems to have a very wide interpretation). It's the why that I don't really understand.

I mean I can understand the point of having a very ascetic existence for perhaps one day of the week when you eat very simple food, only use natural light, don't leave the house, etc. But if you just get round that by cooking nice food in advance, putting something over your lamps and deciding it's ok to leave the house if you - I don't know - carry a certain object (I know that's not an actual thing in Judaism) then I don't see the purpose.

That’s a poor analogy because you’re Jewish by birth or conversion
you’ll be Jewish whether you follow rules or not

I shall try to find that, thanks.

Yes, I am curious about that too. Like if I remember right a friend wasn't allowed to write on Shabbat so she used kids magnetic letters/ sticks to 'write' a message that way.
Her lights were on automatic set up so would switch on and off when needed, even though she didn't technically flip the switch.
Also wearing wigs is confusing me - they are hiding their hair by wearing... hair. I understand it more when they use headscarfs.

Don’t get me started with the some incredibly ridiculous English customs: judges and barristers wearing wigs, metropolitan police wearing urinals in their head (that make running, jumping or chasing someone almost impossible), driving with the wheel on the right side of cars (while the rest of the world drives with the wheel on the left), saying “sorry” every 5 words etc.. etc…

signed: a foreigner (yes, we do have some very silly traditions in my country too)

Yes, I've seen a lot of her posts and it's very interesting but none of it explains why. I suppose it's a question of faith - but that brings me back to wanting to know why you would want to find loopholes if you're trying to demonstrate your devotion to God.

Oh, and there's another one. Not being allowed to write "God" in full.

Fair enough.

She answers questions on her Instagram. You could ask her? Or if you're genuinely curious I'm sure you could find a Jewish religious leader in your area and ask them your questions.

It is indeed but I assume that this was a reference to Laverne and Shirley. Which I assume is what prompted Ron to ask the question on P&R.

Exactly! Writing is surely the use of a combination of mutually-understood symbols to convey a message from one person to another (or to make a note for oneself, I guess). So how is that not writing? It all seems to be about technicalities, so why bother?

Also tights. I get that modesty is very important and the tights mustn't be sheer or flesh-coloured, but why do they have to be special Jewish (kosher?) tights? Why can't they be black or navy blue tights from M&S? Surely that isn't decreed in the Torah?

It’s deffo a Ron quote
didn't know about Laverne and Shirley

All religions have fringe elements where legalism has grown to excess, imo. It wouldn't be for me (particularly as I am an atheist, but even when I wasn't), but I don't consider myself the arbiter of other people's spirituality. Maybe some people find that having lots of tangible rules makes their religion more present in everyday life, and the faff of finding and using "workarounds" is another expression of devotion? I don't know, but I'd be wary of shitting on someone else's way of living their faith from a place of ignorance.

Oh, I didn't know that.

I am curious, although I'm (probably obviously) not open to conversion or changing my agnostic standpoint.

If you go to the AMA section, I believe there is a thread led by an orthodox Jewish lady who has already answered some of your questions.
🙂

There's a very good drama called shtisel on Netflix, set in Orthodox community in Jerusalem. A few other Orthodox things on there too but shtisel is quite balanced.

Like all religions, rules are there to bind the community together as much as for their own sake.