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Philosophy/religion

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Are there any Stoics here?

167 replies

ThorsBedazzler · 02/07/2022 15:02

Does anyone else follow Stoicism here?

I'm an atheist, and happy with that. But having read Derren Brown's book "Happy" and read around stoicism, I've found a way of living that makes sense to me.

It has helped me focus less on other people, and more on what in m life i can control. I'm struggling at the moment with a run of unconnected but inconvenient events but have found it easier to bounce back because I've accepted that things happen, it isn't a cosmic plan against me, I'm not a victim.

I'm planning on reading Marcus Aurelius' Meditations (have read excerpts before) and Seneca too. It just seems a sensible way to approach life to me.

Anyone else?

OP posts:
Oblomov22 · 11/10/2022 07:03

Interesting. I will vine back snd investigate later.

LastnightIdreamtofsomebagels · 11/10/2022 14:43

BookWorm45 · 11/10/2022 06:55

While thinking about Stoic books etc - I have seen some "stoic journals" for sale, sort of thing where there is a quote per day / per week and some space for journalling. Do any of you use these - are they any good ?

Yes. I try to do mine daily, but in reality I just do it when I remember. I have the Ryan Holiday one. It's good, but a bit samey at times.

ValancyRedfern · 23/10/2022 12:51

Finding this fascinating. Although I'm not sure how it will help me, as it's the things I can control which stress me out the most. I was the least anxious I've ever been during Covid as all the decisions were taken out of my hands. I feel like every single decision I've made in life has been wrong and I've missed all my chances for a good life. I guess stoicism comes in with saying I can't change the past so there's no point beating myself about it. But how do you actually stop? It's easy enough to say don't beat yourself up but impossible to do I find. Sorry for stream of consciousness. In a bad way today!

Axolotlquestions · 23/10/2022 16:51

We can only make decisions based on the (usually flawed or incomplete) data we have at the time.

I too have been struggling with the idea that I make bad decisions. A friend reminded me of this poem, which really helped me:

The Road Not Taken
ROBERT FROST

Two roads diverged in a yellow wood,
And sorry I could not travel both
And be one traveler, long I stood
And looked down one as far as I could
To where it bent in the undergrowth;

Then took the other, as just as fair,
And having perhaps the better claim,
Because it was grassy and wanted wear;
Though as for that the passing there
Had worn them really about the same,

And both that morning equally lay
In leaves no step had trodden black.
Oh, I kept the first for another day!
Yet knowing how way leads on to way,
I doubted if I should ever come back.

I shall be telling this with a sigh
Somewhere ages and ages hence:
Two roads diverged in a wood, and I—
I took the one less traveled by,
And that has made all the difference.

His choice of the two roads was actually arbitrary. He could see only so far down both, and in the end took a less known one. That might imply courage, but it might be more banal than that. When he says "I shall be telling this with a sigh", I think we get to the nub of it. It’s how we interpret things that matter. The stories we tell ourselves about our lives and our choices - they matter. Because “I always make bad choices” is a fairly dreadful way to view one’s life. Whereas “things always work out ok” is much kinder to oneself.

How we tell the story of our lives makes all the difference, actually. Tell a kinder story about yourself, and remember there are always more forks in the road, more chances for things to turn out ok.

ValancyRedfern · 24/10/2022 07:49

Thank you. I think what i struggle wih is often know im making the wrong decision, its just often the one that's easier in the moment (e.g. marrying a man who is lovely but I don't fancy him) So I then beat myself up for being a coward. Trying to focus on looking forward not back. I can't change the past but I can change the future.

garlicandsapphires · 24/10/2022 08:00

I’m a big fan of Stoicism. In some ways it relates quite closely to CBT - changing mindset etc.
I do try to live by some of the principles

CPL593H · 27/10/2022 10:20

Hello all

I know many of us will have seen this but thought I'd share something from todays Daily Stoic in case anyone hasn't.

"History is a lie. It is written by the victors, as the saying goes. Which means the picture it produces is inherently biased by a particular point of view. It’s also biased towards the things we know about, by our common knowledge.
But what about all those events that occurred in darkness, without any witnesses? One of the most insidious biases these events produce is that history that gets reflected back to us is through the prejudices of its time.
This is why, for instance, we really only hear about male Stoics. Men controlled the levers of power in the ancient world, and didn’t particularly care about what was happening inside the brains or hearts of women. The written record appears as if there were few Stoic women…when in actuality there were many. They just didn’t get written about.

Even Seneca notes this. In a letter of consolation to his mother, he reminds her of the story of her sister, who had been married to one of Rome’s powerful proconsuls. “While on a sea voyage she lost her beloved husband,” he writes, “whom she had married as a maiden yet she bore simultaneously the burdens of grief and fear, and though shipwrecked, she rode out the storms and brought his body safely ashore. O, how many noble deeds of women are lost in obscurity!” "

I particularly like the last line Grin and am motivated to find out more about Seneca's sister.

Swissnotswiss · 27/10/2022 12:03

@CPL593H I love that! What Daily Stoic are people reading though as mine has a completely different passage!

CPL593H · 27/10/2022 12:28

Swissnotswiss · 27/10/2022 12:03

@CPL593H I love that! What Daily Stoic are people reading though as mine has a completely different passage!

This one @Swissnotswiss

dailystoic.com/email

I wonder if you get a different daily entry depending on when you signed up, sort of rotating ? Otherwise confused Grin

Ulysses · 27/10/2022 12:36

Following with interest.

CPL593H · 27/10/2022 17:12

@Swissnotswiss thanks, I'm putting that on my Christmas list! I've found the emails worthwhile, them appearing every day is useful.

QueenHippolyta · 28/10/2022 19:37

There were great and notable Roman women who were Stoics. Here are three: dailystoic.com/stoic-women/

WheelofLife · 28/10/2022 20:36

QueenHippolyta · 28/10/2022 19:37

There were great and notable Roman women who were Stoics. Here are three: dailystoic.com/stoic-women/

Interesting to read about J.K.Rowling there. I’ve always been a Harry Potter fan.

@Swissnotswiss I have that book. Most days (still working on my self discipline!) I read the excerpt and reflect on it in my diary

Tricyrtis2022 · 19/12/2022 16:16

Anyone still up for talking about this?

Haggisfish3 · 19/12/2022 16:17

Oooh I’ve just bought happy and a stoic handbook! Excellent thread find!

Tricyrtis2022 · 19/12/2022 16:22

Re procrastination, is anyone familiar with the film 'Aliens'? When I'm procrastinating, I use the voice of Sgt Apone as he rallies his marines. 'You heard the man, you know the drill. Ass holes and elbows!', 'Come on people, what are you waiting for, breakfast in bed?'. Apone's a brilliant character and those commands get me to put my boots on and get started.

CPL593H · 19/12/2022 16:32

I won't go on about the situation with my husbands health (thanks for all the kind words everyone, BTW) but he's out of hospital a few days.Things tough, very very tough mentally and physically but I realised the other day that I'm not procrastinating at the moment. Because I can't Grin

My darling sister sent me an early present, the "amor fati" ring with the flames symbolising the "blazing fire that makes heat and light out of all that is thrown on to it" (copyright Marcus) It does help to catch a glimpse when doing something challenging, which seems to be every 10 minutes at the mo.

@Tricyrtis2022 that clip is brilliant, thank you! He is indeed a great character. Whatever gives us the lick we need works. Note to self-be more Apone.

Tricyrtis2022 · 19/12/2022 16:36

Very sorry to hear your troubles, CPL593H, and hope life eases up for you. The ring looks great, sometimes little things like that can be a real comfort and source of strength.

A longer scene of Apone being a bad ass: - I often need to be more Apone.

Thecrackineverything · 19/12/2022 19:40

I'm afraid my attention was on Vasquez. 😁

Fairislefandango · 19/12/2022 20:28

I've read the Daily Stoic and teally enjoyed it, and I've just bought Marcus Aurelius' Meditations. Almost a the excerpts in the Daily Stoic which appeal to me most are his.

I find it interesting how many ideas in Stoicism seem to have things in common with Buddhism.

Tricyrtis2022 · 20/12/2022 07:52

Thecrackineverything · 19/12/2022 19:40

I'm afraid my attention was on Vasquez. 😁

She does rather draw the eye, doesn't she!

ThorsBedazzler · 20/12/2022 19:10

Hello!
I've been silent for a while as I've been pretty stressed for a while (house move and work stress) and felt slightly out of control of things. But I finished reading Happy and I'm back reading the daily stoic email and finding my way back to a more level place.

I did find it a little easier to pull myself out of the bubble of stress, but it was just relentless annoyances that built up. I'm getting there, just need to remember how.

OP posts:
WheelofLife · 20/12/2022 20:18

I’ve been silent too. I was off work on stress leave for over two months and am just getting back to normality.

I understand the concept of only focussing on what you can control and not letting the things that you cannot control affect you, but I am still incapable of not reacting to events. I feel as if I have to make some seismic internal shift in my perspective but not quite getting there yet…

ChristmasCrackler · 20/12/2022 20:50

I'm still reading The Daily Stoic book daily and pondering on it. I find it helpful. Thinking of journaling a bit around it.
Have read up a little on some of the Stoic philosophers too.
I'm glad you started the thread @ThorsBedazzler