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Philosophy/religion

Join our Philosophy forum to discuss religion and spirituality.

If you're religious, how do you explain 'bad things happening to good people'?

120 replies

PinkPugInShades · 24/09/2019 08:58

Not in anyway intending to be goady but I'm really curious about this subject at the moment.

I was brought up in the church of England and my family are still religious. I stopped when I was a teen and haven't been back since but it's still always there in the background so I wouldn't even kno what I believed anymore.

I've suffered a lot recently. Pregnancy loss at varying stages and am in a lot of pain.

I realise I'm probably looking for someone/something to blame but I feel such a hatred for 'god' if he's out there at the moment that I find myself screaming at him sometimes when I'm alone.

If you believe, why would he let this happen? I'm sick of hearing that it's his plan for me. Why would he want this to be my plan?

OP posts:
zasknbg · 25/01/2020 00:16

I haven’t RTFT but I believe some religious people justify it as follows:

  1. God is responsible for humans as a group/species and so is concerned with the group, not individuals. Therefore individuals can suffer.

  2. Sin apparently applies to all of us. We are all born sinners. Even a newborn baby who is just taking his first breath. I believe the sin is considered Adam and Eve in the garden of Eden.

  3. God will only send us the amount of pain and suffering that we are equipped to deal with.

I am unsure about it all. A horrific thing just happened to someone I know who is really good and kind. A lovely person.

followingonfromthat · 25/01/2020 00:43

When my mum was dying she told me that she must have done something terribly wicked in her life for God to be punishing her so much. She suffered in agony believing that she had sinned - it made the end all the more dreadful for her.

I don't know whether it exists after death, but for the last week of her life she was in Hell.

Which is why I have a complete and utter loathing of religion as a whole and her religion in particular. Her 'faith' caused her untold psychological suffering, and the people who indoctrinated her in that belief are despicable and beyond cruel.

Veterinari · 25/01/2020 02:15

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

mummykauli7 · 25/01/2020 02:31

Hi not sure how much this will help.

From what I believe, when you have a miscarriage it's because your baby is destined for heaven without having to go through the trial of life to earn their spot. God holds your baby and personally welcomes your baby into heaven. When you die and the desision has to be made whether you should go to heaven or hell, it is said that even if you are destined for the greatest depths of hell, the miscarried baby will drag his mother, by the umbilical cord, into paradise.

Russellbrandshair · 25/01/2020 11:04

*Was it for my own good - so I'd learn from it?
Or because of the original sin of others?

In which case please explain childhood cancer to me*

I cannot explain childhood cancer. I already said that life is suffering. Whoever promised us it wasnt? Who ever said life would be easy and straightforward and we would be happy all the time? Or that bad things would never happen?

We were never promised life wouldn’t be full of shit were we? Your question is why, I’m saying why not? This is what we have right now whether we like it or not. We can only ever control two things in life- what we say and what we do. That’s it. We have no control over anything else at all. So, working on that principle I am suggesting we can either walk a path with or without faith. I respect everyone’s choice. I choose to walk with faith and that brings me comfort. If others choose to be angry at God or a higher power or whatever we think is out there, that is their right and choice to do that and I respect that too. But for me personally, I get comfort from my faith and I choose to believe that over this life just meaning absolutely nothing and us turning into dust.

I had a horrific childhood too btw. But I choose not to spend what time I have left in bitterness and anger because that means they have won. I won’t let the rest of my life be ruined too.

I’m not telling anyone else what to believe- you believe what you want, that’s your journey not mine. But OP specifically asked and that’s what I believe. If you think or feel differently that’s fine, we are all different. I’m just explaining my perspective, I’m not trying to convince anyone of anything- that’s your choice to make.

Russellbrandshair · 25/01/2020 11:08

I also think it’s rather presumptuous to assume people with faith have lived a life of “luxury”. You know nothing whatsoever what I have been through. I don’t need to explain myself to anyone but let’s just say, childhood resembled a horror story so I have certainly not led a fortunate life thus far as you suggest.

OhioOhioOhio · 25/01/2020 11:08

What a fantastic question.

Gliese163 · 25/01/2020 18:03

But we do have a choice- we can look to God to help us through it or we can be angry at a God and suffer more by the way we react to it.

Why are those the only two options?

a12345b · 25/01/2020 18:06

I find it difficult to understand that you have not been practicing, and not sure you even believed (if I understood ur post correrctly) but when smt bad happens your are angry with God. I could maybe see your point if you were practicing but you werent

Russellbrandshair · 25/01/2020 18:44

Why are those the only two options?

They aren’t. I’m not sure why people are taking this so personally. The OP asked about faith and I answered. This is what I believe. I never once said anyone had to agree with me. If you think differently that’s cool. It’s not my place to tell anyone what to believe- you have free choice to think or believe whatever you wish!

LastTrainEast · 25/01/2020 18:59

Russellbrandshair I think some people wonder about the 1000s of children god claims to have murdered personally in the bible.

Not that I think god is real but so many use him as a role model.

GrumpyHoonMain · 02/03/2020 20:51

Life exists in the moment and just the moment. It took me a long time to accept that with my infertility battle (it had a ‘happy ending’ but first baby at 39 means I probably will never be the active grandmother I hoped to be). Contrary to what people might say you do have a choice - you can let your grief consume you or you can move on with resilience. Because that is life - resilience.

PurpleThistles84 · 08/03/2020 12:10

A lot of bad things that happen are either directly or indirectly caused by ours or others actions. Just as we don’t always step in to resolve difficult issues our children experience, God doesn’t always step in either. We let our children experience difficult things because it helps them develop essential life skills that can lead to a happier life overall.

Of course this does not apply to such things we humans have had no hand in. As a Christian, we are not to be worried about earthly problems. It is all about what comes after, living a faithful, obedient life so that we can join Jesus in the Kingdom of Heaven. When children suffer and are taken too soon, whilst it is always heartbreaking, for me I find comfort that those children go to Jesus, as He said, the Kingdom of Heaven is theirs. Where there is no more suffering and pain for them.

As hard as it is, there is necessity in evil. Without it would we really know what peace, happiness, contentment is? We know what they are because we experience suffering. Take for example, childbirth. For most it is painful yet we know what relief and joy is because it follows that pain when our babies are put into our arms. I know that for some, this isn’t the case because their babies may not have made it, instead they are in the arms of Jesus. I have three babies that never made it to labour and it comforts me greatly that they are with Him.

Whilst suffering causes so much trauma, it also causes other things such as deeper relationships, improves resilience and in some cases a much greater appreciation for life itself.

Sometimes I try to imagine a perfect world where pain and suffering is unknown. I wonder what humanity would be like, without the need to rely on others and unable to experience anything other than average emotions because there is never anything to cause extremes of them. I’m not sure if that’s actually a world I would want to live in.

A lot of people that come to Jesus, come to Him during times of terrible suffering. Corrie Ten Book writes in one of her books her shock at finding her sister praying for the guards in their concentration camp, instead of for the end of suffering for herself and her fellow prisoners.

Suffering and evil has also played a huge role in the development of our medical and scientific advancement, we are finding ways to cure or ease suffering all the time. This, of course, would not be necessary in a world without suffering and evil yet it has taught us another emotion we wouldn’t have need of, in this perfect world. Hope. True hope when it feels all is lost.

Finally, as much as it annoys people without faith, it is impossible for us humans to understand God’s reasoning for anything, unless He chooses us to know. Some would say this is a get out clause, however to have Faith is to believe in something that far surpasses humans. Something that can create everything from nothing. It is only logical to state that we cannot apply human thinking to something that is not human.

There has been times of great suffering in my life where I have not understood why these things had to happen. However sometimes years and years later, God has shown me why they had to happen. In many cases it’s been as simple as having had such experiences enabling me to help others going through the same things. One thing in particular, being able to support my daughter in a way I never would have been able to without having had my own suffering. I went from being confused and sad about it to being grateful it had happened, because I could help one of the most important people in the world to me.

PurpleThistles84 · 08/03/2020 12:12
  • Boom not Book.
Hellodotdotdot · 08/03/2020 12:15

God doesn't control people, that's why we have free will. God can't stop those who haven't accepted Him in to their lives from hurting those who have.

This is not my belief, but the explanation from the church I left a few years ago.

Hellodotdotdot · 08/03/2020 12:17

Sorry, my answer is slightly irrelevant to your Q but applies to people who do bad things to others.

Meadowland · 08/03/2020 17:32

@PurpleThistles84. Good post.

4OClockRock · 08/03/2020 19:07

I'm so sorry for your losses. I'm not religious but was also brought up loosely CofE and seem to have kept hold of a vague "everything happens for a reason"/"blessings in disguise" sort of philosophy (not that I would dream of saying that to someone who's suffered seriously like you had you not asked your question).

I run into fewer problems because I'm not invested in believing that there is an entity actively choosing to put me through things but still have a sense (in which I do not logically believe as such!) of ultimately being looked out for and that everything will be ok. I am therefore a chronic "every cloud has a silver lining"-er even when you really have to search or wait for that silver lining (it's a bit of a family joke in situations where you really have to grasp at straws for the positives!)

In your situation all I can think is that perhaps my lovely little missed babies would have had something wrong such that they would have had a very hard, short life had they been born alive to me so that at least this way they are sorted suffering.

I imagine I would try to hold on to the hope of having a baby in time whom I would appreciate all the more for having had to suffer and be patient for them. Perhaps when you have him or her they will go through a particularly challenging phase that you will find the patience for because you will be more hyper-aware than another mother of how lucky you are that they are even here with you.

I don't know. It's all a bit trite but that is probably the Anglican-lite sort of way I would be comforting myself if it is of any help at all.

Again, I'm so sorry for your losses and I'm wishing you all the comfort in the world Flowers

InfiniteCurve · 08/03/2020 21:03

I'm sorry for the situation you are in,OP.I don't think any if this is God's "plan" for you.
Life can be heartbreaking.
I'm agnostic rather than religious these days but my feeling is that the world is fallen,broken.It will be fixed ,but at the moment its broken,and bad things do happen to good people,to everyone. Bad things don't happen to people because they are bad ,or good,but because they are human.Jesus said " in the world you will have tribulation...".
And in my atheist moments I think if I did believe " properly" then what is happening now,however awful it is,would be in the context of eternity.Yes,it's unspeakably shit now and it seems all encompassing but as part of eternity it looks different.

ruralliving19 · 09/03/2020 14:43

No-one here can tell you why God has not intervened to stop your pregnancy loss/pain because none of us are God. It might sound trite, but it isn't meant to. I believe God sees the bigger picture we can't see. If we go to heaven for eternity, then the things that happen in this life are less important in the long run. It doesn't mean He wants us to suffer but equally He never said life would be easy or free of pain. To make it so, He'd have to take away our free will and become a dictator and that is not who He is.
If a miscarriage happens, it is usually because the baby would not have survived - you could see it as God saving the baby suffering rather than giving you suffering if that is helpful. God says all babies go to Heaven. I believe they're waiting for you there and the baby I lost is waiting for me.

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