Christian chat thread continued

[Dutchoma]

A place to share and chat about our funny (and not so funny experiences) in and out of church.
Did anyone say coffee? That would be good

Oh no niminy, sounds very stressful! Hope you can get some rest and relaxation once you arrive!

Niminy - that sounds stressful! Thank goodness they phoned though, otherwise you could have lost out on the holiday.

Oh niminy what a starts to your hols! I hope you are now having fun and rest and all is well.

The funeral mass ended up quite controversial. The priest gave an extraordinary sermon. He knew full well that most of the family are atheist, or lapsed Catholics at best, and took the opportunity to tell them all basically that they are going to hell. It could not have been more inappropriate, or less likely to encourage any of them back to church ever again. Then just before the distribution he said that no-one could receive communion unless they were a practicing Catholic and believed in the sacraments. Three of DP's siblings went up anyway, and of course the priest didn't know them so that was ok, but a nephew was turned away because the priest knew he's not married (although he's the only one to have baptised his baby!). Lots of fuel for the anti-religious sentiment in short.

What an opportunity lost to God. I mean: of course it was inappropriate for people to receive communion when they do not believe, you were quite right in feeling that was wrong. But I have known peope to be 'saved' at a meeting they came to disturb and that happened through the gentleness and welcome of one of the Christians who was there and who came out of the tent where the mission was held and invited them in. I had hoped there might have been a chance like that here.
How is your partner coping? Very difficult for both of you, I suppose

Oh no, Edd. That Priest's approach in the sermon was not appropriate, in my view. And when everyone is so grief stricken too. My condolences to you and your dp.

Today we sang some Graham Kendrick hymns which put me in mind of all of you so I said a prayer for you all and your intentions.

How are you all? I am off in holiday tomorrow, so doing some frantic packing and housework, and downloading the week ahead of pray as you go in the hope that I get the chance to fit it in every day.

I am going on holiday tomorrow as well.

Have a lovely holiday Oma and Broomstick.

Just back from mine, which was wonderful even if it did have a slightly stressful start. I heard a shocker of a sermon at the church I went to on Sunday. At one point I nearly walked out but ended up feeling some admiration for the preacher - who, among other things, tore a strip off the congregation for allowing the previous Vicar to work himself into a breakdown on their behalf. I've never heard anything like it.

We are off to church if I can get off my backside and get breakfast

We're off to church as well. No Eucharist, but 'Trinity Praise'. We were warned when we looked on the church door for the time of the service.

Sounds umm interesting, niminy.
Hope you made it, bes.
Hope Trinity Praise was good, oma.

Our congregation is mainly older people. Today, out of about 30 people, there were 7 under 50s (three of whom were small children). Really struck me today.

Yes, it was quite a good service and we were made very welcome. The service was geared towards children, but there were none. Mainly elderly and quite a few people in mobility scooters, the church was adapted to accommodate them.
Not many people under 50, mainly traditional hymns, one childrens chorus for which the minister donned a guitar.

I'm so delighted this thread is here! I'm shamelessly place marking as I am following the conversation

Oma - that's great the church had been adapted for people in scooters. Lovely to hear about a church that is trying to be inclusive.

It does make me laugh when churches do "all age" worship and gear it specifically to the children.
Esp when there are few or no children present.
I have no problem with them making it more low-brow and accessible, but to make it childish seems silly to me.

I say if you're making a service more accessible to all ages and abilities, choose a hymn with a catchy chorus.
and is the less wordy prayers.

use the less wordy .... that should say.

Made it to church. It was a good service, people wandered in and out at the back as the church is a tourist attraction in the town. Vicar is lovely. She did the children's bit with 4 chn all related and DD. Bought our postcards for a donation. V expensive postcards but not if you throw in the coffee, squash, communion wine, wafers,lights, vicar, electric, etc etc in fact it makes them v cheap postcards.

Oh, Nickel, I hear you about all-age services. But it is so, so difficult to do them well. They take absolutely ages to plan and are often a lot of work to prepare -- and then no families turn up. I have had this happen to me several times. You are left with a service which is planned around children's participation and then no children (or only one or two) come.

And if you are trying (as clergy so often are) to keep several different groups happy (the organist, the music group, the people who want there to be traditional hymns and prayers, the people who always grab you at coffee and complain about this, that and the other), and you are trying to fit the hymns with the theme, and still produce a service which has its own integrity ... it is very, very difficult.

I personally don't equate 'low-brow' with 'accessible'. I think you can do interactive worship that will engage adults of all ages as well as (if there are any) children. I think there are hymns and songs that are simple and catchy. And I think there are forms of liturgy that are beautiful and profound as well as simple. But putting them all together is bloody hard work. And even then it doesn't always work.

I hear you Nickel!
One of my biggest challenges as a cantor is finding music that everyone a) knows, b) likes, c) can join in even if they've never set foot in a church before. Also have to contend with the fairly dismal hymn book we have and the whims of visiting clergy (ahem)

Generally I do OK (why I love call-and-response style prayers) and we're lucky in having a fairly easy congregation to read - if you sing Be Thou My Vision you'll have 75% of the congregation belting it out anyway - but it's a fine line to tread. My choice is probably a bit middle-of-the-road (trad-but-happy?) but seems to keep most people happy enough.

One chap tried to introduce some more complicated worship songs once, which didn't really work - particularly when nobody knew the words, the wheezy organ struggled to keep up and the range of some of them was quite challenging without a full band.
I do find it as odd singing about "mustn't forget to say a great big thank you for Mum and Dad" as I would hearing eight year olds singing "by my sins have I deserved death and endless miserie" (that one always makes me giggle uncontrollably)

It's been a nice couple of weeks at church. We had a new visiting priest last week who was wonderful - the first time in months I've gone to Mass and come back feeling refreshed. He's staying for another two weeks :)

I take my children to a Unitarian church that does really good all-age worship, but that's probably at least partly because of the flexible and open minded-ness of the congregation.

There is usually a "story for all ages" which is in simple language but with with lots of symbolism. Children can come up and sit on cushions for the story, or help act it out. Sometimes children will read out a poem or prayer along with adults. The sermon will relate to the story. The will be some sort of craft of moving about activity. Ones I can think of have been bringing something to symbolise home and sharing that, writing our favourite words on leaves to hang from a tree, packing welcome bags for refugees, picking a pretty stone or shell and using it to help focus for medication and taking it home, making poppies/St Brigid's crosses/ daffodils etc, bringing up donations for the service for homeless people run by the neighbouring Methodist church and offering prayers and thinking of what else we çan do to help.

Oh yes, I totally agree - doing something new and different is always difficult to pull off - that's why dh was so good at his job as DoM, because he'd done it for so long and had honed it to perfection.

There are loads of decent hymns that are accessible to everyone without dumbing down - that's why I suggested ones with choruses - those capable of reading and singing can do the whole thing and those who can't (or can't yet) can still join in because the choruses are repeated every time.
But music us where my "expertise" ends. I wouldn't really know how to make the spoken parts or the prayers or the silent bits work for everyone.

Back from NZ. No all-age worship for me this weekend - just a 40 hour plane journey!

I confess that I sometimes mind less if I miss the first Sunday of the month (the all age service round our way) than I do other weeks but I'm getting more used to it, and more appreciative of the vicar's effort in putting it together too. I am still hoping to somehow get my DC to come to church now and again, and since they will not go to Sunday school I think the all-age service is probably the one to aim for - but I won't hold my breath!

When the DCs were younger I found all age services could be really tricky. Toddlers just don't want to sit still for an hour and a bit and it could be exhausting trying to keep them under control during the second half of the service.

Oh yes I'm sure! Mine are 10-14. They have been brought up without church, are atheists if they are anything, and think church is boring. DS has been a few times by necessity, the DDs hardly at all - Christmas carol service, that kind of thing.
They can make their own minds up of course but I'd like them to know more about my faith because it's important to me. Don't really know how to go about that though; feel like I missed the boat. The kids in church who engage best are all aged 5-9 kind of thing and brought up to go.

Keep praying ed keep praying. DD definitely believes at the moment Ds may do. Difficult to tell.