Choirs, worship songs, after service coffee - the all new religion chat thread

[niminypiminy]

A new place for us to share the lovely, silly and annoying things that happen in church life and share our great love of Graham Kendrick.

I quite like meekness and majesty for it. We've got our all age the 8th as well, though Dh sorts the music for our music group thankfully

Three kings from Persian Lands Afar would work well with a worship band i reckon.

I'll have a think though, I know some

Or Or (dd seems to like this one) Or Torches

Good grief, Nickel

I love the unspeakable joy version of Joy to the World

Sorry Oma.

Epiphany related worship songs.

Light of the world even though I know it's a bit over done!

In the bleak midwinter. Traditional but hauntingly beautiful.

Oceans (you call me out upon the water) might work? More about the journey, but keeping eyes above the waves and firmly onto Jesus/comparing that to keeping eyes on the star?

Thanks everyone for your suggestions. I think Wise Men by Alan Krebiehl (bingo! Nickel) will work well in the service we have planned with the theme of wise and foolish journeys.

No.probs

In other news.
Have just seen this on twitter.
York Minster has cancelled evensong tonight because there'sa power cut and it's not safe for the public.
Apparently, it's not safe to admit the public in just candlelight!

I personally think if it's not safe to admit the public in candlelight, then maybe they should be thinking about how safe the cathedral is at all!
Not candles, then why not send the verger down to the pound shop to buy 20 packs of battery operated fairylights for the paths!
What a load of shit.

Wasn't it also not York Minster where they sacked all the bell ringers? If so then they have a bigger problem than a simple power cut.

Yes.
Although recent news has revealed that one ringer (might have been a leader) was being accused of abuse of a minor, but I know the judge said no sanctions, which sounds to me like he was cleared. However, it appears that they sacked him anyway and the others protested, so they sacked all of them.
I don't know how true that is, but "safeguarding" was their ultimate decision maker.

Sounds like this might be a panic reaction just in case...

Do they have a bit of a risk aversion?

The impression I got re bell ringers was a reluctance from the group as a whole to comply with child protection procedures. We had a situation where a children's group leader, while not accused of any misbehaviour, was too old fashioned to see the need of CP and would let random volunteers help at sleep overs with no CRB etc. He'd been doing it for years with no problems, so couldn't see why he should. Thing is, good procedures protect the adults from false accusations as well as the children.

Feeling a bit torn this year. My DF is terminally ill, so I have been released from church duties to leave me free to visit him whenever I need to, which is lovely. It's also lovely to not need to worry about preparing anything. But, but... It's Christmas, and I've done loads every year, and it isn't the same without it... I'll go to the crib service tomorrow, but I've never been to one I haven't led. Silly of me, I know.

plkme is right re the bell ringers. The Church of England now has very stringent rules re child/vulnerable adult protection and they are not voluntary. DS2 learns bell ringing and there are standard CP procedures that all bell ringing teams have to comply with, plus I think York Minster has probably been tightening up on DBS requirements for all its volunteers. Faced with a choice between complying with safeguarding procedures and having that team ringing the bells the dean and chapter probably had no choice but to go with safeguarding. And, of course, they aren't free to talk about the issue, because there is a safeguarding issue that must stay confidential.

plkme that sounds sad in all sorts of ways. Praying for you, your DF and your family.

Thank you. A time for everything and all that...

This is what I fiund in the grauniad

We had a thing about the safeguarding and dbs at church, too.
It was concluded (with advice from diocese) that only actual leaders needed a dbs check, eg in the choir, only me, dh, CM and asst organist needed it.
The idea being that none of the others would ever need to be alone with juniors.
But this was because of the fuss kicked up by older ex-teacher when the crb checks first started, that they had every adult choir member get one.

(The fact that they never did any actual safeguarding training with anybody in the church is by-the-by)

Plkme .
Sorry your dad's ill :(
I hope you can find a bit of peace being in.the congregation - I also am struggling with not being a major contributor, but we have to hope the bigger picture is worth it.
Enjoy time with your dad, if you get the chance

Bell ringing is a particular issue though because the bell ringing chamber can't be seen from outside - anything could be happening up there. AFAIK all those who teach bell ringing have to have a DBS and there has to be someone there with a DBS when a child is ringing - and, of course, there must be at least two adults there if a child is present.

nickel all the helpers in our children's activities have to be checked, not just leaders.

If I go back a long way in my far far past... Isn't it quite hands on? I was taught by my dad, and I think he stood behind me with his arms around me as we both held the rope.

Thank you for the kind thoughts, Nickel and niminy.

amammabear yes, helpers, but not members.
So, that's why the whole choir didn't need it, only the ones leading. Most of them had church dbs anyway because they did other duties, which meant they could also help in junior choir if required. But the ones who only sing don't need it.
Like, with messy church, anyone on the messy church team had to have the dbs, which is easier to explain.

Teaching is different from just being a ringer.
I do see what you mean about it being more closes though when they are doing their job.