Choirs, worship songs, after service coffee - the all new religion chat thread

[niminypiminy]

A new place for us to share the lovely, silly and annoying things that happen in church life and share our great love of Graham Kendrick.

Thanks for the Rowan Williams suggestions :)

Niminy - it's is a strange time, I remember dh going through it, people don't always appreciate that it's just as big if not bigger than the initial ordination. Love and prayers. Where are you being priested? (my autocorrect wanted to put priestess there) - just as I'm going to my brothers priesting somewhere down that way ish at beginning of July.

Oma - hope talk with the elder goes well.

Nickel, great to see you, sorry things are still hard :( I do hope you find somewhere to settle soon. Do you think the card was trying to build bridges at all? I can see though how it made you feel crappy :(

Edd, not sure I have you on twitter? I've neglected my personal twitter account lately as I have four work accounts to run....

Thanks for lovely encouraging words about my book. Nickel I am definitely contemplating self publishing, I can do it myself for free so it's easy to do, just hate the marketing side.

MHD, can you explain that to those of us who don't know? I've been to both, I think, but can't remember the difference.

The meeting with the Elder of the church went very well. I thought he would not like to hear what I had to say, but in fact we were very much in the same place and I felt very much appreciated and loved by him. I don't expect things will change very much at the church for me to make it more possible for me to attend.

That's a shame, Oma. What would you like to see change? Can you share? I find church life tricky at times. I left rather abruptly on Sunday after some tension between church members that I found dificult.

Oh, Oma that's rubbish if even the Elder's don't like the theology . But glad that you felt loved and appreciated, even if you're still church-less.

As greenheart and MHD say being ordained priest is as big a deal as being ordained deacon, if not more. So, the difference is that once you're priested you can preside at the Eucharist, you can say the words of absolution, you can bless people, you can anoint them and you can marry them. But it's more than just a list of things that you can do. There's something so awesome (in the original sense) in the sacraments, and in what God does through you at the Eucharist. The thought of that gives me collywobbles!

But family and friends (especially non-Christian ones) can't understand why I have to go through the whole thing again, surely I've already been ordained enough for one lifetime! But the truth is that there is a real difference between being a deacon and being a priest (even though you're always a deacon even when you're a priest) and even though I'd thought about that before I was ordained I'm much more conscious of it now.

Anwyay, what happens at a priesting is that when the bishop lays her or his hands on your head the priests who are present all come and either lay their hands on you or on you through the others. It's an amazing moment.

Health warning - this is all CofE stuff. In independent churches, Baptist and Methodist churches it's all different. And even some more Evangelical churches within the CofE won't make that much of it because preaching is more important than sacraments.

PS the actual day is 1 July.

Niminy that's a fab explanation, thank you. I should have known, but misremembered.

I'm so glad you got to talk to him Oma
it's a ahame it didn't lead to anything positive.

No bridges mhd - just the usual not acknowledging the issue.
I did say to Dh that I'm glad we weren't in when it was dropped round - I would be hard pressed to keep a civil tongue.

I think it's wonderful niminy and you describe it so lovelylylyly.

Hi folks :-) eek lots going on for everyone!
Niminy gosh that's not long until your priesting!!! Life changing stuff!

mhd that's good news about your book :-)

Oma, glad your meeting went well but sorry you don't expect things to change at church.

Nickel, sorry to hear about that card, poor taste. I share your pain re Shine Jesus Shine lol.

pickle sorry about the church tension. There's a particular service I want to do at a particular time and have been told I can't because one churchwarden doesn't like that style of service, so not impressed by church tensions myself atm!

edd you are good doing the thykingdomcome stuff. I am rubbish at keeping up with it all.

I have been reading the 'Boundaries' book everyone recommended though. Very good, though being a 20th century book it seemed to view smacking as suitable punishment sometimes... a bit unmumsnetty!

All ok here. Continuing miffedness at my vicar's difficulty in supporting me at the moment. Keep telling myself it's not me, it's her.
Saw my SD again though, finally, which was good. Talking helps.

Niminy my brother's is that date too ... Fb me where you are being priested!!

Btw love your explanation, how gorgeous :)

Both the Elder and I feel that you cannot say to people: become a Christian/accept Jesus or go to hell if you don't. We both struggled with loved ones who died without accepting the gospel and we both had to trust God that He would the best He could for our loved ones (my brother, his father). Neither of us believes in hell. I would like to see the theology of the church broaden out, be more accepting and less condemnatory.
Also much quieter in its worship.

Ah, yes. That one. I've had a conversation along those lines.
Our church leaders have a range of understandings. We tend to preach a range of perspectives, and expect people to make up their own minds. Our preaching is about individuals growing their relationship and extending its impact on their life, rather than telling people what to believe. The controversial areas get chewed over in home groups as a discussion, not as instruction.
Perhaps it comes across as wishy washy to people used to more determined leadership.

I think your leadership have got it right Picklemepopcorn in presenting a range of options.

I have difficulty in standing behind a judgmental attitude and was glad that at least one member of the leadership team understood that.

I don't really understand very rigid religious teaching.
The nature of faith, the core of our belief...so much is interpretation. How can one denomination or even faith, announce a whole developed theology as 'fact'?

Have I expressed myself reasonably there? I just mean, surely we are all grasping toward a truth glimpsed down the ages through tradition and revelation, rather than having an incontrovertible map.

"So much is interpretation". Yes, and interpretation coloured by a barely understood culture and 20 centuries of history. So much of the Bible is misinterpreted (have you ever googled Levitical questions to Dr Laura? That will teach you to take the Bible literally), so much has grown out of a desire for power, male domination, the list is very long.
And yet, when I think about Jesus my heart fills with love and I could not possibly abandon Him.

I'm really sorry that you are having this experience, Oma. My view is that in questioning dogmatic rules which cause suffering you are not abandoning Jesus in the slightest, but embracing Him closer. My rule of thumb is that if ever you find yourself having to choose between religion on one side and love and justice on the other, it's a false choice because where there is is love and justice is where you will find God's work.

Indeed.

double I'm sorry your church is being so backward thinking - churchwardens really do need to buck their ideas up!

oma that sucks :(
I don't believe in hell either, so I'm with you there

I love the way you put that, Broomstick

Thanks nickel!
Are folk having a good week?
Dh and I got to sing an entire hymn on Sunday (the same hymn) without dd mucking about/running away/whining for a biscuit! It was wonderful

I saw my SD last week - every time I see him I leave beaming. Which is good because there are plenty of stresses in my life atm - DM, DP, DD1, work - i.e. The usual stuff.
Church is my happy place. I never don't enjoy it, probably spend about 4 hours a week there now. How things change, eh?
So glad to hear you had a good one last week Double.

mhd how are your lungs? Hope you are on the mend?

broomstick beautifully put.

That's made me smile, Edd. How wonderful

Lungs are... Carrying on, I guess! This bacteria is being blitzed with v strong abs which makes me spaced out and exhausted, so I'm a little grumpy at the minute. But hopeful it'll leave the building.

Niminy my husband is being preisted the same day as you. I hope the day is wonderful.