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Original poster

Is the Christian God's love unconditional?

902 replies

Woolmark · 20/11/2013 19:57

Ok, some questions which have been playing on my mind, I am genuinely interested.

Surely his love is on the condition that you are a) a Christian and b) follow his rules?

Also, if God loves everyone as much as he does, why can't he save everyone by simply appearing to them? If I could save my children by doing this then I would in an instant, rather than turning up at the end and destroying the ones who weren't Christian.

OP posts:
BackOnlyBriefly · 28/11/2013 18:39

but capsium if preventing crimes doesn't interfere with free will why won't god prevent crimes?

capsium · 28/11/2013 18:47

Back Because we also have Dominion.

capsium · 28/11/2013 19:02

And how do you know He hasn't prevented crimes in some instances? Some people might be warned, some people might be put off... You would not necessarily hear about it.

I actually came very close to something. Some one followed me home (I didn't know) and knocked on the door, tried to talk their way into my house. However we were interrupted by another person at an opportune moment which distracted him and I shut the door in his face. And doubly locked it. And phoned DH.

capsium · 28/11/2013 19:05

As I said before, God works through the people that choose to follow His will.

BackOnlyBriefly · 28/11/2013 19:06

So the suffering on earth that god allows has nothing to do with Free Will after all?

'Free Will' has been a standard reason given by a lot of people. Even you have used it.

BackOnlyBriefly · 28/11/2013 19:09

ok let's be specific. In the news right now.

Liam Adams, a brother of Sinn Féin's Gerry Adams, has been jailed for 16 years for raping and abusing his daughter.

Why didn't god stop him. Was it because that would interfere with his free will or some other reason.

HettiePetal · 28/11/2013 19:16

And how do you know He hasn't prevented crimes in some instances?

And how on earth do you know that he has? How very convenient for God - shirks the blame for the bad stuff (free will) & gets the credit for when bad stuff doesn't happen Hmm

God can't lose, can he?

I'm really glad that you were OK when you were followed home, capsium - but isn't it a trifle arrogant to assume that God decided to save you and not another woman who, in some part of the world, was probably being attacked at that very moment?

What's so special about you, exactly? You're a member of God's gang?

capsium · 28/11/2013 19:34

What's so special about you, exactly? You're a member of God's gang?

That is about the size of it because I'm pretty ordinary really.

Why didn't god stop him. Was it because that would interfere with his free will or some other reason.

I don't know. Only God knows. His ways are higher than ours.

All I know is what I've already told you with regards to this subject. It is enough to satisfy me. I don't know why trusting in God and having Faith is deemed arrogant, but if it is I am guilty as charged.

BackOnlyBriefly · 28/11/2013 19:37

Capsium if you are content not to have any idea what god is or does that is fair enough, but to be fair to us you have been telling us about him as though you knew certain things. That he was good and so on.

HettiePetal · 28/11/2013 19:41

Christians get raped and attacked, don't they? Remember lovely, brave Jill Saward?

What happened there? Wasn't God looking?

Belief & faith are not arrogant. Believing that the creator of the universe has a special eye on you & cares less about the sufferings of others than he does about yours........yeah, I think that fits my definition of arrogant. And, of course, completely deluded.

headinhands · 28/11/2013 19:43

See if I had a friend who I thought was really nice, who had done really nice stuff for me, but found out he walked past a woman getting raped or a child being attacked and did nothing because 'they weren't his friend'. No, he wouldn't be nice. That's not kind. People who do that have really serious personality disorders.

headinhands · 28/11/2013 19:45

What about the Christian women who do get raped? I almost don't want to hear the answer to this...

headinhands · 28/11/2013 19:45

X post with hettie

capsium · 28/11/2013 20:24

I only know what I know. Which is not the definitive answer to all your questions, Hettie and head.

capsium · 28/11/2013 20:27

I suspect even if I had the definitive answer to your questions Hettie and head it would not be satisfactory...

You both have made up your minds, have you not? Both remain atheists?

Golddigger · 28/11/2013 20:28

I am morally superior to God
You have got to be kidding me!

Golddigger · 28/11/2013 20:30

Back. God can stop a murderer, and can stop starvation.
How do you know that he doesnt do that every day of the week???

headinhands · 28/11/2013 20:35

Gold why would it pain you to read and write what you did? Your well developed sense of right and wrong caused you discomfort. So what's going on here? Either your sense of right and wrong is more sensitive and sophisticated than what you imagine gods to be or what exactly?

HettiePetal · 28/11/2013 20:38

Made up our minds about what?

I have no idea whether there's any kind of god or not.

I've made up my mind that a) to date there's no sensible evidence suggesting it and b) none of the theistic arguments make the slightest sense whatsoever & are therefore very unlikely to be true.

I am an atheist BECAUSE I'm a sceptic. My position on god is the same as it is for ghosts. Show me the evidence & I'll change my mind. I'm just not willing to deny reality to believe whatever it suits me to believe.

Is that what you mean by making up my mind?

Golddigger · 28/11/2013 20:41

It says somewhere in the bible that some people when in heavan are going to see hell and want to either join, or rescue people. I cant remember which. Will have to look it up.
So I dont think I am being unreasonable in being sensitive to others pain and discomfort and worse.

God can see into peoples hearts. And He does and will judge. He will see a lot more evil, and in other cases, a lot more good than we can see.

HettiePetal · 28/11/2013 20:42

How do you know that he doesnt do that every day of the week???

This has to be a joke, surely to goodness!

How do you know, or even manage to suspect, that he does?

If something hasn't happened, it hasn't happened! You can't conclude anything about something that, er, hasn't happened.

I didn't have a heart attack today. Man, God's on form, isn't he?! The poor sod who died of one a few minutes ago, though.....not on God's happy list today :(

This is one of the reasons I'm an atheist. The arguments theists use are so comically bad, they can't possibly be right.

capsium · 28/11/2013 20:44

Part of being a Christian is having Faith, not being sceptical though. The two don't mix.

HettiePetal · 28/11/2013 20:48

Gullibility is not something to be proud of. A God who demands that is not worthy of my regard, let alone my worship.

Always be sceptical, capsium. You shame your intelligence by not being.

Golddigger · 28/11/2013 20:49

I cant see how we can or cant know one way or the other.
How do we have a clue whether there would be a whole heap more of murders worldwide.

I did read in the bible somewhere recently that God stops wars.

Also, how do we know that there wouldnt be mass starvation in many countries.
There soon would be starvation worldwide if God stopped the rains.

[He has done that in history. [God if you are reading this, I dont want you to do that!]]

capsium · 28/11/2013 20:51

Pride is not a quality to admire. Humility is far better.

Gullibility is not the same as Faith.