Is it ok to tell young adult DC to leave home?

[Mixey]

Eldest DS is 20. Just finishing an apprenticeship with a guaranteed job at the end of it, and earns a good wage for his age.

He lives at home but acts like he's not part of the family. He doesn't speak to the rest of us unless spoken to. Comes and goes without advance notice so I never know when to cater for him at mealtimes etc. Stays in his room all the time, only comes out for meals (if he's here when they're served). Never helps with any chores. I have laid down ground rules and issued chores but I get fed up of constantly nagging/reminding, often to be told he "can't do it now as going out" and says he'll do it later/tomorrow, but of course he doesn't.

He says he wants to leave home but doesn't seem to be making a sincere effort to move out. He hasn't saved any money over the 3 years he's been working, just blown it all on going out, clothes, recreational drugs :(

On a day to day basis he doesn't cause a lot of trouble apart from his dismissive attitude and leaving mess in the kitchen and bathroom (he doesn't clean or tidy up after himself ever). But if we pull him up on his attitude or not cleaning up after himself, he often loses his temper and storms off. He has on several occasions thrown things at the walls, causing damage.

I did tell him a few months ago that while he's living here he has to follow the family rules, treat others with respect, clean up after himself etc, and if he doesn't like it then he should find somewhere else to live. He got upset and his attitude improved ever so slightly for a while, but he still made no effort to do his assigned chores, and now it seems we're back to square one.

I'm now thinking of giving him a deadline to move out. Is this cruel and will it destroy our relationship permanently? I can just see him interpreting it as his heartless parents unreasonably kicking him out, and since he avoids us most of the time he is generally no trouble, but I'm fed up of living with someone who barely speaks to me yet still expects me to wash up his coffee cups that he dumps by the sink.

Doesn't seem too much wrong here tbh. Certainly not a kicking out scenario. If he is being taken on post apprenticeship he must be showing responsibility and worth to his employers. Holding down 50hours a week is some commitment.
I assume he is contributing fairly to the household from his wages, so just cut him some slack and allow him his space as another adult in the home.
If he isn't there for meals just plate his up for later. What 'chores' do you think he should be doing? Are they really essential or just because?
The disrespect is another issue entirely. Sounds like this may come from frustration. A calm conversation may unearth the reasons for that.
I'm with you on cooking late at night. Big no no for the rest of the family. Microwave meals could be his late night snack answer!
Good Luck OP, he doesn't sound a bad lad at all.

Thanks, some very helpful replies here. @Meadowwild and @sianihedgehog thanks for your very considered advice.

He does pay a small amount of rent.

I have not had the opportunity for a proper chat with him yet but things have been more positive the past couple of days - he has been offered a room in a house share. Although he doesn't know exactly when the room will be available, it sounds like it should be soon. I must say that feels like a big relief. I do love him of course, but absolutely agree it's time for him to go and learn to be a proper adult.

The temper outbursts are not frequent, and he doesn't behave like that to anyone outside the home. I agree we are probably sick of each other!

A couple of posters have mentioned the drug use, I do not condone this at all - I made it very clear that was unacceptable. He didn't do it at home anyway, apart from one occasion when we came home and could smell weed - I had stern words that I wouldn't tolerate that in the house. I haven't seen (or smelled!) any evidence of it since but I just can't understand where all his money goes!

He also cooked dinner for the rest of the family one evening - I had to ask but he did it with no fuss and on time. He's supposed to cook once a week anyway, but when he's not working late he tends to go out so usually just doesn't do it!

Can't imagine having a child (my choice) then getting to a certain age and not want to do anything for them and wanting them out... I want my kids to always feel welcome and looked after in my/there home. Isn't an age limit of when you stop being a parent.

Indeed. However I don't agree that telling him he needs to leave home and supporting him to get into an independent living situation is "wrapping him in cotton wool". I just don't think that palming off the problem onto other people his age who are just trying to live their lives is the way forward, either.

He would be better off living alone for a bit to get used to adult life and independence, before considering moving in with flatmates.

If he lives independently for a bit, he will have straightforward natural consequences and only himself to blame when he has no clean mugs, and no one will have to put up with his slamming doors and emotional immaturity.

Once he's grown up a tiny bit, then maybe look for a house share.

Could you approach it in a way that explains that a family works like a team and he’s not acting like part of the team. I think this is more inspiring than “our roof, our rules”.

OP he's a grown man with a good wage treating you intolerably in your own home. Give him a date to move out by and stick to it.

i am glad the situation is being resolved with a flat share
teach him to use the washing machine for a start.as well as how to budget

I was a reckless teen, didn’t care about my dads house or rules was out all hours with all kinds people heavily involved in drugs and drink. He told me one day don’t come back and he would lock the door. I had absolutely no respect whatsoever but now at 32 I’ve realised that tough love worked because I got my shit together. Don’t pussyfoot around him.

This.

But at some point he's going to be a husband and a father are we going to be seeing his spouse in a few years asking what she is supposed to do because he's useless comes in and lounges about , has a nap , never helps with housework and when challenged he gets aggressive ??? This needs sorting and quickly I'd ask him to leave he's an adult if he can't follow the rules of the house he goes elsewhere

As he’s starting full time work sit down and discuss his rent. Charge him rent if he’s earning more than you.

If the behaviour continues then give him all the collated rent as “suprise, we have saved it for you as a deposit for a rental….”

He should be using this time to save an extremely large portion of his income. If he isn’t capable of doing that independently, then he needs to give you the money to save for him as a condition of continuing to live in your home.

He will never have this opportunity again and he is squandering it.

Is he paying rent?

Charge him rent and a 'chores supplement'? So he pays you are the start of the month, if he has completed chores he gets the supplement back.

He sounds like he has some growing up to do which ultimately he can’t do at home. Living with others (not his family) will force the behavioural change and help him recognise actions affect others etc.

Can you lock the kitchen? I know someone who did this for this very reason

Put your big girl pants on, tell him his behaviour is unacceptable, and set the rules. Sit down with him and agree what he will be doing in the house (absolute bare minimum that he cleans up after himself, and if he eats the family means he takes a turn in cooking them). And work out what he’s actually costing you to live there (bills and food), so he lays that, plus a decent amount of rent. You could then save some of the rent that’s above what you actually need from him and give it back in the form of a deposit. Then keep on and on and on at him to ensure he sticks to his side.

if friend came to you with this problem what would you say? The other thing I’m getting from your posts is that you’re making excuses for him and he won’t be stupid. You also don’t have the backing of his dad. Your all grown ups, sit down and talk to him treat him like one and if he doesn’t respond well then you both have to decide what the best way forward is…

That is not unreasonable

does he pay you rent? If not start by setting it at market rate to rent a room and tell him that’s the agreement and if he doesn’t like it then it will cost him the same to rent a room with strangers.

my while life (including moving back home mid 20s) was mums house, mums rules and font like it move out! I’m already setting the scene for this with my 13 year old!

It's not stereotyping it's evident moron.

Kiddo needs to move out and grow up! Yes kick him out. Give him three months notice.

50 hour week is NOTHING he can do chores then nap.

And just tell him it’s part of growing up. You’ve nursed him to 20, times to fly.

Are you sure he isn’t having mental health issues and/or addiction problems? His behaviour, as described, seems to be more than just teenage angst. Staying in his room, procrastinating (not doing chores) getting angry etc. I’m no expert but it sounds to me as though he is, at the very least, depressed. Maybe instead of trying to get him to do chores try to find out what’s wrong? I think asking him to move out could be potentially devastating. Sounds like the last thing he needs is to be left alone right now. I hope you and your family sort things out x