Daughter shocked me

[Annie1955]

My adult daughter who is 33 married and lives in Hong Kong for last 7 years has told me that all we did through her childhood was row and that her father was never there. This has come as a bit of a shock, not the rowing, which was not all the time, yes of course it happened, no excuse but we went through a lot of financial difficulties from losing half the value of our property to the interest rates going up to 15%, this was back in the early 90s. We nearly lost our home but thanks to my mum we held on. Then again in 2008 financial crash my husband lost his job as he's in hospitality and didn't work for another 14 months, we nearly lost our house again, paying for our mortgage on credit cards etc etc. I was working but my salary didn't cover everything.

She never ever gave any inclination that there were any issues until a couple of years ago she started distancing herself as I was always very close to her, at least that's how I felt. We went to HK in April, first time since 2019, and I could feel she was just trying too hard and I noticed that sometimes when my husband was speaking she would roll her eyes. I obviously didn't mention it at the time as it may have just escalated.
Once back I spoke to her and she then told me that her father was always away, well he did have to work and people in hospitality do long hours. She then said its taken her years to realise that having a family that rows consistently is not the norm. I understand that we all see things differently but it's really hit me hard and don't know how this can be resolved at all. I feel awful if this has caused her issues but she always seemed such a happy child. I'm so sad.

Coming from a large family that never rowed I can see her point. Now my hubby and his sister wow that family rowed and it's horrible being in between and hearing it all. Luckily hubby hasn't brought that with him

I don't think it's harmful to consider how even ordinary childhoods could have their ups and downs. If it helps us heal then I see no harm in it. We none of us are perfect, true, but because of that, that means we have all been wounded or damaged. It is just on a spectrum , some hurts are more extreme than others. If something needs help, best tend to it.

That said I do think we need to be careful how we confront or not, our parents. Often it's best not to talk to them about it at all and seek therapy instead or talk to a friend. Whatever helps us heal.

Learning to see my family as dysfunctional and myself as traumatised has helped me set better boundaries with my parents and other people and hate myself less. It has also helped me relate better to others in bad situations, I feel a bit more like I could empathise with someone who had a bad time of it. I have friends who have been raped and trafficked and beaten as children and I think I would not have really understood had I not looked at my less than ideal 80s childhood and set to fix the damage.

@Calmdown14 100% agree and i know i could use therapy for some serious trauma caused to me by my young adults (when they were 15-25) ten very very rough years that caused terrible rows (by the way i honestly thought this was rowing as in the sport when i first read the OP).
i wonder if it would be helpful for them to understand the full impact of their selfishness at a time when they are suppose to be "adults".

OP, you say: "I understand that we all see things differently but it's really hit me hard and don't know how this can be resolved at all."

If these feelings and perspectives are just coming up for her now, take heart in the fact that she feels able to tell you about them.

This is the first step, not the last.

Look at it as starting to lay the jigsaw puzzle pieces out on the table – they're all messy, some of them are upside down, nothing's put together yet.

But she's sharing what she's feeling, which says a lot already about the relationship you have. Many families don't have the room to even say these things. That's a good thing, not a bad thing.

If I might offer some suggestions...

Ask her questions - not "don't you remember X?" or "but don't you realise that Y?", but "what was that like for you?". "How is that impacting you now?"

Help her get it all out. It will be hard for you to hear, and sometimes she'll say things that don't tally with how you remember them, but remember that the memories she's sharing are the memories of a child, whose brain wasn't wired to see things the way an adult would.

You don't have to apologise for how you parented, but you can validate her experience of it and help her make sense of it – safe in the knowledge that as a child, her experience was limited to the experience of a child.

Then, switch your focus to now.

Let her know how much you want to have a good relationship with her now, and ask what she needs to make sure things are OK from now on.

None of this means what you experienced or did was wrong – you're not putting yourself on trial. You're just making room for her to work out what she's working out, and letting her know you're not going anywhere.

If you need to process what she's saying for yourself, do that too – but more than anything, keep your focus on your relationship now and in the future. She wouldn't be telling you these things if she didn't care how things turned out.

I always try to remember that a complaint is a wish in disguise.

My hunch would be that she's telling you these things because she wishes things were easier between you – keep that first in your heart.

A lot of people go to HK, buy into the fake ‘Asian family values’ culture that permeates through the expat community there. It’s very possible her DH, after a few arguments, is comparing her to how he believes other couples behave and she has rewritten her past to blame you. If you truly believe there wasn’t a problem them just chalk it up to her re-writing history.

@natura you have no way of knowing her wish has anything to do with the mother daughter relationship vs a vent due to another struggle be it partner/work or finances and blaming her mother.
her "sharing" is equally sharing the burden and hurt something it appears she needs to work through.

Agree , we had similar problems with our daughter she soon realised that therapy was showing her ways to manipulate situations and people to get attention to the extent that we had to distance ourselves from her .

You're perfectly right, I don't. But what difference does it make? Whatever the ultimate source, it's coming out this way, she needs to talk it through, and she feels safe enough to raise it with her mother.

Maybe it turns out, by talking it through, that it IS something to do with another struggle. Great.

But making it an 'I'm right, you're wrong' conversation, rather than a 'tell me more, let's work this out together' only has one potential conclusion, and it's not a positive one.

@SGsling Thank you for the link..it's very insightful

@abyssinianrosette yes about the amygdala...can cause someone to have deeper feelings than average. I've read somewhere that people with deeper feelings have a larger amygdala ...they can't 'get over' their feelings that the average person is able to brush away.
It's pretty fascinating and answers many questions as to why some react the way they do. It has to do with an extra amount of collagen is their body (amygdala) . There are many manifestations of this condition...the worse being 'Ehlers Danlos syndrome '

@Annie1955 I didn't mean to derail your thread, but possibly your daughter has the feelings she has because of some minor aspects of this syndrome. My family members who have big emotions have several characteristics of extra collegen production but not full blown Ehler s Danlos....finding this out has helped me tremendously to deal with my hurt from how family members remember their childhood.
And @SGsling article is helpful in giving me the words to validate these family member's feelings as I suffer from a language based learning disability and when conforted with FM's truths I couldnt come up with a thing to say...my mind just froze when they were just looking for some kind words of validation

what triggered her going to a therapist? it sounds to me like she had a decent childhood and you were good parents, god if all we had to moan about was our parents arguing a lot then it's not much. it's always easiest to blame the parents and childhood and I think it's an easy solution for the therapist too. I'm saying that as someone who had a very difficult childhood but I also take responsibility for myself and don't go blaming everything that goes wrong in my life on my parents/childhood.

@Sweetpea1532 it might be that I have that condition then! I do have BPD/EUPD diagnosis and they say that makes people hypersensitive . Don't know about more collagen, I am double jointed and have stretch marks so possibly I have more than average , I have heard those things are linked to collagen. My mother has diagnosis of soft tissue disorder, her ankle joint is very weak and like me she is very flexible

Maybe the daughter is a drama queen or has been encouraged to generate misleading memories by her therapist. Having feelings or beliefs doesn't entitle you to unquestioning agreement. If someone is talking nonsense they need to hear it.

Maybe. Two big speculations for which there's zero evidence tho.

I also didn't see anything from the OP to say her DD is looking for 'unquestioning agreement'.

Nor is it the case that DD is talking 'nonsense'. The core facts are correct. There were rows & difficulties in her childhood. They may disagree over the extent but OP agrees this was the case.

All OP needs to do is listen & be receptive. She doesn't need to agree with any version of events, just hear her DD's experience.

So much reaching going on here.

And you really really don't sound like a nice person.

What a horrible post.

@abyssinianrosette

I'm sorry for all you've experienced & glad you've been able to address it to an extent.

You make very good points.

I guess that's what the OP's daughter is doing and fair play to her! Fair play to both of you for addressing these issues. I know how hard it can be to face them.

hoping that both you and the OP's daughter find healing. And the OP herself can forgive herself for any mistakes or perceived mistakes on her part.

Thank you so much. I appreciate that.

I found reading Dr Bessel Van Der Kolk's book The Body Keeps The Score very interesting about how conflict in families can affect the brain and limbic system.

Therapy often shines a light on the reason why a person may be experiencing any difficulties - they may not know the why but that doesn’t mean an absence of issues.

OP - hopefully with continued therapy, she will develop self compassion and compassion for you and your husband - you did the best you could. Right now she may be going through the motions and feelings of resentment etc. She will hopefully move forward.

@abyssinianrosette Yes! Everything you've mentioned is a symptom! My MIL could do back bend at age 76 and she wasn't a gymnast and she was quite overweight! Her skin was peachy and felt like butter.
Also the ankles thing is a very common trait.

Fuck sake. Shes 33. She's been an adult for decades. Her feelings are valid. But certainly no more valid than yours. Her memories are no more likely to be an honest recollection than yours are. You are both adults. You both have as much right to be happy. Why is she inflicting her truth on you and expecting you to validate it when it was not your experience? If she has stuff she wants to explore that isn't your responsibility.

Agree 100%.

Why is she inflicting her truth on you and expecting you to validate it when it was not your experience?

I just cannot understand this mentality.

Where does OP say DD is doing this? We've heard that DD realised in adulthood that rowing didn't have to be a part of family life, and that she was affected by it.

Where is she 'inflicting' anything?

If one of my DC was upset, I would listen. I may see it differently but I'd care about their feelings. Absolutely if it turned hurtful or disrespectful, that's another story. I haven't seen any evidence of this from the OP, however.

It is painful if/when they distance themselves, whatever their age. I have just worked to build a life of my own, which isn't dependent on my relationship with my DS. I just never get it right

You are so right. My parents used to row a lot and my mother used to threaten to leave. When I was at high school several girls were chatting one day and it turned out they all had similar stories about their parents. Your daughter needs to get on with her own life and stop obsessing about things which have long passed and which really are quite normal.

I've no idea why she went to a therapist to be honest as I was a but lost for words really. As I said before it's really hard to just rely on phone calls, it would be so much easier face to face but I think that unless she wants to elaborate I will just have to give her space, though heartbreaking as I feel that she just has to work through it herself as she didn't seem to want to elaborate, it's just that I've no idea how to proceed