No annual leave left during school holiday and no childcare

[ExcitingTimes2023]

Hi!

I was hoping someone could advise on what they do in this situation.

I have 2 children, a 18 month old and a 3 year old. My eldest is an august baby and she goes to school this September. The annual leave calender for this coming year opened a couple of weeks ago, I went to book some time off to cover some (not all) of the school holidays. I understand it has to be fair so I was hoping to book a couple of weeks and my partner we do the same. And we could request alternate shifts the remaining weeks to ensure one of us are home with the children (both shift workers).

However already there is no annual leave during the school holidays left so I’m not sure what we are going to do for childcare. Like I said we could request alternate shifts but I’m not sure our departments would honour that every single school holiday week, and it would mean we spend no time together as a family. I understand it has to be fair and I wasn’t expecting to have all the time off during the holidays but to get zero weeks off during my child’s first 6 months of school just seams a bit unfair. I spoke to my senior who was sympathetic but couldn’t help.

now I know there are holiday clubs and when my child is a bit older I’m sure she would manage but she is very shy and reserved at the moment and very nervous in new settings and hates places which was really noisy, so I’m not keen to use these until she is a little more confident in herself. I also have a younger child to drop off at nursery so logistics would be a nightmare to get to work on time. What other options are available childcare wise during the holidays? or am I just going to have to come to terms with alternate shifts and no quality family time during holidays?

Im just feeling a bit gutted as my first child starting school is overwhelming as it is without having to worry about this. If she was one of these confident children that just gets on with everyone I wouldn’t be worrying so much but I just know my daughter! Next year I’m literally going to be stood at the annual leave folder the second it opens to get a good few weeks booked!

Not that it matters as everyone is entitled to book their annual leave when suits them, but at least half of the school holiday leave has been booked by people with no children or people who’s children have fled the nest so I guess that adds to why I feel so deflated. but I’m trying to remind myself that I don’t get a say when or why other people need to use their leave. Trying to stay impartial is hard though.

Happens to us all!🤣 I only mentioned it because I thought your point was valid and should be read properly.
I think it’s great that you would change your hols to accommodate others. Nice thought

Oh no! I'm sure you are not a terrible mother at all. You are in a horrible situation with a dreadful annual leave policy which is mean and thoughtless.

It's really really difficult juggling jobs and childcare, the summer holidays are an nightmare. I wish more employers outside of education system would look at offering term time only contracts.

I'm so sorry you've had mean comments, Mumsnet is a mean and callous place a lot of the time.

I'm sure you are an absolutely wonderful mum. I don't have any advice unfortunately, but wish you all the luck in the world navigating it. Look after yourself.

I've never worked anywhere where it is first come first served.. that's not great management, out of interest, what is the process for people who work part time or who are on leave/sick etc when the booking comes out? Do they just miss out?

I say this as a parent, i dont think anyone should get priority for leave, parent or otherwise, but it does need to be fairly balanced. At my place for periods of peak leave times (mainly Xmas, the summer and the years that Easter and eid fall close together) people submit their wish list of leave and then we look at everyone's requests together and approve from there so people get at least some time off.

Unpaid parental leave is probably the best option here. Time together during the hols is really valuable during those first few months of school. Hope you can sort something.

It sort of was! In my place of work, the minute the list goes up, there is a crowd of staff trying to book. Then, not two weeks later! People dreaded being on a rest day that day because most good dates would have gone by the next day.

Lesson learnt for next year. As for this year, does the younger DCs nursery also do holiday childcare that your older DC could attend? Quite a lot of day nurseries do holiday childcare for children up to around either 6 or 8 years of age. Usually children who attended the nursery previously or children with siblings in the nursery get first dibs but sometimes there are spare spots if you get in early enough.

Try child minders too. If not what about childcare/ uni students home for the holidays? There are a few babysitters in our town who have posted their availability for full days for Easter holidays this last week on the local FB page.

It opened a couple of weeks ago and you only just looked? I think this is a lesson learned to have your plans prepped in advance of it opening next year so you can put requests in the moment it opens.

It’s so hard to juggle and I’m sorry your workplace can’t be more flexible.
A good childminder is worth their weight in gold. We’ve done nurseries, holiday clubs and had a childminder for about 5 years (she stopped covering my kids school and then we moved). My kids were so happy in her care. She took them on amazing days out in the hols, it was a smaller group of kids - enough to socialise but not so many it was overwhelming for shyer children. Her house was like a really fun home from home, my kids never once complained about going there like they did with school/other childcare settings. I never felt guilty leaving them in the hols, they had more experiences with her and their little friends than I could have afforded to provide throughout the holidays x

I'm a childminder and take children in the school holidays who don't usually come to me during term time. Maybe this could be an option for you?

I completely sympathise with your situation, it's sometimes not until you are faced with the problem your realise it's not workable. We were in a nearly identical position. We had no other option that would sit right with us as a family.

I gave up a 20 year career and got a much lower paid term time job, we decided this was the only way it could work due to our child being shy, wanting time together as a family and to save my mental health of worrying constantly how our children would be looked after. We had to make sacrifices to do this and It was a very difficult decision that has been very hard at times over the years, but has worked out for the best. I hope you find a solution.

This is incredibly unfair OP. I would be challenging this with your manager or their senior. It cannot be the case that all holidays are first come first served, only bookable in person and tough luck to anyone on leave at the time.
Time to put on your big girl pants and raise a concern (and if needs be a complaint).
Ignore the meanies. And I know you’ve said you don’t expect special treatment, but as a parent of a school age child, getting some leave in the school holidays absolutely trumps Linda wanting to go to Tenerife with her partner in the middle of the October half term holidays. Why anyone without children would want to pay school holiday prices (unless travelling with a teacher or similar) is beyond me.

In your situation @ExcitingTimes2023 I’d take a week off sick in the summer and I wouldn’t even feel guilty.
My dm used to do night shift and every year she would come onto her shift to find the a/l book had opened that morning and every decent week was booked.

A parent wanting time off during school holidays doesn’t trump someone without school age children. They may be married to a teacher, have a specific event on during the school holidays - the reason is irrelevant.

Sorry I didn't read all the responses but I believe this is really bad management of staff, not allowing everyone a fair share of summer holidays.
Many adults with no kids or older kids actually prefer non school holiday time as annual leave because travel is cheaper. However, a parent doesn't have a choice but to take time off when school children are off.
I think you should speak to management and remind them that you too have school age children now which means some of these summer weeks will need to be taken off.
In our team we cover for eachother and make sure we all get some annual leave as close to our wishes and plans as possible.
Is this the same with winter, half term and spring holidays as you'll have to factor that in as well from next year...
When I had my first, I managed to fly my mom over from a different country when I couldn't book enough annual leave. I also used my mother in law to help with childcare. It was only for a short period of time but it was very helpful and I was very grateful. After that, holiday clubs kicked in and it got a bit easier.
I never used a child minder but this might be an option too I guess?
I hope you do manage to find some annual leave with your children but I would definitely raise the problem with management as it's not fair...

might it be worth putting an email round ask colleagues who’ve booked leave to give you a shout if they cancel their leave? I’ve had a colleague book time off in every single school holiday for the whole year, then cancel it because she didn’t need it.

I really feel for you, I worked in a government office for a long time and the leave was on a first come, first served basis (and I know it still is). I had school age children at the time and covering the holidays were a nightmare and made me really sad I couldn’t spend much of the school holidays off with them. That’s the reason I left and took a term time job.
Could you take unpaid leave or is there any facility for you to do term time only? This is only the start of it and you have a lot of school holidays ahead.

you are entitled to up to 4 weeks unpaid leave a year for parenting.

https://www.gov.uk/parental-leave/entitlement

I would campaign to change the leave system to one with more notice. Ours is a first come first serve basis, but open 6 months in advance on a rolling basis, so we all know when we can request it from. I always get the kids holiday leave in asap and haven't had any problems yet so far, but we've only been navigating the summer holidays for 3 years so there time yet.

The only warning we get regarding AL is the run up to christmas as the same people were always getting christmas week off, its been better now an email goes out reminding people that the diary opens in a weeks time for requesting leave for christmas week.

I had to take unpaid parental leave which is not ideal. Childcare situation isn’t great for working people and it’s a massive juggle.

I think it’s obvious from the rest of my post that I’m not referring to someone travelling with a teacher or wanting time off for a specific event.
OP said all of the school holidays had been booked up, including by those who didn’t meet those criteria. Whilst she of course cannot know about everyone, it seems some have likely just chosen those weeks because they fancied them. And no, I honestly don’t feel this should be allowed over and above a parent needing childcare. The reason is NOT irrelevant. This is real life. The manager should have a better handle on this. The old way sounded fairer - everyone gets a free choice over some weeks and then the rest allocated afterwards.

Has your partner managed to book some weeks or has it happened to both of you?

I do think the leave should be managed better. If you get the half term one year you don't get first dips at it the next.

Same for Christmas if you get it one year someone else should get it the next.

This does seem unfair.
I would raise this point with your manager and also have a look at the leave. If someone has taken more than one school hols off I would point this out, it needs to be spread over everyone and not just the person who gets in first getting all of the school holidays (I dont know if this is the case but it is worth looking at).

Its hard, dont beat yourself up

When I approved holidays - the reason was irrelevant. Some organisations have the same issue with working Christmas Day - DH has worked many after DT’s were born as it was fair that everyone had the opportunity on a rota basis to have Christmas Day with their family.

I'm confused surely holidays everywhere are first come first served? How else would holidays be managed?

A PP answered that one, @Bababear987; apparently if popular dates are getting booked up they put holiday approvals on hold until they've gone into who needs what and why, and who can be flexible so that "everyone gets something"

IME this is usually code for putting those with children first while trying not to annoy everyone else, but of course this case may be different

I'd also suggest they change the policy and allow being able to book further ahead into the next leave year. For example this year Easter is late so it seems bonkers to only be able to book Easter leave on 1 April!

We can book leave from 1 January. Because everyone knows that if they had school hols off last year, they quite possibly won't get it this year, no-one commits to holiday dates unless they're sure.