A child that will never fit in

[MrsSnape]

I feel so sorry for my son. I have posted about him before, he's 9 and is not at all like the other boys. He hates football as he is frightened he gets hurt, he has dyspraxia so can't run properly or anything like that and he has no real friends. Some of the other kids talk to him in passing but they soon go off with their proper friends and he's left on his own.

He wears glasses and his two front teeth stick out a bit so bullies are naturally drawn to his "geeky" appearance and I fear this will get much worse as he gets older (dentist have said he will probably wear a brace when he's older that will fix this but that doesn't help the current situation). Somehow he has also developed a "posh" accent, I really don't see how because he's always been surrounded by people with normal northern accents...an example of this was a boy went up to him yesterday and said "alright mate? you on msn tonight?" and my son said a drawn out, complicated reply of "well, actually I've been thinking, by the time I get home it's usually 3.20pm and then I have to get changed and have my tea. By this time its usually around 4.30 and we also have Karate so I'm not actually sure if I will have the spare time...". The kid just burst out laughing. Any other lad would have simply said "no, I'm at karate".

He went to the school disco last night, he really wanted to but I did have my concerns that he would be targetted. He insisted on wearing his black skinny jeans and chemical romance hoody...I warned him that none of the other kids would be dressed like that and he said he didn't care. So I dropped him off and picked him up at 7.30 and he was really quiet. Nobody had bothered with him and some older kids had spent the night ripping the piss out of his clothes and barging into him knocking him over.

I've been into school about the bullying but its not just at school. If I take him to the park the rougher kids are drawn to him and just take the mick. When I allowed him to play out the kids down the street made his life hell and it ended with him being chased down the street and finally knocked off his bike.

The truth is he is one of those kids that will never fit in. No matter how many times we "tell the teachers" and complain.

I'm starting to wonder if it's cruel to send him to school like this, its like sending a lamb to the slaughter every morning. I'm mainly dreading secondary school.

Does anyone have any experience of "Misfits" changing as they get older and getting on ok with school?

be so proud of him he sounds lovely, I know me thinking that doesnt help, are there clubs at school that you can get him involved in, if I was you I think I would encourage him to be who he is and not to morph into one of the other kids.

Yes. Ds is a geek: rubbish at sport (and I mean USELESS), rather eccentric in appearance, likes weird rock bands and chess. Oh, and he's 9 as well.

He was an only child until he was 5, so spoke in rather an adult way which tended to put off other children.

Two things - we moved school (we moved area) to a much bigger school with a (ahem) more middle-class catchment area and this I'm afraid did make a difference. Also he developed an obsessive interest in super-heroes. And I mean completely obsessive. This gave him some street-cred with his peers and he found one or two friends who valued his extensive knowledge.

He is still a bit of a 'misfit' as you call it, but things have really got better.

I agree, I think he sounds lovely although I understand it must be distressing for you. What's his take on the situation, does he want to fit in more? Going on my own experience, it's those children who don't fit in with the norm who generally turn out to be the nicer people at the end of the day and in the long run most comfortable with who they are.

I am proud of him and I think the person who he is will be great when he's over the age of say...17 but at the moment it just makes him stand out and not in a good way.

He also likes chess but our school is very "working class" and when I suggested a chess club to the school they basically looked at me like I was taking the mick.

There is a secondary school that I think he would do ok in, its a "posh" school with better behaved children, strict, top reputation etc but its extremely difficult to get in. City wide catchment area but out of 356 kids that applied this year, only 54 got in.

I don't know whether to home-ed him or not but then I have DS2 who is completely the opposite, he's always in trouble and very popular at school.

I can't really afford to move

He says he doesn't want to fit in and can't think of anything worse than morphing into a "robot" in a football shirt lol.

He's always quoting chemical romance lyrics "I wouldn't front the scene if you paid me" etc and to know that his heros were like him does seem to help. I think I worry about this more than he does but as I say, I worry that when he turns 13 and the girls are only looking at the popular kids and the boys are looking for someone to beat up on the way home from school...I think its going to start bothering him more

If you get him a tutor, would it help him to get into the secondary school you like?

Its kids who don't fit in like your son that turn into the billionaires of tomorrow IMO. He'll probably invent some software and become the next Bill Gates, or maybe he'll start a band and be the new Coldplay.

I'd remind him that as he gets older, (especially when he gets to college) he will find people who are like him. And then I'd relax and think of the house he'll buy you when he's made it big.

no they don't go on academic results apparantly. They do have to do a test but they reckon that is to ensure a mixture of abilities are admitted...I'm not sure how true this is. Personally I reckon they do it to get the best students to keep up their GCSE pass rates.

ps meant to say before my onions were burning that you could have been describing both my husband (ginger hair and NHS glasses - he never stood a chance) and my much younger siblings, all of whom were 'geeky' in their own way. They all survived and managed to pick up some friends along the way. It depends on the school but perhaps there is more chance of him meeting more like minded friends in secondary school (my brothers all did)..

Talilac, I agree with you (wishful thinking maybe) but he does have his heart set on being a rock star and he already has plans to have a house in London and one in America...this is when he's not doing his voluntary work in Africa lol (he likes to plan ahead!).

He is a whizz on the computer too (lets face it, geeky kids usually are!) and he's already getting involved with scripting and programming. His dad is a web designer but refuses to help DS build his own website (we're seperated).

I know once school is out of the way he will be ok and if he goes to uni he will be fine but at the moment he's only 9 and I'm frightened to death that as he gets older the bullying will turn more serious

it sounds like you have to take your lead from him. Seriously he sounds fab. Even if he was popular, there would be no guarantee of not being bullied, you know how cliquey and flighty kids can be. He sounds very mature and clearly knows what he wants so I guess just keep talking to him and as much as you can give him help in dealing with any bullying if it arises. I hope you get him in to the school you want for him.

Do you think it's worth role playing/teaching relationship stuff with him like your example with the boy talking about msn? Would he take it on board?

He sounds lovely, btw.

I do understand how worried you must be. Bullying is much meaner now than it was back in our day (or does it only seem that way?)But I think you're doing great with things like making sure he knows karate, etc.

But essentially, people don't fit in because they haven't yet found their "place" iyswim, whether thats top of the charts, uni, africa, whatever.. He will find it, with time.

It sounds like your sons horizons are really broad which is so exciting for him, and those of his classmates just aren't. So many of the world's "great" people were misfits in their youth, its almost a requirement it sometimes seems.

as a ps, if he does decide that houses in London and the US are the way to go (plus one for you too of course), do encourage him to go the software route rather than the rock star route.. Rock stars just don't earn what they once did!

I do like to talk to him, he is like me and really wants to see the world, his interests go way beyond who won the football on telly last night IYSWIM and I think thats why he never has anything to talk to the other kids about.

Not long ago he asked "the most popular kid in school" why he supports man Utd when we're not from Manchester, the kid couldn't give a good enough answer to shut DS up so instead just hit him. I have told him not to bother with the "borings" as we call them, don't try to pick arguments with people etc but it seems like DS is in his own world and genuinly strives to understand why other kids act the way they do.

I have tried talking to him about the way he speaks to people (like the msn thing etc) but he doesn't realise he's doing it. He talks to me like that too...eg...
DS - "What are we having for tea?"
me - "Chicken"
DS - "oh? is it free range chicken or that awful battery chicken which is cruel?" ... its just the way he talks but I don't understand where he's learnt it from.

The karate has been good for his confidence, he goes 3 times a week and it gives him a chance to mix with older kids too which he prefers.

There are four 9 year olds there ... when the kids arrive the 9 year olds all go and sit in a group and mess around etc...DS walks straight over to the teenagers and sits with them. He prefers it that way.

He does sound brilliant, I must say. I wish I'd known him when I was 9!

There's another thread about kids that don't fit in on the board at the moment. Your ds sounds ace - a real individual, not a sheep.

MrsSnape - don't despair! I ahve EXACTLY the same thing with my 8 year old DS.

In fact posted something very similar a wile ago www.mumsnet.com/Talk?topicid=8&threadid=233693#4705776

We just kept talking to him about how to respond to the gibes from the 'borings' (great name!) and encouraged him in all the things he was interested in.
My DS sounds sooooooo like yours: loves his guitar; collecting stuff (yu-gi-oh at the moment); total bookish academic type - positively SUCKS up facts like a sponge.

He joined cubs and found lots of friends and geeky-stuff to learn there, without all the emphasis on sport.

The secondary school DOES sound like the right place for him. Could you arrange a visit/ meeting with the Head and ask some frank questions about their selection criteria - possibly even drop in a few comments about your son. you never know, it might help, and you'll probably learn more about your DS's chances of getting in there?

You know what - he sounds really bright to me! My dh was something like that at school too. I have to say, he didn't really find his feet socially until sixth form college (I'm basing this on what his old mates have told me, as I didn't know him then). However, he is (and was) happy being himself and it sounds like your son is too. He didn;t have a girlfriend till he was 19, but so what? We've been together 13 years now, married for 6 and have 2 (and nearly 3) children - he's a very lucky man
I know you said the school weren't keen on a chess club, but how about some sort of computing club? And I don't mean just game-playing, but programming, web-design etc. It's pretty cool stuff, and he sounds like he'd really excel at that.

I think your son sounds like a wonderful boy.

A misfit who changed as he got older? Well, sounds like most of my family and my friends. Most of us were the geeks, the weirdos who were bullied at school and hated sport. Now we are journalists, writers, computer programmes, games designers, all in gloriously happy partnerships, all very content with our lives and our funny interests and our individuality.

I know this doesn't help right now. But the big thing for me was the fact that my parents always told me I was brilliant and encouraged me to be an individual and follow my own path. They made me feel that it wasn't so bad to be a loner. If you can do that for your son you will be giving him a great gift. I would bet money that he will grow up to be a happy, normal adult and he will make you very, very proud.

I don't have any real experience of this, but can reassure you that 9 yr old boys can be unbelievably horrid and cruel to kids who don't fit their criteria for popularity. And even in groups where they mostly get on, one will get singled out now and then for bullying.

I find your account of your sons' dialogue with the other boy interesting, in that it was very similar to one of the high IQ boys speech in C4's Child Genius programme. Is there any chance that he could have a high IQ? Is there anyone at karate you could invite to yours, as at least they will have that as a common interest, and your son might do better one to one in his own territory? Sometimes you have to be pro-active in facilitating the social situations.

Of course he doesn't want to be bullied, but how far is he prepared to change to get friends, some boys like just one good friend rather than a group of mates.

All I would say is your son sounds lovely and it is everyone else who is bullying him that needs to change, not him.

If the school won't help and support him I would consider changing schools.

I would agree, he sounds lovely. My ds is also a bit like this, and my Dad was like it, and my older sister (who is now a very successful, happy research scientist).

My ds (aged 7) was described by his teacher last year as being "like a little professor" when he does show and tell! He is also into things in quite an obsessive way, e.g. he is currently very interested in lifeboats, and can tell you interesting facts about all the different classes of lifeboat, where they are stationed etc. He is, essentially quite geeky. But the thing that saves him from being picked on, is that he also loves cricket. I would say, though, that he isn't particularly popular at school, but has been lucky enough to find a few really good friends who accept him as he is.

I think the fact your ds does karate will help him a lot, as that is often seen by boys to be quite "cool".

With regard to the type of conversation he has, that is very much like my ds, and also like myself . It's what my dh calls "over-explaining" but what I think of as just explaining something properly so the other person knows all the relevant facts.

I think it's very sad that children feel they have to "fit in" - your ds sounds lovely as he is, and why should he have to change just to suit the others? But I can understand your concerns, as you don't want him to be picked on or bullied.