How to deal with a negotiating/questioning child

[LuckyMum1989]

A conversation with my 5yo DD might go like this:

• when you have finished colouring in Snow White's skirt, put your coat on please. It's time to go.

* can i colour in her legs as well?

• no we need to go. Just the skirt and off we go.

* I just do a bit on her bow.

• No DD. Skirt and then put coat on.

* I just need to tidy all my pens {note... only wants to tidy pens when asked to do something else!}

• No time for that. Coat and shoes please.

[Holds coat out] * Can I put my shoes on first?

• Just put your coat on, DD

* Why coat first?

• [sometimes] because I need my hands

Or

• [other times] because I said so. Let's go.

* Can I bring my bear?

• No love. We're only going to the pharmacists before it closes so not going to be long. No bears.

* If I run really quickly and get my bear and I don't make any fuss, can I get my bear very very quickly?

• i said no, DD. We have to get going. Shoes. Now.

* I just take my barbie because that is already downstairs. [Tries to go back into dining room]

• NO. We have to go. We don't need any toys. Come on!

* if I ask really nicely...

• NO! GO! Come on DD, go!

It doesn't matter if I have pre-prepared her (hence giving her warning about finishing her colouring), if I give her time to get a toy or not, if I say "when the timer goes off in 5 minutes, we are going to get shoes and coat on and get in the car"
EVERYTHING is up for discussion.

Going upstairs to wash hands? Can she wash her hands downstairs? Why not?
If she doesn't put her hands near the boiling pasta water, THEN can she wash her hands downstairs?
Need an early night? If she has no bath (she loves baths) can she have two stories?
10 minute timer to play in her room? Can she have 15 if she tidies up?
If she doesn't make a fuss about this, can she do that?

What does that sign mean? But WHY is that the rule? Is it dangerous? But WHY is it dangerous?

It is exhausting!

The reality is that if the building is on fire, or there is a threat or whatever, I need her to be able to listen to me without needing to understand the whys and wherefores of every little thing.

I don't want to answer every single question with "because I said so" nor do I want to answer every single question with a full and detailed answer!

Sometimes we have time to explain. Sometimes we don't.

Sometimes we have energy to explain. Sometimes we don't.

Sometimes it is easy to explain. Sometimes it isn't.

She's trying so hard to follow all the rules and ask politely etc so she's not demanding in terms of outright disobedience or aggression, which means it feels awful telling her off when her 10th question starts with "If i ask nicely and I am super good then can I...." because she is trying so hard to do things the right way... but at the same time, doing things the right way means sometimes doing things because your mum says so - even if you don't understand WHY all the time.

Help me break this cycle! Any tips out there from a parent who has escaped these conversations with a tiny negotiator?

Say yes to as much as you can.
Pick your battles op.

I manage someone like this. It's bloody infuriating!

You could try the challenge game. Put a 1 minute timer or however long you think is sufficient and say ' shoes, coat and grab a Barbie/bear before the timer'

Whatever she doesn't have you grab and just walk out the house. If your walking she will put her shoes on quickly outside the door as your already outside the house or she can put her shoes on once in the car

Nip it in the bud ASAP because she'll grow up to be a nightmare questioning staff member. I've just had one join my team & she questions everything & everyone including the big boss! Questioning is good but there is a time and place and this employee is treading on my last nerve.

Examples of questions asked:
Uniform - why?, Policies - why?, Team roles - why does x do that, why doesn't x do this instead?, Supplier contracts etc.

I wish she'd stop the questions and actually do the bloody work we've employed her to do. So please do her future employer and colleagues a favour and chanel it in a healthy way. 😀good luck!

@MadameMassiveSalad I feel your pain, it's bloody infuriating isn't it? Having to answer every question slows down team productivity.

1 minutes more colouring then we need to get ready to go

Can I have 2 minutes to do her bow as well?

We only have 1 minute and that's not going to change. Do you want to spend it colouring or discussing it?

"no, do as you are told,"

Honestly I don't know how much is normal and much is not but she sounds like our child and I would say consider neurodiversity, as it sounds like an issue with transitions.
We use timers a lot and preparing him in advance for what is happening, but anything unexpected that happens suddenly is a disaster! And all the questions are for his need to get used to what is happening and remove the uncertainty and ambiguity from the situation, as well as stalling.

You will get lots of lovely advice here about books to read and agency and being collaborative and the lifelong damage caused by being an authoritative parent.

However I was that little girl, and to a lesser extent my son is like that. I was just dicking around to see what I could get away with. In my mother's case...nothing. She had three children in four years and she didn't have time for my crap, and she would just give me The Look and say "TheYear. You heard me". I am less good at that so I have to say "We need to leave now so put your shoes on" and and further attempts to do everything other than the thing I asked him to do get "Shoes". "SHOES". "SHOES."

I have one of these OP but he is twice your DD's age. He is much quicker at getting ready now but still questions and negotiates everything. I have had a lot of the conversations you describe. And reached the end of my tether a fair few times.

A small thing I do is swap out "please" for "thank you" as it implies agreement has already been made. Also "it's time to..." rather than "can you" or "let's". But I can't say it's made much difference to his overall approach to life. His current case involves why he will have to wear specific items for secondary school and why they need to be so strict about it.

The positives are that he is very bright and when we are not in a massive rush, it does lead to very interesting conversations!

@Rainallnight @LuckyMum1989 & others who are 'suffering'

a fucking frustrating as it is, it's something to actually nurture because it leads to brilliant skills, confident decision making & lots of good stuff in adults!

invest in a wig & a good coffee machine,TRY to strengthen these traits for the benefit of these adults your helping to form.

biddable children are much easier, but struggle more as teenagers & adults.

Oh OP I think a posted something v. similar on here when DS was much younger. Another poster said did I realise how clever has was ? I think I shrugged it off at the time. He was ( and is) just like this- he is 20 on course for a First in STEM subject @ Oxbridge talking to him yesterday he told me he is " bored of University" now. Very clever, very quick thinking I am sure he will be very rich. Total PITA to live with but we love him. Just roll with it, she won't become complient and biddible, but she will be good at problem soving and v. likely keep you in your old age 💐

This just ridiculous. Got no time for that. 0-5: Treat them like a god, 5-10 treat them like a servant. 10+ treat them like a friend.

Instead of engaging in conversation, just MOVE. You gotta go, so go. She thinks talking is ok because you are replying. Notting wrong with stating your boundaries or saying because mummy says so. She only needs to know you're there to keep her safe and care for her.

Wow and I thought my DD was questioning

Her preschool key worker said it had been many years since she had met a child that was so questioning

But yours definitely sounds on another level

Well done. It's not easy to manage. The advice about Phillipa Perrys book was good too btw

At ages 5-10 - this is your opportunity to set boundaries/rules - if not, after this you're screwed.

@LuckyMum1989 ok, I've changed my mind.

you NEED a prescription of Gin on repeat & a padded cell!!

FMD she's made it to 5?

in all seriousness, she's got a very good brain & fabulous skills, but it is well beyond a normal 'why why why' and it may help to take her to someone who can 'give it a label' so you can work out, how best to both make the most of her way/depth of thinking, but also sometimes shut it down. If she wants to make 6.

and a newborn you need gin & a medal!

Some good advice above. Phrasing instructions in the passive, or having non-verbal instructions might also help.

Eg “there’s two minutes left on the timer to colour” rather than “stop colouring in two minutes”, “dinner’s ready” rather than “come for dinner”. (It sounds a really small thing but the number of instructions/ demands made on children all build up, I’d much prefer to be told “this work needs doing” than “do this work” basically).

Non-verbal examples - for leaving the house, just place coat and shoes next to her as colouring is up. Open the door and body language to show moving towards car. And if you need to leave in a hurry I would pick your battles and physically go round with her to wash hands, etc. won’t stop questions but you can have them on the move! Maybe try chatting about a different topic/ distraction as you get ready together?

it sounds exhausting (and familiar). I’ve found the PDA society helpful to understand how to reduce demands on children, and how to use passive language (I work with kids and I find the strategies are useful for NT and ND children).

@LuckyMum1989 I hear you. My child sounds very similar! I sometimes wonder if it’s because I’ve given them so many choices that they are now used to having a say, and consequently struggle when that isn’t an option.
The 2 min notice does help sometimes. But I am also okay with saying ‘we are leaving now, that is not a choice. You get lots of choices but this time isn’t one of them. We can do x when we return or something similar.’
It’s lovely to have a strong, confident child who has a voice, but it can be hard when you just want to get somewhere!

a fucking frustrating as it is, it's something to actually nurture because it leads to brilliant skills, confident decision making & lots of good stuff in adults!

I don't think this is automatically true at all. If your child is mart and can learn to manage their behaviour and not waste people's time for the sake of it, they will do well. But if they go through life (as some people do) trying to avoid doing the thing they need to do or are being paid to do and irritating people while they are at it, they will not do well. I have managed people like that.

At 5 children are inquisitive and want to understand things, it’s natural to have questions.

Maybe flex where you can and also let her have a few choices too. Otherwise it’s a long list of No’s and a constant battle all the time.

My 10yo DD can be like this. We might have a bit of back and forth to show I’m listening to her and considering her requests but after a few times I draw a line under it, will say enough is enough and will change the tone of my voice to say we’re done. No more messing around. And I absolutely will say “because I said so” as well as “because I pay the bills”, “because I’m the adult and your the child” and many more. It concludes with a sharp “now move your butt/arse!”

My 5 year old is like this. I agree, it’s exhausting. Timers are helpful - we use Alexa. She’ll even set it herself. She’s also learning to tell the time which is helpful so she knows we need to leave at x time and I can ask her to look at the clock which gives her some control. This is slightly embarrassing but I have “characters” (eg Miss Trunchbull) which I sometimes put on to change the vibe/move things along. They’ll question mummy til the cows come home but Miss Trunchbull just bellows about swinging them round by their pigtails or something equally silly. Definitely not one for in public… I also turn things back on her eg “why do you think you can’t use the downstairs sink?” - she’s bright enough to figure out that our rules are for a reason and even likes to create her own. But it’s v much a work in progress and I still often resort to “because I said so” or just repeatedly intoning “SHOES” at her.

My three year old is like this and it’s starting to break us a bit tbh!!!

I'm surprised this is so far the one and only post suggesting this.

Yes some of this is normal, they're learning and pushing boundaries etc but this is extreme. My 7 year old DS is exactly like this OP and he is Autistic.

I never negotiated with my Dc at that age.
Finish colouring the skirt and we need to go
Can I do the legs as well?
Your choice is to finish the skirt or not
Can I add a bow?
Skirt or we leave right now.
I am just going to do the hair
<removes drawing> ok, we are leaving now.

They are both mid/late teens now and we had no behaviour issues beyond the usual stuff and seem very happy, well adjusted and everyone says they are a credit to us.