Toddler pushes my dog

[Harrjenk]

Hi, I feel totally pathetic writing this post as I feel I should be able to sort it out myself but I’m totally stuck. My 2.5 yr old son, who is usually gentle and kind with people and animals, pushes and runs at my dog. He’s a rescue dog and he has learnt to hate this behavior from my toddler. He barks and shrinks away and runs away. My toddler loves this reaction and also any reaction from me and just keeps doing it. He often does it when we are out for a walk and I stop to talk to someone or take my eyes off the pair of them. The dog is on a lead and so can’t get away. I’m scared my toddler is going to get bitten as I really couldn’t blame the dog for that given what he has to put up with and I’m at my wits end of saying “No” and “stop” to my toddler. It’s not always possible to redirect his attention or remove him from the situation. I’m finding it unsustainable trying to separate them, I’m at home on my own with the two of them.

if I Google it, the answers are so generic like “just say No and remove your child” but I’ve been doing that for months now. Usually when I ignore the bad behavior it improves on its own with my son but it doesn’t seem safe to ignore this. Help!!!

Two year olds are too little to understand about empathy like that. I got a kitten when my dd was and had to give it back as she just kept on picking it up by the neck. She grew out of that

No disrespect here but if you don’t toughen up immediately and start putting the effort into properly disciplining your child now then you’ll leave it too late your child will control you forever. He’s 2.5 so he’s perfectly capable of understanding that what he’s doing is wrong. You don’t need to shout at a child but what you do need is to find your firm strict voice and carry out instant consequences. He hits and kicks you because you’re being weak with him he knows he will get away with it. This is the perfect age to be implementing time out. Be it on a chair or the bottom step of the stairs. A firm “no we do not hit/kick/hurt/ scare the dog” then remove him to this dedicated space. At first he will kick, scream blue murder and try and run off. This is where you find your fight to keep picking him up, no eye contact, no verbal communication and keep putting him back until he’s sat there calmly for at least a minute. It will run you ragged and be hell to begin with but it will click with him. It’s mind over matter and your dog deserves better and you do yourself. When your son is calm you can then come to his eye level and explain that he was put in time out for hurting the dog/hurting you and if he does it again he will be straight back there in age appropriate language of course. You keep doing this as many times as you need to. Along with ending screen time/tv time where appropriate also. This also stands for going straight home when he is out, regardless of what you’re doing or who you’re speaking to at the time. These consequences have to be instant for your son to associate the consequence with his own actions. He is a toddler, they learn good behaviour from their caregivers and desperately need routine and firm boundaries. You are the adult and you’re in control, not the other way around.

@Zoreos well said

You need to deal with this immediately. This is how children get bitten and dogs are unfairly put down - a negligent adult who should know better being irresponsible. Keep them separate until your son is old enough to behave responsibly around your dog. Even then, only have them in the same room under direct supervision. If you can't do this, rehome your dog.

We have two dogs and they are separate from our toddler at all times. She has been taught never to approach them. We bring them to her if she wants to pat them and she has been taught to respect their boundaries and not touch them if they don't willingly come to us when she wants to pet them. On walks on my own, if they are on lead she is in the buggy, no negotiations. I can't manage 3 things on leads! If i'm out with my husband as well she can get out and walk as one of us has her on reins, the other has the dogs and the buggy. It is perfectly manageable but you need to be rigorous with your planning/management at home and out and about, and you need to make your house environment conducive to separating them.

I'm appalled at reading OPs casual attitude, would you let him touch a hot iron, stick his hand in boiling water? and have a wee chat so as not to upset the child?
He needs a sharp short shock, so yes a shout or pulling him away sharply, your poor poor dog being terrorised.
I work in rescue and if I thought a dog was being put in this position I'd remove it.

This is insane advice. Do you know nothing of child development? The last bits of the brain to connect are the frontal and prefrontal cortices, where insight, empathy and risk taking are controlled. They are not rational, they are all impulse. Yelling will only instill a fear response. That is no way to learn. As parents we have to be adults in the situation and change the environment. (Remove the dog)

Some of the advice on this thread is bonkers - being punitive with a 2.5yo is only going to have so much of an effect no matter how severe you make the punishment. It's much more effective to start rewarding a positive opposite behaviour.

This is from the article I linked earlier (not my words/my experience) and I think it's good advice but I linked the whole article, because the background of why "magnetisation" is a problem, how it happens, why to avoid it, what the eventual goal is, is also essential information:

In my experience, it takes about two weeks of a dog being present but unavailable in order to begin to break the magnetization. It's not that dissimilar to kids watching TV. When you cut them off the TV it's hard at first because they don't know what else to do, but, soon enough, they take out a game or other activity and are just as happy.
Here are some basic concepts:

1. Decide the dog is no longer available. Pretend he has something contagious or imagine your dog with a painful ear condition or a broken leg if that helps focus your attention. The point is to commit to a change in perspective from this day forward.
2. Meet your dog's needs so he can be a good partner. Set yourself up for success by making sure your dog is calm and relaxed. Stock up on Kong or other "food carrier" toys and make sure you have at least three of them stuffed and ready to go each day so you know you can keep your dog occupied as you work with your child. Schedule regular walks and outings, even if you have to get someone to help with this. Remember -- a two week intensive effort is much more effective than a little here and there when you get to it.
3. Stock up on novel things for your child to do. Fresh crayons, paper, new activities, etc. There are lots of books in the library with fun things to do with children of all ages or research online. The idea is to have replacement activities to grow your child's interest in doing other things. Stock up on supplies and ideas so you don't spend the whole two weeks nagging your child to get away from the dog. That's not the idea at all!
4. Cultivate an internal radar system so you always know where your child is and where your dog is. Whenever they are likely to be within six feet of each other, calmly put yourself in the middle and intercept your child with little or no fanfare. Do not reprimand your baby or make it your baby's responsibility to "know better." Be calm and matter-of-fact to avoid drawing attention to this being a "hot button" issue. The dog is just not available, but you are still calm, friendly and kind.
5. If the child is persistent about getting to the dog, let the dog relax in peace in his Safety Zone or do something else with your child behind a gate. Or, go for a walk or out for errands - something that changes the picture for a fresh start next time. Never get into a struggle with your child about the dog.
6. Instill internal prompts and reinforce efforts at the new behaviors. Remark to your child specifically about what they did, "You slowed down when you saw our dog in the way. You are a good friend to dogs!" or "You are staying in your spot as our dogs lays close to us. You are a kid dogs feel safe with!"

Sorry you're going through this OP, I have 2 dogs and 2 young kids so know what it's like!
Ignore the poster suggesting you 'let rip' at your son....

Sorry if this is stating the obvious, but have you tried explaining to your son why we don't chase/hit the dog (using toddler language)? And at a calm time when he's more likely to listen rather than when he's running around?

I have a 2.5 year old and a 4 year old. They both understand that they can approach one of my dogs but that they must keep away from the other nervous rescue dog. I often say that we don't go near barney as it makes him feel sad/scared and he might bite. The toddler definitely understands and 99% of the time doesn't go near him. If she's overexcited or having a tantrum I'll just separate them as she doesn't listen to a word I'm saying at that point 😂

If you punish harshly he will resent the dog more and it could make this worse.

If he won’t stop after being told then rehome the dog. Totally remove the issue - he may still behave I’m this way but at least it won’t then affect an innocent animal and you can deal with it without risk of your child also being hurt

@HerMammy i’m not casual about it! That’s why I came here for advice. I know I need to learn what to do to help control the situation. I have learned that yelling doesn’t work, but that doesn’t mean to say that I don’t deal with this firmly or pull him away, of course I do but I’m not finding that it’s not easing up.

@Rachaelrachael thanks for your understanding. I thought I was getting somewhere with my son by saying that when the dog jumps/barks he is saying “no” and wants to be left alone as he may hurt you. When I ask my son in calmer moments he explains this back to me really well so he does get it. But he gets into these overexcited moments and it’s like he’s looking for mischief. Sometimes it’s something small like pouring a bit of water onto the floor and looking for my reaction, and sometimes it can be running towards the dog. I think my only option is to physically separate them at all times until he grows up enough to be able to be calmer around him. To be clear I don’t leave them unsupervised, but my son’s mood can change in an instance and sometimes I’m a few seconds behind him before I can remove him.

@BertieBotts thanks, I found it interesting. I think point 4 is the really important one for us, as it’s the fanfare that is caused by me removing him, telling him off etc as he knows it pushes my buttons. I like this sentence a lot : “ The dog is just not available, but you are still calm, friendly and kind”

You have to teach your child to take no for an answer from you asap.

You identified the problem in your own follow up post ‘I give in to him too quickly’

They will push every button you have and make some for you on the way. They’re experimenting with what’s possible and despite how it feels sometimes statistically speaking it’s unlikely they’re actually a psychopath.

I have never met you but from what I’ve said you need to work on the tone and delivery of your ’NO!’ And your consistency of follow up if they try to run the riot.
If you’re not leading with confidence you’re running round after then doing damage limitation

You can do it, it may involve a few stand offs but the stronger you are from the start the easier that process will be

Please, before he is a full grown man who think he can kick off to change no for an answer

Also give him a positive way to interact with the dog a non power game like fetch or whatever your dogs love languages and sons needs meet

when the unwanted behaviour happens redirect to the chosen behaviour. Everytime, immediately, without hesitation and move on, don’t eye him up like you think he will fight back get onto something else

He needs to say sorry to the dog everytime

@SomePosters yes that’s exactly it! I am doing damage limitation. I find myself flailing around in the dark sometimes with parenting stuff and constantly question myself. My husband is only home intermittently and our lifestyles are very disruptive (long story, army) and I often don’t have the confidence to lead and I’m falling short. I find it a difficult line to tread between being firm but not shouty, gentle but not permissive.

You need to be firmer with your child he is two and running rings around you, rehome the poor dog

Poor dog. He's not a fking toy. Rehome him

I'd put the kid on reins so he couldn't terrorise your rescue dog. It's not fair and If he did it at home I'd take a toy away from him and tell him it was because he was being nasty to the dog. Each time he did it I'd put him on a chair on his own with no toys for 2 mins and make a fuss of the dog. Put up a stair gate to keep your son from terrorising your dog. I'd also tell him if he acts like a bully he will have to go in the pushchair as he can't be trusted.

Wow, I agree with pp that some of these responses are because it’s a rescue dog. This is a 2 year old doing normal 2 year old exploring of the world. Yes, something needs to happen, which the op is fully aware of, and there’s some good advice here about redirecting, talking about dog’s emotions and obviously keeping them apart at times to protect both the toddler and the dog. But some of the replies are positively draconian in terms of how some posters think is good parenting of a two year old.

With all we know about child development and what works, I’m really not sure about comments advising op to grow a backbone and get angry at her two year old.

I remember my dd at 2.5 - she often scratched her baby brother and acted out at times because she couldn’t regulate her emotions. An adult shouting wouldn’t have helped with this.

Op, you seem to have been very good at paying attention to the constructive replies and taking the others with a pinch of salt. I get it’s emotive and people may feel upset at the thought of a rescue dog feeling anxious in a place it’s meant to be safe, but this is a 2 year old. I think some of us forget what kids are actually like at that age.

Also op, the very fact you’re posting here means you do care, and I can tell you’ve already been trying stuff, not just wringing your hands, sighing and letting a dog be abused (you’ve already said the dog seeks out the toddler for play sometimes). It’s hard on this forum, things can become black and white when they’re actually not.

I’d advise to get a plan of action that you’re happy with and most importantly stick with it. Nothing’s going to work instantly but I think consistency is key. Instant consequences, anticipation and removing temptation, age appropriate emphasising how the dog feels and separation when you’re not present seems a good route to take.

One of the things DS loved at that sort of age (and still does) was doing some ‘training’ with the dog. Old dog was trained to do a formal retrieve, so I would get DS to ‘train him’ with that (with me standing there to give hand signals when he wasn’t looking 😄). It was a nice way for them to bond, and to reinforce acceptable behaviour from DS. Just thinking if your child enjoys playing with the ball, maybe you could do something similar. It gives your son an alternative, nice way to interact with the dog. Will your dog hunt out a treat or a toy? Get your DS to hide one in the house somewhere (obviously you supervise) then set the dog off to find it. Games like that, where there’s no physical contact (a ball throwing game can eventually lead to nipped fingers with the excitement, IME) are great for keeping everyone amused for w while.

@Harrjenk I think you are being very very naive to state your toddler won’t get bitten. ANY dog is capable of biting if provoked in the right way, but especially a rescue dog.

I agree with all the posters who have provided excellent advice re separation tactics.

The key is strong and consistent proactive measures which simply don’t allow a situation to arise where your toddler can be in contact with your dog. And you need to keep this up for some time until they can be taught proper respectful and gentle interaction.

Punishing your toddler is being reactive not proactive - firstly toddlers cannot regulate themselves so it’s not going to be very effective and secondly punishment will be too late if that’s the time your dog reacts by biting.

This being Mumsnet, I am surprised no one has suggested rehoming your toddler.

I think you need them either separate or you 100% supervising, not just being near them but actually within grabbing range and eyes on them. If that is unsustainable, you may need to re-home the dog or get some doggy daycare for respite

Mine is an unpopular opinion but this is what a short, sharp wallop to the backside would cure.

It wouldn’t cure it at all. It might stop it in that instant but it wouldn’t stop it happening and it would probably lead to other issues and problems.

Children won’t learn patience, kindness, understanding and calmness through physical force or cruelty.

'Children won’t learn patience, kindness, understanding and calmness through physical force or cruelty.'

..neither will a dog.