School handling of "racist incident"

[Valentinaz]

My DS is 7 years old. I got a phone call from school Friday evening saying that he has been involved in a "racist incident". I was obviously massively shocked and concerned as my son isn't even really aware of racism at his age, he has Kenyan cousins and has been around minority groups all of his life. I couldn't imagine what had happened so I phoned for a conversation to gather the facts.

On speaking with the head teacher she has stated that a child of a minority group has walked into the boys toilets and my son has said that they shouldn't be in there as its the boys toilets and they are a girl. (the child had long hair in a bun) On speaking to him he genuinely mistook the child for a girl and he has said he was confused and was only trying to do the "right thing" by telling the child this was the boys toilets.

At the same time, he was supposedly having a conversation with a friend in the toilets about animals and has talked about monkeys and how they don't belong in zoos they belong in the wild. He was speaking to another child who is his friend completely unrelated to the previous conversation. I'd like to just make it clear that my son doesn't know how the word monkey relates in any way to disgusting racist remarks. He has no idea how the word connects in any way. He still doesn't. Im not even sure if this is what really happened as it sounds so unbelievable.

Aparrently another child has overheard the conversation and has told a teacher about this, my son has now been punished and the school have stated they are doing a report on the incident as it was racist.

I feel absoloutly mortified by the whole situation. There were no adults present during any of this, this is all based on what the other two children present have told the head teacher. My son still, even after trying to explain to him, doesn't really understand what he has been punished for, he says he was only trying to tell the child it was the boys toilets.

On speaking to the school I've been told that they've already made the decision and a report will go on file about it and it's not my decision wether it's reported in this way. I feel this could have been handled by a simple conversation with my son about how we don't comment on others appearances and to explain how it could have hurt someone's feelings and an apology from him to the other child. Not a report which is sent to the govorners to say this was racist?

I feel so upset about this I've cried all Friday evening about the way it's been handled, I am livid that they are trying to say he has been racist.... Am I reading too much into it? Should I just let them get on with it or should I be taking some advice?

I'd like some thoughts from others on this if possible. I honestly feel like I don't want to send him to school tomorrow, I feel like they're trying to peg him as this awful child. There is no truth to this being in any way racially charged. This was a young child making a genuine mistake, he even now if asked will say he got into trouble for saying a boy was a girl..

I've tormented myself over this, what do I do? 😭

Well yeah TheresaCrowd he did say you look like a girl. Because he's seven and obviously wasn't sure! Jesus why are you treating a seven year old child's thought process like a fully grown adults?

I'm not and that's the thing you don't seem understand.

He was in the middle of a wee at the urinal and said "Wait, wait you look like a girl"?

If you want to believe that it's your prerogative but I think you should open your eyes and your mind a little bit.

Edited to say if you want to believe he wasn't teasing the child, that's your prerogative.

The hair incident might've been more believable if he hadn't said that monkeys belong in a zoo.

But he didn't say that, in fact according to the op he said the opposite. So you've either misread what the op said, or made up something out of your own head. And based on that, you've decided the op's son must have been racist.

I understand perfectly. He said you look like a girl, meaning he wasn't sure. And he told the child that if they were a girl they shouldnt be in the boys toilets. Which is logically correct.

Where he went wrong is to assume, that the child was a girl. But he wasn't racist. It has nothing to do with race and everything to do with the fact that the child looked like a girl.

He was spoken to about it, hopefully he won't make that mistake again. But it wasn't racist.

I aked dp if 2 pics of boys with long hair were boys or girls and he said girls. I find it w
Very annoying when children or their parents etc get upset if mis sexed when they go against the norm. They can have whatever hair they want but dont get upset with young boys they do look like girls if they are thin.
Anyway white people are allowed to discuss monkeys or any other animal. It is not racist. That would be actually calling someone one.
Also will mis genedering the boy go on his file - when the kid is assuming it is intentional.

Dd at 7 was told off harshly by a ta (and was quite upset) because she accidentally called a boy a girl. It is all so unnecessary that is a failure by the teachers as it should be ' oh i see you are upset, the child x has misspoken oops, run along. The kid didnt look like a girl and dd knew he wasnt. Its akin to calling by wrong name.

Dd1 had an issue with the only mixed race child in her year. It might seem like racism - no! The kid does something annoying (which dd would hate whichever child it is).
The same kid hapoens to not be popular again its not race related, they are young in year and pretty immature
If we blame race in instances its not we cant resolve actual issues.

So in op instance - blame race,
ignore the fact kid doesnt recognise all of kids in school
Ignore why loitering chatting in toilets
Havent explained to child that some religions boys have long hair
But also some boys just choose to.
Maybe need to phrase things more politely so 'are you sure you are in right place..' Rather thsn possibly 'you are in the wrong toilets'
Havent explained to op kid that sometimes people only overhear part of concersation and maybe misunderstand
People who dont know you are more likely to jump to conclusions

We often get issues with school and sen dc dont react as you might expect. Some kids try to blame others. A sen child wpuld for eg not explain away them talking about monkeys would more likely say yes after x child came in we started talking about monkeys.

If he had called a white boy a girl then it would be logged as an issue related to race.
Your son isn't racist but was involved in an incident that has to be logged as an issue related to race. It's not on some file that he is a racist.
I don't know if gender related incidents are logged (I know that children have a biological sex not gender but I've never heard anyone use the word missexing)

@Scirocco they have single sex toilets, just very rarely changing rooms. Older primary children do often change separately, e.g. at different times or in different spaces but not necessarily in dedicated changing rooms.

It sounds like your son was being mean to another student. How big is the school? Would he not at second glance realise the child is not a girl.

Kids age 3/4 make fun of boys with long hair in one of the nurseries and schools my nephew goes to. It isn't unusual at that small age to tease.

The monkey conversation might have been unrelated, but regardless of that conversation it does sound like he was being mean.

I'd rather you didn't comment if you're just going to make assumptions. He wasn't being mean. He's genuinely mistaken a boy for a girl.

He's told me everything he has said, admitted it all. He's repeatedly said I was trying to do the "right thing" by telling a girl they weren't allowed in the boys toilet. So he's genuinely thought this child was a girl. People are just picking at the language when it's a seven year old child were talking about here... He's got the brain capacity of a seven year old... Not an adult.

He is of course capable of thinking a boy is a girl. As we all are in the right circumstance.

Sorry but it's a post on Mumsnet. You will get all kind of comments.

I'm not saying your child is a mean child but all kids have the capacity to be mean and all kids are mean at some point.

I guess you know your child best. Wait to hear from all parties and what comments were made from other kids present too. It's quite unusual for the "victim" child and another random child to fabricate an entire story if they aren't friends.

That's exactly what I thought.

I went to a very diverse school. I knew by the age of 7 why some Sikh boys had their hair in a knot and that it was a religious practice. This was 50 odd years ago and we had no formal education about the cultures of our classmates at all

I think you need to not go in guns blazing or defensive with the school but with an open mind about what might have happened.

So what did he say about the boy’s hair, if he’s admitted everything to you? You said he made a comment about his hair, and you told him not to comment on people’s appearance.

So what did he say?

What's the difference between being "slapped with a report" and something being "reported"?
Because I'm assuming that's a metaphorical slap which is relating to how you feel about the matter, and then it's been reported to you in any case.

Or do you mean it should be basically left to the alleged perpetrator's parent to deal with based on their own views of the situation?

Just keep an open mind @Valentinaz. Always the best way. Keep your powder dry until you have all the information. Remember though-racism does not depend on intent.

To bully, you have to intend to bully

No that's a dangerous misconception, which is basically trying to say that bullies are inherently bad people, but actually all children have the capacity for bullying behaviour whether they intend it or not.
I hope this incident and this thread changes your attitude to behaviour and discipline because I can be sure it's going to actually be your child that is damaged the most by your ways of thinking.

for starters you need to disabuse him of the notion that long hair= girl. That's the start of a slippery slope you don't want him on.

You're defensive, for sure, OP, because these things are hard to hear about our own children. The best bet is to make sure the school handle it in an age appropriate way.

But i am not 100% convinced that he and his friends are so innocent as you think.

Bloody hell, its a report, your child hasnt been paraded through the streets having veggies thrown at him.

As others have said, you need to look at this through the lens of people who experience racism daily. Even if your child didnt mean it or understand, how do you think the other kid feels?

I think a pp makes a very valid point about the wording. 'You look like a girl' does come across as having a bit of a nasty edge as opposed to 'you're a girl'. I'm not saying that your DS was meaning to be nasty at all, but it could certainly have been interpreted that way by a child who is accustomed to fending off comments about his appearance and therefore on high alert.

Seriously? Wow, I did not know things had changed that much. My very ordinary primary school had single sex changing rooms and toilets, as did every school my teacher relatives have ever worked in.

That was surprising to me too. My primary had a shared "cloak room" for KS1, toilets attached, sinks, places to hang bags and coats, mixed sex.

In KS2, this changed to one cloakroom/toilets for girls, and one for boys. We would change in them.

Although, my DC current school they don't change for PE at school, they just go in their PE clothes to school, less time wasted.

Reading this thread is amazing how naive people are about what kids know.
I gave my 3.5 year old some old CDs and a cd player to play with including a lily Allen one. He'd only ever been at home and to the childminder, and to a little preschool for 2 days a week.

He very quickly found the song called "fuck you" and put it on and started singing it to see what my reaction was, he was very pleased with those words.

I was very surprised and would have been convinced he'd never heard those words, but not only he had heard them but he knew they had shock value.

That's what DS was like at 7yo.
Didn't know what racism was.
We live in a 95% white area.
DS read the N-word (I now know you can't spell it out on MN or they delete your post) in a Michael Morpugo book.
DS was angry at some boys & called them the N-word. Because the part DS understood was that the N-word was a nasty insult.
The teacher ends up telling me this.
Teacher was a visible minority.
Sigh.
DS had impulse control problems.
When school told everyone "meet Henry our new pupil. Henry has autism and doesn't like people to touch him. Please don't touch Henry."
As soon as the Assembly was over 6yo DS went up & touched Henry.
So imagine if I explained to DS what the N-word was and why not to use it. And other racist words I could have told him about.
Sometimes you can't win !!

ps: years later when Henry was being integrated into main school, DS was one of the few kids who could be paired off to do activities with Henry because DS wasn't afraid to touch Henry.
pps: I am foreign myself

Wow!

You tell your DC to eyeroll if another child has been discriminated against because of the colour of his skin?

Do you teach your DC to eyeroll shorter kids, larger kids, disabled kids? Or just kids with a different skin colour?