DS(8) lonely at school lunch times

[SidonieBaker]

My DS is 8, year 3 - he says he enjoys school apart from lunch times, when he's really lonely as no one wants to play with him

We had a long chat this evening as it's parents evening tomorrow, and I asked if there was anything he thought Miss Smith (teacher - not her real name!) would tell me about him, or if there was anything he wanted me to talk to her about... he said the other boys in his class won't let him play with them at lunch time, they push him away and he ends up wandering around on his own. For context: his class is mostly girls (who he doesn't want to play with!), the boys are heavily into football (which he isn't!), and I'm not sure if 'pushing him away' is strictly accurate or if they just don't let him join in... but either way, it's making him hate school.

Could anyone suggest anything I can do to help? I believe the school did have a buddy bench but it isn't used now (I've already suggested it to him), and there aren't any lunch time clubs he could join, as something like a computing/ Lego/ drawing club would have been ideal for him. At a push I could collect him and take him home for an hour to have lunch there, but I don't think school encourage (allow?!) that any more. It's just such a shame that it's colouring his entire experience, and I'm not even sure what the teacher could do to help; I know they have lessons about 'being kind', 'playing nicely' etc, but I imagine these boys just don't want him to join in because he isn't actually very good at football, and presumably no one can make them include him...

Oh it's really sad to hear that from your child.

I also have a 9yr old boy who really does not like football. When his friends are playing football he will find someone else to play with, or he plays with the girls. I'm sure not all the boys are playing football, can you gently encourage him to seek out some other children to spend time with, ask to join in another game. Even if it's not his year group.

He's certainly not unusual! In this day and age, it's OK in general for boys not to be into football. It sounds like your kid just happens to be in a place where most boys do play football.

That might not sound like a useful thing to say, but what I'm getting at is that you won't be lying if you sit him down and explain that he's normal and that it's OK not to be into football. I think you should do that regularly and really focus on finding after-school activities he does enjoy so that he feels part of something. Would he be into art of music? Or some other kind of sport--martial arts, basketball, table tennis?

The other advice I have is to encourage him to play with the girls! This would be a good time to say, "well, if you don't want to play football and want to play with people, you don't want to turn your nose up at the girls!"

I'm sure there must be girls who would want to play tag or gossip. At my school, there were a few boys who would go off to play football, but most kids (boys and girls) were running around playing tag or talking. Tell him to give the girls a try.

Thanks @Invisimamma - I've suggested that he plays with the only two boys in his class who don't like football (just two!), but I think they are very much best friends and don't invite him to play either! The year groups don't seem to mix much either, as far as I can tell they are often separated by time and/ or area anyway, so he couldn't play with those kids all the time even if he had friends in those years.

I'm stumped really! His class is 2/3 girls (just counted them up!), every time a boy leaves a girl has joined, which disappoints him. I mean I'm sure the girls are lovely and he gets on with them individually, but he doesn't want to play 'girls games', which I get too.

There's such an expectation that boys will enjoy football, at least to some extent - he goes to a computing camp in the holidays and loves it, such a shame there's no similar clubs at his school!

My 8 year old is shy and struggles to make friends. In his old school (year 3) the boys were a bit hit and miss so he hung out with the girls quite a lot but there isn’t much of this at his new school (year 4), boys and girls play apart, it could be their age. Lunchtime football is brutal, you’re only allowed to play if you’re good. He’s not bothered about football and they are allowed to bring in Top Trumps cards which has revolutionised his school experience, all those that don’t play football play Top Trumps instead. Perhaps you could speak to the school to see if they could permit this? It’s a good conversation starter for them and has really helped with friendships.

I had one that hated football too. Luckily he had a couple of boys that felt the same and they played together, often joined by a group of girls.
It may be worth talking to the teacher at parents evening to make her aware this is making your ds unhappy, out of all the girls in the class there must be a few who don’t like gossip and ‘girls’ games and would like to play with ds. Hopefully the teacher will suggest a couple of girls he can play with.
when my ds went to senior school his two best friends were girls as he couldn’t find any boys to hang out with that didn’t play footie!

Why aren't there any lunchtime clubs? Could you offer to start one?

Honestly, I think it would be a great lesson for him to learn to work with what he has! Which is girls and those two boys who seem to like each other's company. I think you should encourage him to approach them all. Maybe with @CalamityJaney's excellent suggestion to start a new activity.

I went to a school so small that it was either play with who was around or play with no one. Your son is in essentially the same situation if he doesn't want to play football. He needs to learn to get along with the people he has. He'll be so grateful he did learn when he goes on a foreign exchange trip or to university or to work with people very different from himself and can talk to everyone.

I'll definitely encourage him again to try the girls and the two boys @Antst - I think his confidence has been knocked so much now that he's reluctant to try, especially as (in his opinion!) they're not playing anything he considers fun - but I imagine there are kids there that he would get on with, if he didn't want to hang around with the footballers!

Sadly the school don't allow any sort of card games etc @CalamityJaney, I assume just because of too much previous squabbling, otherwise he'd have loved something like that.

Unfortunately it's not an option for me to run a lunch time club @CuteCillian but I've suggested to the school a few times that they could have more non-sport options; they're pretty good on the whole and offer things like drama and art too, but only after school clubs at the moment, not lunch time.

Thanks @Beautifulsunflowers, I'll definitely mention it to Miss Smith tomorrow. She may not be able to help but it might be worth saying just in case DS has another major 'I don't want to go to school' wobble!

DS does go to some clubs outside school but they are sports - swimming, judo, basketball - and there isn't much opportunity to make friends there either, beyond a friendly hello. He used to go to a fab local tech club which he loved and made a couple of friends there, but it shut down a couple of years ago and we've yet to find something similar

Yes, it does sound like his confidence has been knocked from what you're saying. Maybe he is apprehensive to approach the other kids.

That said, you're doing everything right (taking an interest, getting him into after-school activities) and I think it'll pay off at some point. Maybe there's an activity that is better for making friends (Scouts? Woodland Folk?).

Hope the meeting with the teacher goes well. Some schools deal with this by banning football. This isn't obviously the best option, but they (and the lunchtime supervisors) really ought to be stepping up to make sure that children aren't excluded at lunchtime and playtime. How big is the school? Are there other classes in his year group, or can he mix with the Y4s as well?

I doubt all the girls are playing 'girls' games' (what is a girls' game?!) and some of them will also want to play football and won't be getting the chance. There are so many other things kids can play (not least tag, as has been suggested) and it seems sad that the school aren't making an effort here.

I went through a phase at 8 or 9 when I wandered about the playground and lunch time and break and didn't want to join in with things and was happy just mooching about making up my own stories in my head. If he wants to join in and isn't being included though that is sad. I think school could do a lot more here. My teachers back then certainly noticed me being on my own and were a bit concerned, though I was actually fine! Going through a particularly dreamy and imaginative phase.

Also I sometimes found DDs reported they hadn't played with anyone and when I went in to do something at the school I'd quite often see them in the playground tearing about and laughing with others.

One time they had a skipping initiative which was quite good and the whole school got really into it.

Definitely talk to school about it as there might be other options. Our primary has a 'friendship club' which I think you have to be invited to attend but you can bring a friend. I think it is aimed at kids who struggle with lunchtime like your son. Some SEN but others aren't. We also have year 6 children who are 'buddies' who are supposed to look out for kids struggling to find someone to play with.

Another idea, is there a toy he could take in? Obviously not his favorite but something he could entertain himself with but also might be a good way to find someone who likes the same sort of things - eg he might find one of the girls into dinosaurs/action toys or whatever. And if not, at least he has something to play

Poor lad. Your DS' school needs to be doing more to support him. About 1.5 years of a child's primary school life is spent at playtime / lunchtimes so they really need to focus on making it a positive experience for everyone.

I know this is drastic but would you consider changing school? I suffered from the same fate at primary school and honestly it wrecked my self-esteem and made me really miserable.

We had similar with our DS when he was a little bit younger. Broke my heart to hear he'd been upset one break time because he had nobody to play with.

We did mention it to his teachers who said they'd keep an eye on it. I think they'd encourage him to join in with others and others to join in with him. We've mentioned it to every teacher he's had since just to make sure he's doing ok socially and they all say he has a nice little friendship group now.

DS and his friends like to read (they'll occasionally take in books to read together at break), they play chess (the school has a giant chess board in the yard to encourage the kids to play), they draw and play games together. Not the most exciting activities in the world but his current teacher got it right when he said to us when kids are a little introverted it takes longer for their shared interests to come out.

A school I used to work at brought out old / spare PE equipment not used for lessons at lunchtimes (mismatched balls, hula hoops etc - things which were fairly indestructible for free play with less supervision than a lesson, not likely to get lost) so there was something to do, even for the ones who didn't have many friends or enjoy team games. The kids then sometimes played alongside each other and got chatting, could be encouraged to play catch for example with someone they don't really know. Could you ask if that is an option, or ask the PTA (if there is one) if they'd be willing to use funds for it? Or seek donations from local sports clubs maybe. It would encourage more children to be active as well as encourage friendships

I learnt to juggle in the playground when I had no one to play with after my best friend left. I ended up with a little group of mostly boy juggling friends who didn't like football either

We had something maybe similar to this. Not the same because it was an unhealthy / bullying friendship rather than a lack of friendship. When we spoke with the teacher she was already aware of the issue - that might make your conversation easier - what she did was instigate some team games in the school yard at lunch time and break time to be more inclusive. I wonder if that might be an option?

This was exactly what my primary school was like. Every boy was into football except two who stuck together like glue. New boys either joined football or didn't stay for very long tbh. Could he get involved with the football games like keepy uppy or headers games

I'd encourage him to start asking children to play tag or similar. You just need a few to start playing and then lots of girls and boys from all years will want to join in.
I'd also be encouraging him to play with girls and boys from all years, not just restricting himself to the 29 other children from his class.

You could be writing about my DS at that age! Exactly the same. Everyone else seemed to be into football, the only other techy boy wasn't a twin soul (we had him round for a play date a couple of times but they didn't click) and he was a bit adrift. I don't know how helpful this is, but our school were really good in the end and did a lot to help him get through.

The school had a nurture curriculum and started a lunchtime chat hut where you could go if at a loose end - it was particularly pitched to kids who might have trouble with social interaction (ND, shyness, new to the school, whatever) but nobody was excluded. Bigger, slightly more structure version of the friendship bench, I think. There were puzzles, Lego, toys etc. That did allow him to find a couple of friends in the year above, and make some connections.

He's at high school this year and to my relief has found a tribe almost immediately - it's just a bigger pond and he now has a bunch of kids who go to comics club, play Minecraft together, or just chat. Oddly, a couple are from the other class at his primary, but they never really knew each other before. The football fad seems to have cooled a bit, or at least it's not the only thing; some of the previous football-crazy lads are in the Minecraft group.

The chat hut is still going but a bit of a victim of its own success - my ND daughter says it is too noisy for her because it is now so popular! But she has more friends and only needs it on off days.

Could he take some sort of Notebook and pencil and do drawings at lunchtime? Or take a Marvel/DC comic or a book and read?

Im not sure how your school would be about this but how about asking if there could be lunch time clubs set up? If for example there was a Lego club that one of the ta’s, a teacher or maybe a parent could help with just once a week even it would give those children something to do on that day but also maybe create friendships, possibly even with the girls! Not all girls at that age will be playing ‘girls games’. Could be open to different year groups eg. Lower school and upper school or whatever.
When I was a teacher it was something that I used to do. Would eat lunch in the classroom with the kids. I would have the first 20 mins free to sort my life out because the kids were eating, it just worked.

OP I hope I get you before parents' night. My DS3 (now11) has always struggled socially due to ASD & ADHD. The school have always been fantastic & after I enquired whether there was a quieter, more structured place he could access at breaks & lunch they started Lego club.

The staff all do their turn & it's overseen by the DHT, who is great, making the point that she doesn't lunch then anyway as she's on supervision somewhere or other, so may as well be at Lego club. DS3 loves it & socialises with kids of all ages. He still struggles in class at times - and will never have close friends- but being sociable has been so, so good for him.

Please ask school if they could set up a club of some sort. I'm sure there'll be plenty other kids who would also love it.

DS1 & DS2 would have been those tearing around/ playing sports in the playground, but would never have excluded people. That needs addressed as it's unkind & should be challenged by staff in primary. I know the type- football alphas who think they're a mini Messi & playing with someone who's not as skilled would be beneath them (I'll bet most of them encouraged by dad who 'Could've been a contender' 🙄 . So predictable).

That sounds just like my DS2, he was not into football and all the boys in his small school were. The one other boy who wasn't into it moved schools.

Honestly? It didn't get better until we moved to Australia and football, of any variety, is not played as intensely at lunchtimes at schools here.

I would suggest moving him to a larger school if you can so that he has a chance of meeting other boys who aren't into football. It's a numbers game. The more children there are the better chance he has if meeting other children with similar interests.

My daughter had real friendship issues from age 4-8 - just didn't find her feet or friends, despite making friends very easily outside of school. She spent 6 weeks having 'counselling' with the school councillor - play based/confidence building, it may not be apparent to you but projecting unhappiness can make kids not want to play with them (as rough as that is) and a certain level of contentment can make them more appealing to be friends with (I'm probably not putting it into the right words but hope you understand what I mean). She is now really happy and settled nicely into a friendship group. Not advice but wanted to say hang in there - it can be turned around :) and could this kind of thing help him?