If you don't qualify the the 30hrs- do you tell people?!

[WhatToDoAboutTheNosys]

MN please don't come at me with stealth boast accusations! I know we are in a very fortunate position but I do have a genuine question.

We have a toddler and my DH earns just over 100k, so we don't qualify for the 30hrs of childcare funding that will come into place soon. He's the sole earner and pays a very big chunk of tax, I grew up on benefits with a single parent family and I find it very surprising that with his income we are in a great comfortable position, but certainly not rolling in it like I would have imagined someone with this income would be.

When I'm chatting with people about childcare/preschool they say oh yeah you'll get your 30 hours, the thing is we aren't and we don't have the money to pay for those hours, so he won't be going in for them!

With acquaintances I just not and say uh huh, but with friends and family it's hard to have an honest conversation about our options and the hours he'll do without telling them how much he earns. Which I'd rather not do!

If anybody is in the same situation what do you do? If people we're close to start asking why we're not putting him in for his hours (he'll continue just with 1 day at childminder) shall I use say I don't want all of that time apart from him?!

Or if you found out your friend or family was on a salary like that would you see them differently? In the past I wonder if I'd have judged them thinking surely you must have so much free cash and are being tight, it might change my whole perception of them?

I don't want to get a job just to pay for him to go in fir the 30hrs in case that's suggested, I'm in the amazing position that I get to spend this time with him while he's young and I don't have a profession so it would be minimum wage that would be eaten by the nursery fees!

Both 15 and 30 hours start the term after they turn 3 you can use them at the childminders.

I just say 'oh I don't qualify'

@WhatToDoAboutTheNosys I will let you into a secret - the vast majority of other parents don’t really care if you send you child to nursery or not, whether you “qualify” for something or not, what your family income is, whether you are a sahm or not etc etc.
You will get some conversions about what nursery/school you might plan to send your child to - but that’s just generic small talk really.
You don’t need to worry about what people will think if you “qualify” or not - because really….they don’t care.
(I don’t mean that to sound rude but it’s true)
🙂

It was full time so 9- 3 so I guess the £50 is to cover the extra 15 hours.

This.

DH earns over the threshold but he's putting the max contributions in to his pension.

I guess we were in the sane position re, child benefit. The assumption being that we would get that and of course we didn’t.

I think you’re going to have to decide whether you want to admit you don’t quality or make out you can’t find a provider that works for you.

What I would say to you is a preschool setting, even for a few mornings a week, is invaluable in helping to prepare your child for school. So it might be worth paying for that yourself (and pretending those are your free hours).

The system screws over parents where one earns 100-125k I understand. After 125k the balance tips is what I've been told. Doubt I'll ever be paid that much though.
I know it seems unfair that a couple where both work get a better deal but they are both working. That's the deal isn't it. If you're not working, except where there's a disability, why would you need subsided childcare?
The child benefit limit really annoys me. The 50k would now be 65k if it'd risen with inflection.

@Viggooooh I suppose that makes sense if parents opt for the full day.
To be honest though the morning and afternoon sessions were pretty much the same activities so any full timers just did everything twice so most children didn’t do a full day.

@RudsyFarmer a child doesn’t really need “preparation for school” until they are old enough for their 15 hour entitlement.
Early Years Foundation Stage (Nursery Class age 3-4, Reception age 4-5) is the preparation for school.

Loads of people who qualified couldn't use the hours at our preschool - there weren't enough places.

We didn't get them as I was a SAHM at that point.

You can explain you're not getting the hours without discussing your household income.

This has come up a few times with me.

I normally just say 'we don't qualify' and if people are pushy just say 'we still won't qualify when I'm working.'

I actually find the whole system unfair for the following reasons:

1. 2x people on £99k qualify for this. Total household income - £11,078 pcm. 1x person on £110k - £5,904 - do not qualify.
2. I know people say you can pay into your pension yadada - but this is capped, and also many people in their 30s do not want to pay lots of money into their pension and have it locked away for 25+ years through many changes in rules and increase in time limits. There is also a pension cap at the moment, that people who forward load their pension may accidentally breach.
3. Then people say - well they have a SAHP so don't need childcare. Well what about the following:
4. They could be a single parent. All the taxes, none of the benefits, no SAHP making everything easier at home.
5. The SAHP could actually want to work, but in a relatively low earning job and struggle to earn more than childcare if they do work. Or they could be a career changer and need to volunteer etc before securing a new role. Making it universal wouldn't affect high earners who are choosing to have a SAHP, but it would benefit those who are on career breaks and looking to return, or low earners.
6. People on maternity leave are still entitled to 30 hours and taxfree childcare, despite being at home with their new baby - as I pointed out to an acquaintance (who would have had a good maternity package as was a civil servant) what is the difference between us now (2 young children including a baby) except she had tax-free childcare/30 hours and I didn't. She didn't like that.
7. My husband pays an absolutely enormous amount of tax - being excluded from a time-limited benefit that would be enormously useful to help me return to work is quite galling.

The formatting has gone funny on the post above, it was meant to be more like this:

2x people on £99k qualify for this. Total household income - £11,078 pcm. 1x person on £110k - £5,904 - do not qualify.
I know people say you can pay into your pension yadayada - but this is capped, and also many people in their 30s do not want to pay lots of money into their pension and have it locked away for 25+ years through many changes in rules and increase in time limits. There is also a pension cap at the moment, that people who forward load their pension may accidentally breach.

Then people say - well they have a SAHP so don't need childcare. Well what about the following:

1. They could be a single parent. All the taxes, none of the benefits, no SAHP making everything easier at home.
2. The SAHP could actually want to work, but in a relatively low earning job and struggle to earn more than childcare if they do work. Or they could be a career changer and need to volunteer etc before securing a new role. Making it universal wouldn't affect high earners who are choosing to have a SAHP, but it would benefit those who are on career breaks and looking to return, or low earners.
3. People on maternity leave are still entitled to 30 hours and taxfree childcare, despite being at home with their new baby - as I pointed out to an acquaintance (who would have had a good maternity package as was a civil servant) what is the difference between us now (2 young children including a baby) except she had tax-free childcare/30 hours and I didn't. She didn't like that.

My husband pays an absolutely enormous amount of tax - being excluded from a time-limited benefit that would be enormously useful to help me return to work is quite galling.

What is the difference morally between putting money in a pension so you go below £100k and only working 16 hours to qualify for UC? There isnt any.

On the point of state school nurseries... they can charge for care between the morning and afternoon sessions, as well as before and after school care... for example...

8.00-8.45 £2 (including breakfast)
8.45-11.45 free
11.45- 12.30 £2 (plus lunch £2 or bring own)
12.30 -3.30 free
3.30-5.30 £5

Which is what happens at my kids school... the early and late sessions is the same price as the before and after school club. Parents don't have to use the paid sessions (including the lunch one if they are in all day!)

I think it's changed now because money is so tight and it's reasonable to do so. People know they're entitled to 30 hours. I know we're getting 45 minutes a day over this. Therefore they warrant charging me for 45 minutes and late penalties and help put money into the nursery/ school pot. It's labelled as for teaching staff but I'm not convinced they let them leave early if there's only a few kids.

I have a friend in the same position; husband earns too much for the hours. She just said they wouldn't be doing the hours as they didn't qualify. I'm not sure anyone ever really asked why... remember that people are far more hung up on the things that affect them, really. They're suggesting the 30 hours because they had them/could use them, and they are presuming everyone else is the same... it's natural. They won't be fussed that you won't use them.

OP, as others have said, I would maybe have a look at your local preschool as option instead of nursery. If you know your catchment school / infant school your child is most likely to go to there is prob a feeder preschool that does term time only. Lots of children will then all go up to reception each year knowing each other.
you can do a couple of mornings a week to start. It’s quite flexible, cheap / free with hours (usually packed lunch), really good for their socialisation and they do lots of fun things but just a few hours at a time if you want (they can come home and nap after lunch), then when you get x15 hours you can up to x1 morning and x2 full days (prob 9-3ish) or similar.
If you do just one day at nursery it can be harder for the child to settle and make friends etc as so irregular and less breaks for you! Also just to confirm so you’re aware the 15 hours are term time only so if you use them every week of the year work out 10hours ish a week

You don't need to justify yourself to anyone. X

Our school nursery (and all other local ones that I know of) only offered full time places. There was no concept of morning/afternoon sessions.

We didn’t/don’t qualify. I tended to just not correct people when they mentioned the 30 hours, but one friend dug a bit and suddenly looked at me like I had two heads when I said that there was an income cap and we were above it. It was like I’d just turned up in a flashy car. I don’t think most people are that invested though.

You don't get the 30 hours unless both parents are working anyway so no worries there. I think everyone gets 15

My son will get the 15 hours when he's 2 as I work and partner doesn't.

When I had to tell the nursery manager that we wouldn't qualify she said "oh your husband must earn a lot!". He was on about £14k a year at the time. 🙄

@Emmamoo89 I thought 15 hours for 2 year olds is usually for special circumstances (like SEN) - why would your son get it just because your partner doesn’t work?
(you don’t actually have to answer if you don’t want to - I am just nosy)

@SleepingStandingUp the thing is the 15 hours is meant to be for pre school education. The 30 hours is more for childcare.
They are different.
The EYFS curriculum I assume is based on children attending 15 hours in an educational setting.
People might be “entitled” to 30 hours of childcare but the educational part is different. People shouldn’t be using a primary school nursery class as childcare (imho).