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Original poster

My 18 year old DD has no empathy

86 replies

Lou197 · 26/01/2023 20:15

My DD has always struggled with friendships and is now in her first year of uni.

I was hoping this was going to be a new start for her but same patterns seems to be happening. Has a small group of friends but struggles and is often excluded from groups etc. I know that she does not help herself, she is very rigid, sees things in black and white and can be hard work - she is certainly not easy going!

She was very upset yesterday as they were in a lecture and told to get into groups for a term task. She was excluded from all the groups even though she considers herself to be friends with her classmates and they have all been out together for nights out. She told me there was one boy left who is often off uni as he has a problem with his leg and is currently at home or hospital. She could work with him but she did not want to as he is never there. I said maybe he is also struggling that it could be good to support each other but she said she did not want to be doing all the work on her own and him then taking credit. The other groups have said she is being unkind to him (and I agree) but she is adamant she would rather be on her own.

This just seems very cold and selfish to me and if I am thinking that as her mother I am sure others are thinking the same. I worry how she will get on in life and wonder if she is on the autisum spectrum and if so how I can help her.

In all other respects she works very hard, is very focused, can be good company and gets on well with older people rather than her peers.

Any advice??

OP posts:
ArseInTheCoOpWindow · 26/01/2023 20:24

She sounds ASD to me. Ticks all the boxes. Lack of empathy can be one of the many symptoms.

PritiPatelsMaker · 26/01/2023 20:27

She does sound as though she could have ASD to me as well. Have you ever discussed the possibility with her?

SouperNoodle · 26/01/2023 20:30

I struggle with blank and white thinking and empathy and I have borderline personality disorder. Just something to consider but as PP have said, these could also be symptoms of ASD.
It's taken a lot of work for me to try to change the way I think about things but I can function as a normal person now.

Does she have any other traits which you find unusual?

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Original poster
Lou197 · 26/01/2023 20:30

Yes I have - she says she does not have a problem. My husband is quite similar to her but recognises it in himself although he has buckets of empathy, but he might not have when he was a teen. I have offered to organise a counsellor but she is not interested.

OP posts:
Jellycats4life · 26/01/2023 20:31

I saw about five red flags for autism in your first two paragraphs. And then your final point about preferring older people to her peers - ding ding ding.

I would bet money that she is autistic.

Precipice · 26/01/2023 20:32

If the others are all in groups and she's only to be paired up with this one other student, that seems an unfair split. If everyone has 3 or more students and she's in a 2 with someone who for justifiable reasons may be absent a lot, that's a heavier burden on her than the other students.

PritiPatelsMaker · 26/01/2023 20:32

So is she just wanting to tell you that she's struggled today or does she want solutions?

It sounds as though she wants to tell you but doesn't actually want and help?

SuperLoudPoppingAction · 26/01/2023 20:33

Advice-wise, try to love the child you have rather than wishing she wasn't the way she is.
She does sound autistic.
I am, and I hated group assignments at uni.

Onnabugeisha · 26/01/2023 20:36

I agree, ASD bells are ringing.
Black/white & literal thinking
Rigid/routine only way to avoid panic.
Struggles with empathy.

I think you may have ASD as well as you are lacking empathy for your DD.

She’s just been excluded by her entire class! By people she thought were her friends. Do you know exclusion is a form of bullying? And how upsetting it is to be told no you can’t be in our group- go pair up with the only other not normal person in the class. Why should she comply with what the bullies say? I admire her for saying fuck you, I don’t need you, I can do this on my own. You won’t drag me down with your snubbing and exclusion of me.

It must really hurt too after she’s made all that effort to socialise and go on nights out to try and connect with what turned out to be turncoat friends.

But you’re thinking she is selfish? I’m not criticising you by the way, ASD runs in families especially mother to daughter. I think your reaction indicates you may have ASD too and be going by learned social rules because you struggle with empathy as well.

Original poster
Lou197 · 26/01/2023 20:36

Thanks everyone and SouperNoodle. Not really any other traits, she has a lot of good points and does have a wacky sense of humour, can always get people laughing as her laugh is really infectious. But I just worry that she cannot read the room and this will hold her back in life. She is desperate to be accepted and cannot understand why this keeps happening. If I gently try to point out reasons why I think she might be rubbing friends up the wrong way she gets very defensive.

OP posts:
Onnabugeisha · 26/01/2023 20:38

Lou197 · 26/01/2023 20:30

Yes I have - she says she does not have a problem. My husband is quite similar to her but recognises it in himself although he has buckets of empathy, but he might not have when he was a teen. I have offered to organise a counsellor but she is not interested.

She doesn’t need a counsellor, because there’s nothing wrong with her. She needs an ASD assessment so that everyone else can then accommodate her different ways of being human.

ArseInTheCoOpWindow · 26/01/2023 20:40

She doesn’t need a counsellor, because there’s nothing wrong with her. She needs an ASD assessment so that everyone else can then accommodate her different ways of being human

Totally agree. Her brain is wired differently. Sort the autism, then the rest will fall into place.

GrannyAchingsShepherdsHut · 26/01/2023 20:40

I can't offer an opinion on neurodiversity, but I'd be pissed off too if my mates were all excluding me and I was expected to do a joint project with someone who is likely to be absent a significant amount.

If her 'mates' think it's so mean to exclude him why the hell aren't they including him in their groups? Why is it OK for them to not want to work with him but not for her to not want to?
And why is it OK for them to exclude her?

They sound like a load of arseholes to me.

ArseInTheCoOpWindow · 26/01/2023 20:41

She will always struggle to read the room. This is what autism does.

She can learn how to modify it though.

Original poster
Lou197 · 26/01/2023 20:41

I totally adore my DD and told her that we all love her, am so proud of her and how of resiliant she is and agreed that it was horrible of them to exclude her. But I have to find ways for her to cope. I have no problem at all if she has ASD or if I do or any member of my family but we all have to find a way through and interact with those around us. She is upset and does not understand why this keeps happening which is why I want to help her.

OP posts:
ArseInTheCoOpWindow · 26/01/2023 20:43

She needs assessment to find out the areas with problems. There’s adult autism support and therapy. You can’t help her properly, she needs an expert

Onnabugeisha · 26/01/2023 20:46

Lou197 · 26/01/2023 20:41

I totally adore my DD and told her that we all love her, am so proud of her and how of resiliant she is and agreed that it was horrible of them to exclude her. But I have to find ways for her to cope. I have no problem at all if she has ASD or if I do or any member of my family but we all have to find a way through and interact with those around us. She is upset and does not understand why this keeps happening which is why I want to help her.

It will most often happen because people are assholes and do not understand ASD. I know you were trying to help her by suggesting what she might have done to put people off, but this is damaging if this is your go to reaction to problems she has. Yes, sometimes it can be her fault, but unless it is blatantly obvious, you need to not speculate and suggest all the things she’s done “wrong”. This makes a child feel utterly hopeless at social situations, like they can never get it right. She needs to know her classmates are asshole bullies and she did nothing to bring on being excluded by them.

Onnabugeisha · 26/01/2023 20:48

ArseInTheCoOpWindow · 26/01/2023 20:43

She needs assessment to find out the areas with problems. There’s adult autism support and therapy. You can’t help her properly, she needs an expert

This- she needs an expert. A psychologist who can give advice based on her ASD. ASD is a mosaic of traits, there is no one size fits all advice that works for people with ASD. You’ll never figure it out on your own.

dizzydizzydizzy · 26/01/2023 20:48

I'm autistic and she sounds very much like me, even down to the good sense of humour.

Try and get her an assessment. Look for somebody who specialises in girls and women. I have just had mine. The wait on the NHS is horrendous (I was quoted 41 months). I went private because I just didn't want to wait any longer . I can make a
Recommendation for SE London.
If not, go on the National Autistic Society website and you will find a list of qualified assessors.

Onnabugeisha · 26/01/2023 20:50

Too, for my DDs the ASD diagnosis got them to be able to access ASD support groups where they met other students at the school or Uni with ASD- and that’s where they made their closest, best friendships- with other ND people. She will have a better chance finding her tribe.

Original poster
Lou197 · 26/01/2023 20:53

Thanks so much for the positive answers - I will get on the case and see if she would be willing to have an assessment...

OP posts:
Jellycats4life · 26/01/2023 20:56

She is upset and does not understand why this keeps happening which is why I want to help her

That’s what a diagnosis is a gift. It’s not a case of saying “Aha! THIS is what’s wrong with you!” it’s about giving the person the self-knowledge of the way the brain works, and the self-compassion of knowing that none of the social rejection (often lifelong), the social gaffes and the fact it keeps happening isn’t her fault.

Jellycats4life · 26/01/2023 20:56

Ugh, apologies for my garbled post. Wish we could edit!

Sleepless1096 · 26/01/2023 21:00

I completely get why she doesn't want to work with this boy. Why would she want to do the work so he can share the credit? Nothing unreasonable about that.

Fwiw, I think this is poor on the part of the teaching staff. There will be lots of students who struggle socially for one reason or another. If groupwork is necessary, they should all have been assigned to a group rather than being asked to choose.

Leah5678 · 26/01/2023 21:01

This took me back to year 7 when I was always on my own for the science experiments and the teacher would tell me to basically go around the classroom begging to be in a group of three until I found some who didn't turn their noses up and reject me for being the "weird kid". This may sound like a non issue to many but it really hurt. She isn't the one being cold and selfish here.

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