Am I enabling my child to be non independent

[ghostspider]

So for a bit of back story, i have one sibling and we grew up in a home with my parents who are married. My dad is easy going and my mum is quite a stressy person/worries about everything. Growing up I was the oldest and had a lovely childhood as far as childhoods go. Me and my mum clashed a lot as I grew into my teens, and I was very lazy. I was a good kid who went to school and I was tidy etc but lazy.

My brother on the other hand was and still is horrendously lazy, neither of us were taught how to cook/clean but as I got older I learned the basics and once I had my children can cook and clean just fine. My brother cannot cook anything and doesn't clean ever, he still lives at home at 25 which is relatively young so no problem there. He doesn't wash a dish and I feel for my parents. He is insanely selfish, very sure of himself but has numerous mental health problems.. anxiety/depression which seems to have been helped with medication.

My mother is a fixer, she does everything for my brother and still tried to for me. It's quite over bearing but I am 30 now with 3 children and know how to handle her. My husband says that I am quite like my mum as in I do everything for our children and he says it's not going to help them later in life. I can see his point, she mothers my brother no end and he struggles with everyday tasks. My oldest is 7 and my youngest is newborn so I guess it's my oldest my husband is more worried about.

My question is, (if you've read this far thank you!), how much do you do for your children at that age or what do you teach your children to do for themselves? I don't think I'm doing too much.. my eldest dresses himself for school and can make a drink/cereal for himself.

I had a moment the other day when I gave him a cloth and asked him to give his school shoes a wipe over as I was tending to the baby and we didn't have much time, he looked at me and said "why can't you do it?" I didn't really know what to say other than, because I have to do something else. Now im stuck between am I doing enough or not enough! My partner's upbringing was the complete opposite of mine and he had to do everything for himself from a very young age. He thinks it's helped him as an adult.

Sorry for the long post, it's hard to know as a parent what the best thing to do is sometimes

My 8 year old DS, can get dressed, washed, teeth brushed by himself. Put a wash on, put laundry away, put the dishwasher on but needs help with loading it, can empty the dishwasher but needs help with reaching top cupboards. Can make a simple lunch i.e heat up at tin of soup (he may need help opening the tin). He doesn't necessarily do all these things often but if he wants me or dh for something he has learnt that we will get to him quicker if he helps get the chores done......sometimes he also helps out of bordem as well.

@givemushypeasachance DS does this if we let him (super dramatic - he lies on the floor and wails “why do I have to do EVERYTHING around here?” when he has just been asked to put his own shoes on).

Basically we completely ignore the dramatics, and just tell him to put his shoes on. We don’t tell him off, just keep saying “shoes on! Time to put your shoes on! You need your shoes on if we’re going swimming!” Eventually he gives up and does it, and then once he has done it we praise him for doing it.

Doesn’t do that every time, and it is getting much less frequent as he gets older. We had definite daily shoe battles when he was 4, now he is nearly 6 it only happens when he is already tired and grumpy.

@Changechangychange oh yes so super dramatic, I recognise that! If I'm helping out in the evening after school, it's definitely getting into the tired and grumpy territory so I know I don't see any of them at their best at that point. Weekends/school holidays he probably is a bit better at it. But it's a bit baffling sometimes when I'm literally there having agreed to take him out to an adventure playground, he just needs to do a wee and put his own shoes on, and that's still a battle. You want to go out to this fun place, dude, why am I here putting each shoe onto your foot and you're still moaning about doing the velcro up...

We used to do more for him because he said he didn’t know how and looked pathetic, then we discovered he was happily doing everything for himself in nursery….

It’s because they don’t get away with it there.

Your brother sounds horrendous and even though he's still young, you can guarantee that if he ever flies the nest he'll be the kind of bloke that people on here write about.

I would definitely say that now is the time to start engaging your son to start taking responsibility for simple age appropriate things such as cleaning up after himself, and build on that as he gets older.

It only gets harder as they get older and it suddenly seems like you are asking them to do what they perceive as 'your' tasks all of a sudden, I mean who wouldn't be resentful of that in their shoes?

If you end up being like your mum, it's likely you'll end up with a mini version of your brother and you definitely don't want that!

I used to work with kids. We got them to be independent as we did not have time to do everything for every child and it is good practice. When I worked with disabled children I actually had some tell me that they told their parents they could not do something that they were doing when I was looking after them.
Some kids love to be independent, some love to be babbied. But just as we would not allow a child to continue drinking from a bottle past a certain age, so we can't allow children to expect adults to still do everything for them when there is no need.
The thing with some kids where they ask adults to pass things that are right next to the child drives me crazy. That should be nipped in the bud.

Get a chore chart for the week Easy simple age appropriate chores.
Some for himself ie making his bed, Cereal bowl at the sink or in dishwasher.
Some for others. Ie offering you & daddy a juice if pouring himself one, handing you nappies or wipes when you're dealing with the baby.

Have stars & a small prize (comic or extra half hour of tablet time for example) for doing all chores & a big fuss made of how helpful and grown up he is

I'm not sure about all that reward and OTT praise. It can imply that it's a BIG favour they're doing, rather than simply being part of the family team.

So I wouldn't (and didn't) go the star chart route. I'd calmly praise the skill that they'd learned, rather than the 'favour' they did.

Most kids want to be seen as growing up. So learning how to put the dishwasher on, doing a good job of clearing and wiping the table (and being praised for the quality of their work, not for just doing it).
"You did that job really well" is far more effective than "here's a star for (doing what the rest of us do without comment)"

I get my lot to muck in a bit. The youngest does chores like setting the table, helping to clear the table, sometimes empties dishwasher, brings washing down, cleans her own room (occasionally 🙄), polishes, takes the shoes upstairs that are by the door, helps to tidy up (not all on the same day), but I'd be making a rod for my own back if I did everything for everyone all the time for the rest of their lives. I go by the saying "Don't do for someone what they can do for themselves". That's not to say I don't nurture and care for them, but I am teaching them what it takes to care for themselves and a home, and that we all have to work as a team.

Everything @HappyAsASandboy says and also point out the stuff you do too. Lots of things are invisble to children. They need to know what being an adult is. At 7 they can set the table, you point out that you/Dh have cooked the meal. Everyone takes their plate through to the kitchen, the table gets cleared and wiped down. We had a family dinner every night where we each talked about our day. I am a sahm so that meant my day was described in household tasks so they understood that food needs to be shopped for, clothes washed, bathrooms cleaned and rooms dusted and hoovered/mopped. There was also no way I was raising pampered little princes who thought females did all the chores.

Teach him responsibility for his things, when he was asked to wipe his shoes your answer is because I didn't get them dirty. Explain if your own shoes were dirty you would wipe them. I also didn't carry bags from KS2. In KS1 they had those book bags with no shoulder strap and they both rode scooters so it was easier for me to carry them. Once they could have rucksacks, all them.

I hate this mentality of they are so young, we had children sweep chimneys at 6, now I am not saying child labour is something positive, but children are very capable and need to take responsibility gradually for looking after themselves. After all we are raising them to be functioning adults. Start young, add to it. Google what chores can a 7 year old do. You would be amazed at the suggestions.

I would add to Happy's list, measure out ingredients for dinner, like pasta or rice, fetch items from the fridge or veg drawer, match up socks, put their bedding into the washing machine, measure out detergent/put pod into machine. Load the dishwasher with their items, put the tablet in that. Don't pile everything on him at once, gradually introduce things, that way when he is a teen he is already doing 3/4 of it.

We'll have to agree to disagree @saraclara
I believe in parenting with positive reinforcement & praise & clear expectations.
You don't. No biggie.

My friend was like your mother, did absolutely everything for her children (would still tuck her 18yr old DD into bed every night).
When her 18 DS went to university, despite being very clever academically he didn’t even know how to put a ready meal into the microwave and cook it. 🤦🤷‍♂️

There was a big age gap between me and my youngest brothers and as a teen I did a lot around the house as did DH. We are both soft on our two [11,13]. We want them to have the childhood we didn't. They help out more now and before they leave home they will have all the skills they need to be independent adults but till then we have concentrated on letting them be kids.

My brother and I were brought up doing chores- no dramatics, no rewards...it was just expected and we got on with it. Mom worked FT including 2 evenings; dad worked 7 days a week (self employed). We also worked in our dad's business as soon we were able to. As a result, we have grown into independent, capable adults.

My kids are 10 and 12. They help with chores, and have done since they were 3 and 4. There's a list on the fridge with some daily and weekly tasks- they check what needs doing and tick them off. There are no rewards for helping keep their home clean and tidy. They are very privileged in many other ways (we rarely say no to things they ask for if we can afford it) and being part of a family means we all work together. I'm not their maid!

The options aren't just "do everything for them" and "chuck them aside and let them figure it out themselves"! Those were the 2 options my mum believed in - oh plus "I've showed them once, often in a rush, so they should be able to keep on top of that for the rest of their lives"!

You can model, guide, and be present during the learning curve (which includes not just learning how to do it, but learning TO actually do it). Back off eventually but still check in and encourage every now and then in age appropriate ways

Things I'd expect them to be able to do at 7:

Get dressed
Clean teeth
Lay table
Clean table
Sort items for recycling
Tidy room
Wipe up dishes or empty dishwasher
Put washing in correct baskets
Make bed

I don't mean work them as a slave everyday with all those chores but over the weeks I'd imagine they'd do a bit of everything.

Parents carrying bags and in particularly the kids throwing them at parents is my absolute pet hate.

Because they are your shoes would've been my immediate answer, or because I am not your slave.

I wouldn't expect a 7 year old to do loads but his response to you is a but rude and suggests he thinks you are there to serve him and I would nip that in the bud.

Jobs for a 7y/o - set the table, make their bed in the morning, put clothes in laundry basket when done, hang coat up and put shoes away, pack school bag, tidy away toys they've played with, put their dishes in the dishwasher and unload the dishwasher. My 13y/o gets the additional challenge of trying to change sheets which is hilarious to watch.

My six year old regularly gets himself dressed and undressed, puts dirty laundry in his basket, tidies his toys away and feeds the cats with pouches.

He occasionally helps to cook including chopping, helps to hoover, loves helping to wash the car, and helps with recycling. He has recently started making his bed and arranging his army of teddies some mornings which is cute.

Sorry for the long post, it's hard to know as a parent what the best thing to do is sometimes

Your job as a parent is to enable them to be fully independent and capable adults. (Disability dependent obviously, for the usual mn disclaimer).

You absolutely should be teaching him to do things for himself.

I have 3 kids too. I have always taught them how to do chores which was another job for me when they were young but now they are older it massively pays off.

When they were the ages of your kids it was for fun and we made it fun. It is the actual job of a parent to teach your children the life skills necessary to be an adult. Not doing so is a bit like not teaching them to brush their teeth. It is a teeny bit neglectful and as you are seeing with your brother it impacts them negatively in the long run.

First things first.... you are not your mum. You are your own person. We spend so much of our parenthood worrying about whether or not we are doing the right thing, or if we should be more or less like our own parents. Honestly, you do you!

Secondly, your eldest is only 7. I have a 6 year old, who I'd like to make sure he knows how to do things for himself, how household chores are done etc, but I don't force him to do it all the time. Sometimes he chooses to do those things, sometimes I instantly do it for him, it's natural because we're parents.

Every person and every child is different also. Sounds like you and your brother were bought up the same, and look how you've both gone on different paths. I truly feel that he chooses to be lazy cause it's easier for him. My 6 year old has adhd, so I pick my battles!

They are your children and nobody, not even your husband can tell you how to parent. It sounds like you're doing a great job to me!

This thread has been an eye opener. I have older dc (2 are young adults), youngest is 15 and I feel like I’ve failed her. She’s on the autistic spectrum and I’ve made too many allowances for her. She is utterly dependent on me and does barely anything for herself. I’m trying to turn things round now. But I feel shit about my parenting ☹️

Some of it is about working together. When mine were smaller I would do jobs with them and now they're teens they do them together. It's a bit dull doing stuff on your own when you're still little.

Mine is 2.5. Her job list at the moment is:
Get clothes to get dressed
Dress herself
Put dirty clothes in utility room for washing
Get her cup/bowl/plate/knife fork spoon for meal times
Put her plate/bowl in dishwasher with help
Mop up any spills at table
Tidy her toys with help
Put rubbish in the bin
Helps to chop veg

I was also Brought up doing lots of things for myself- and cooked family meals from about 12 once a week, and cleaned bathroom etc. Children can ways do age appropriate jobs- things that bug me are parents still putting shoes and socks on for 7/8 year olds..