Hug / kiss consent

[GT22]

Seeing this pop up on my Facebook a lot lately. My DS is nearly turning 1 so I'm assuming I'll start to get this problem soon.
We are going to tell DS that it is okay to refuse kisses and hugs and encourage high 5's if that's what he is more comfortable with. I'm just wondering what other parents usually do when a family member or friend is really encouraging on hugs and kisses.
So for example if DS said "no" and then said family member done the old "aw but I'm sad now you've made me upset" to try and trick them into it. How do you respond to that and tell that person not to be so entitled?

I remember my great granny squeezing me so tight it hurt to stop me wriggling away for a cuddle.

You have to be your child's advocate.

I tend to use the phrases, in this order if the family member isn't getting it

Don't worry Bert, you don't have to hug, how about a high five for Dorris.

Dorris, Bert isn't much of a cuddler

Dorris, please stop asking him for a kiss, he really doesn't like it

Dorris , I am trying to teach Bert it is his body and will not be forced into cuddles or kisses.

I usually tell DD that X is just kidding and she doesn't have to kiss or hug them. Only if she wants to. It really annoys me when people do this and I feel really awful..I know they don't mean bad and I don't want them to feel like a pervert but why do they have to say such shit to little kids. It's not cute and it's not funny.

Maybe whoever they are, they do, but the principles of consent are

firstly and fundamentally everyone is in charge of their own bodies. At all moments.

And following on from that, only do something to someone else if you think they also actually want it. And if it turns out not to be the case, or their view changes, listen straight away and stop (and repair if necessary)
If you've met first time that might be a question, medical staff are very good at that As you get to know someone better, you need less formality.

Any kind of formal signed forms between closer family members is just ridiculous missing the point.

I agree with every word that @Wouldloveanother says.

So many strange people out there. Most of them on this thread

I’m imagining all these parents never giving their kids any spontaneous affection 🙁 There must be whole awkward conversations first about whether the child is up for a hug off mum or dad, or a good night kiss.
Thank God we are just normal in our house and people can be affectionate to each other without a fucking song and dance about it.

This exactly this!!

Agreed!

Parent: "Come and give mummy a hug"
Child: "no"
Parent: "ok"

Or
Parent grabs toddler for a hug. Toddler pushes Parent away and says "no hug"
Parent, respecting their boundary, puts them down.

Where's the "fucking song and dance?"

I literally smooch with my children everyday, i kiss them all over their faces and tell them I'm kissing their face off.... when grandma and grandad go in for a cuddle or a kiss it's completely normal because we don't make a big deal about giving consent first.

My children do know that it's not normal for a random person to do this... you can teach consent without making affection between family weird

@johnd2 Doesn't surprise me that some posts are saying grandparents don't need consent.
It's the same dangerous thinking that leads people to consider that husbands don't need consent and martial rape is not a thing.

That's rubbish, there are other ways of teaching children about consent... maybe we should be teaching these future husbands that no means no and not making it a taboo for grandparents to hug and kiss their grandchildren.. absolutely bonkers

What would you do if your DC asked you to stop?

@FilePhoto I would absolutely stop...in 15 years of being a mum this has never happened. We cuddle, kiss and all get cosy in bed and watch films. It's what we do.
If one of my DC asked me to stop it would ring alarm bells and I would be concerned

In our family it usually goes like:
Relative/friend: Come and give XXX a hug!
Me: do you want to DC?
DS: No
Me: ok then, go play while we chat.
Or something similar. It doesn't need to be a big deal and it's good for them to practise saying no.

If you'd stop you're teaching them consent.

When my dc were small they were the same. I'd "kiss their faces off", "squeeze them until they popped" etc. I don't think they ever said no or asked me to stop. Even now at 17 and 15 them give me a hug if I ask. I still think children should be asked/ given a chance to say no.

And why would someone not wanting kisses raise alarm bells?

@FilePhoto alarm bells for my children specifically, because they love to be kissed and cuddled so if they all of a sudden stopped liking it especially the younger ones, It would be out of character

@FilePhoto for me the asking just seems strange, sort of ruins the moment! If that makes sense.

I understand not all families are big on touch, my mum never cuddled me unless I was upset. I think that's why I am the complete opposite with my DC's

The most effective way to teach consent is by modelling it until they internalise it, not by a "do as I say, not as I do" situation.
The most important thing you can do for both boys and girls is model every day which things they get to decide and which things other people get to decide about themselves. And being as consistent as you can manage.
Then once they are adults they know it without having had special lessons in consent. The more "except grandparents" type special rules you have, the more risk you're exposing your kids to.
Yes, of course necessity regularly overrides the rules, but other people's feelings never overrides the rules.

Another mumsnet alternate universe. Nobody in real life is at all bothered by their in laws hugging and kissing their grandchildren, without signing a consent form first
Yep.
This thread is cray cray 😂

That’s not an example of spontaneous affection. I’m talking about the child who is sad /physically hurt /crying and (if this bonkers thread is to be believed), the parent shouldn’t put their arm around/cuddle or physically comfort in any way without a conversation about consent first. Try that with a 2 year old that has just scraped both knees falling over!
Or how about the child that has just done something amazing and in the joy of the moment the parent hugs them, oooh bad parent eh?? 🙄

No one has said anything close to that

@MissyB1

I’m talking about the child who is sad /physically hurt /crying and (if this bonkers thread is to be believed), the parent shouldn’t put their arm around/cuddle or physically comfort in any way without a conversation about consent first.

Where on the thread has anyone suggested this scenario?

Nowhere!

But surely either physical affection requires consent, or it doesn’t? Where do you draw the line? And why?

We implement body autonomy in real life with my 5 year old and have done since the age of roughly 2 although I do think it should have just been something we always did. It was spurred on by something that made on me uncomfortable to witness and DH agreed with.

Children are statistically more likely to be abused by someone close to them so it makes sense to put those boundaries in place.

We've never had a conversation with anyone else about it other than to DD when leaving and we say "say goodbye (as DD has seen us modelling goodbye as a wave, hug and/or kiss) or "would you like to give X a hug?" if she chooses to just say goodbye with no hug or kiss then we shrug it off and say, how about a high five? Had MIL say "oh go on" or something similar once and I just said she wasn't feeling it today, it wasn't a big drama.

Well plenty of people on this thread are saying that physical affection shouldn’t be given without consent? 🤷‍♀️

Instead of telling the adult not to kiss them, encourage your child to say no thank you in the moment. "Why don't you high five nanny instead X?" If the adult pushes it say "he doesn't really like giving cuddles like that"