Hesitant to have another baby with current Russian threat?

[sm2510]

Possibly a bit daft but would the current Ukraine/Russia situation make you think again about having another baby? I have 2 dc (5 and 3) and have been thinking about having a third, but the current situation is making me anxious about the future and the thought of being pregnant if things get worse over here really frightens me. I guess my fear is not being able to access the care I’d need (I’d need a c section as I’ve had 2 already) if things really kicked off here. Am I being completely ridiculous?!

Not being able to stay in one room in a Premier Inn ( you get my drift, other hotels exist) was a factor for me along with other similar very practical things for stopping at 2.

I can't believe all those irresponsible people who insisted on having children between 1947 and 1990.

@Whatinthelord

Why is it people think 3 is wrong but 2 ok? Bizarre.

Because 2 children between 2 people doesn't increase population. It levels it. A 3rd child is a 50% increase. Technically.

( however I do think if you want 3 kids then go for it. The same people saying it's irresponsible probably drive unnecessary journeys, buy single use plastic - and go abroad for a holiday)

Ukraine, no. The economy, yes. Everything is eye wateringly expensive. I can’t see it getting any better in the short term. Affording our mortgage, food, heating, petrol, nursery fees & the kids after school activities is going to get very tight .. but hopefully doable as we only have 2..

Brutus if you are in your 20s, 30s or early 40s I would, yes. Quietly of course, purely in my head so you'd never know.

Not sure how to do the quote thing but........ 'no one NEEDS children'..... Well we do actually otherwise humans would become extinct🙄 and the reproduction rate in this country is way below 2 per couple, I think I read 1.4, so if we are talking just replacing everybody, not increasing the population, then somebody has to have three!

2 maximum, one in one out, just replace yourselves. Russia wouldn't be bothering me anything like as much as environmental catastrophe though.

Well we do actually otherwise humans would become extinct

Given the current state of affairs that would be no bad thing quite honestly

When my mum was at school they used to do bomb drills in case Russia attacked Britain. They were very scared. All that fear, for all those children - unnecessary.

Live your life, have your baby. The real disasters are usually those you don’t see coming.

@AmbushedByCake1

Having more than two kids isn't socially responsible.

I don’t think it’s as irresponsible as everyone goes on about, based on the declining fertility rates as explained in this article. www.bbc.com/news/health-53409521.amp

Who is going to be picking up the bill with an ageing population and a decline in babies being born?

Do what suits you op, but i wouldn’t let your decision be based on Russia/Ukraine.

@BrutusMcDogface

I hate threads like this. We have four. Do people judge us for not being socially responsible?

Yes, why not?

@Mossstitch

Not sure how to do the quote thing but........ 'no one NEEDS children'..... Well we do actually otherwise humans would become extinct🙄 and the reproduction rate in this country is way below 2 per couple, I think I read 1.4, so if we are talking just replacing everybody, not increasing the population, then somebody has to have three!

Immigration can cover that.

The key thing is to look at it from the child's perspective. How can you bring a child into the world as it is and (worse) will be just because you fancy it for yourselves and your current children?

“Because 2 children between 2 people doesn't increase population. It levels it.
A 3rd child is a 50% increase.
Technically.”

Yea I don’t buy that argument. Firstly because obviously some people don’t have any children, so if the goal would be to maintain the current population some would need to have more. Secondly if, as many people state, their concern is for the environment then why try to maintain current population, why not try to reduce it and tell people to only have 1 child?

Personally I think it’s all BS moralising. Hopefully all these people concerned about people having more than 2 children are driving their kids to school in 4x4s and flying off for skiing holidays.

Birth rates are declining globally. It's well documented. I don't think OP having a third child is going to cause an environmental catastrophe. I totally get things are uncertain right now but maybe that's part of being an adult, we are more aware. In our lifetime, climate threat (or the ozone layer as it once was) has always been an issue. Just like there has never been world peace. We can all do our bit and we must, but guilt tripping people for enjoying a bigger family is just uncalled for.

Spiralling costs would put me off trying for a baby at the moment (although that would be theoretically as far too old now). I do look at the world that DS is growing up in and worry what it will be like when he is my age and I am long gone

@BrutusMcDogface

I hate threads like this. We have four. Do people judge us for not being socially responsible?

In the nicest way possible, yes.

Yes

You don’t need anymore children you have two

Why not think about the environment rather than a war

If you were childless, I would say that you only get one life. You have two children and you need to worry about their future and welfare. The economy is tanking. Unless you are part of the 1%, adding another seems crazy.

I work in the climate industry and the UK population is in decline, OP having 3 or 4 children isn’t going to impact climate change. Of course if everyone had 4 children that would be a different story, but the reality is we aren’t having enough children to replace ourselves, and this is due to social shifts rather than concern for the environment - so people on their high horse about their small family should probably hop off.

The occasional family having more than 2 isn’t a a major issue right now so you can proceed guilt free if this is your preference and you can afford to give 3+ children a happy childhood and a good start in life, both in time and money.

@Whatinthelord Well the basic point is that 3 is more than 2 isn't it. The social goal isn't necessarily to have 2 kids, rather that it's the maximum that is seen as socially acceptable these days. Not my opinion but that's how it is.

Does everyone on this thread saying how irresponsible it is to have a 3rd child live a very ecologically friendly life?
Drive electric cars or not drive at all. Walk all the school runs.
Not eat meat at all as that is one of the biggest factors that could help climate change.
Not go on planes.
Etc etc etc.
Whilst growing the population obviously impacts the environment it's the people on this planet now plus the huge cooperations we have now that aren't doing there bit. Stop telling other people how to live their lives meanwhile I can bet your life choices aren't clean cut but yet telling other people to live a certain way is just beggars belief.

Mumsnet hypocrisy at its finest.
Obviously you will all be on to tell me what eco friendly angels you are now 😇

@sunshineamongsttheshitstorm

Does everyone on this thread saying how irresponsible it is to have a 3rd child live a very ecologically friendly life? Drive electric cars or not drive at all. Walk all the school runs. Not eat meat at all as that is one of the biggest factors that could help climate change. Not go on planes. Etc etc etc. Whilst growing the population obviously impacts the environment it's the people on this planet now plus the huge cooperations we have now that aren't doing there bit. Stop telling other people how to live their lives meanwhile I can bet your life choices aren't clean cut but yet telling other people to live a certain way is just beggars belief.

Mumsnet hypocrisy at its finest.
Obviously you will all be on to tell me what eco friendly angels you are now 😇

This

I have 3 if I want a 4th I'll have one

I work full time. Am a higher rate tax payer have one car don't take foreign holidays - bet many eco virtue signalling "I'm not having kids/only having 1 because of the environment" can't say the same

In any even with the amount of childfree by choice people these days our birth rate is actually below that required to sustain western economies so some of us need to keep the numbers up and have kids who will work to pay your pensions one day

You're welcome 😉

Yes, Brutus, of course. Same as I get judged for not inflicting life on someone to suffer existence on a planet in its death throes caused by humans over breeding.

(Whoever mentioned plastic/flights etc.-nah, making a person exist is the worst thing, by incomparable margins that a person can do to the environment. ‘Catastrophic, unprecedented and irreversible climate change’ isn’t something I’d appreciate being forced to exist in, the upcoming decades are going to be awful)

I feel the same OP, and for other reasons people have mentioned (climate change being the main one). I have one baby, he is 6 months old and I feel so guilty bringing him into the world even though obviously I was aware of climate change before I had him...I'd love a sibling for him but I don't think I could do it.